AIBU for calling off marriage for good without proposal after 4 years?

[gingerandpeppermint]

Its my four year anniversary with my partner this weekend.
Im 33, my boyfriend 31.

This is the happiest I've ever been; I have never loved anyone more than this calm, cool, easygoing yet passionate, patient, loyal, funny, handsome, interesting and genuine person. I am so in love. We only moved in this year after the 3 yr mark and its been working out well. We haven't ever had a true 'fight' and generally sort micro issues out there and then. If I'm honest theres only one true fight we have which I've given up on now ; engagement. Nobody else has ever come into our relationship.

I was really surprised to learn that 2 yrs ago when my boyfriend was at a stag do and his friends drunk called me to say hi, his best friend said "hey, you better tell your man IM gonna be HIS best man at YOUR wedding!!!!!!". I felt so excited by this idea as I always thought a 2 yr mark would be ideal if you know youre with "the one". But to my horror I brought it up with him the next day and he said "yeah..im DEFINITELY not ready for THAT"... my boyfriends friends (who ive now inherited as my own) told me he is very "to the book". He was always a Mummy's boy too, following whatever his parents did (they were engaged after five yrs of dating but met at 20!).

The argument was brought up every few months as I saw our friends get engaged within 1-3 years and our last anniversary was awful! I was PMSing and a couple next to us in the posh restaurant looked like they were about to get engaged and I cracked. I told him 3 years was a LONG time not to be engaged and that knowing him with his very long timeline, we wouldn't even be married until I hit 40.

I cant lie, seeing him finally move out of his family house and move in with me has made me realise he DOES want a future. He asked that we open up a bank account together and he has been looking for houses. Quite frankly i feel like he is the one putting in the effort now. We continuously talk about our kids names and it seems he wants kids before marriage merely because the people in our city REALLY milk the wedding. Im talking big, glamour, whitest weddings. I understand that this would be the penultimate stressor.

I dont believe I'd be excited when he proposes now. Its like the novelty has worn off and I have told him that if we're not engaged by next year, I will never marry him. He seemed terribly devastated by this and I felt guilty but reminded him that this relationship isnt on his timeline only.
Honestly, his blasé attitude has put me off having children with him as he doesnt seem to understand im already in peri and most likely wont want a baby after 35.

Im anxious.
I love this man so much but worry how pathetic I'll feel announcing our 4 yr anniversary knowing we're not one step closer to being married. I feel embarrassed also being the older one in the relationship.
I do not want to end this and wonder if it is a step too extreme to completely write off marriage with him as at this point I will clearly be in my mid to late thirties when we actually do it.

There is a small glimmer of hope in me that it may happen this weekend but it feels wishful- my boyfriend was asking me about whether we could see my parents before we go away. He also asked abouy my dad's new job and his scheduled breaks in particular which he never does. He also asked if we could go "very fancy" to the restaurant and suggested I get my hair and nails done the day before which he hasn't done previously but im not holding my breath.

Advice? Thoughts?

You seem needy and nervous about this all OP, I am not being insensitive to your wants but all these timelines and comparing with others is unhealthy.
What will be will be.

This thread smells of attention seeking.

Trying to whip everyone up in to a frenzy with
your faux “I’m nervous” post because he’s asking about your dad’s work schedules and now you can keep coming back to update everyone on the anniversary weekend where you will no doubt receive a wonderful proposal after he’s gotten your dad’s permission and you’ve coincidentally had your nails done too…… 🥱

Dad's permission 😱? What?
Is it 1850?.

This.
Dont have children without being married unless you are a much much higher earner than him.

pregnancy, children, child care etc are hell for your pension and career and it will not recover
his meanwhile starts to fly

so marriage is a must. Tell him hey John we need to talk about marriage and kids and get on the same page.

I dont want or need a big proposal - this is huge and stressful and I dont want that. Please let’s just have an equal discussion as equal people. Men don’t need to propose or buy a certain ring etc and I’d rather have a small wedding and put the money towards our house. Etc

It sounds as if you're getting twisted up about proposals, engagements and big fancy weddings. These are not the important things, you don't have to follow the same path or timeline as other people. You want marriage and children (this order will be best) and you want this with him. Take the initiative.

@LochKatrine You say that - our soon to be son-in-law told us he intended to propose to our DD. I won’t forget that. He didn’t ask permission but his attitude towards us really confirmed he was perfect for DD. He booked a weekend away and proposed to dd. He chose the ring. DD rather thought this was coming and they both wanted marriage. I’d not wait for him in this scenario though. Start talking about rings you like! Be far more proactive!

If he’s looking at buying a house and you get along, this relationship is moving in the right direction.

What does he think about kids, given your age? Maybe that is the conversation to have. Will you both work, full time, part time? You could as part of that reasonably say you don’t want to have a child unless married.

Have you talked about what kind of wedding HE might want? And why marriage is important to you?

Does he understand it’s commitment you want, rather than a massive showy day? It might be that (and the expense) that is putting him off.

If it’s just the wedding that’s important to you, he’s right to be circumspect.

It’s hard - marriage (not a wedding) was important to me as well. Fortunately my husband felt the same.

I have no idea what the relationship between your DD and her husband is. I wouldn't like someone to choose a ring or speak to parents before me, but each to their own.

You need to calm down. You’ve been together 4 years - not 14.

In fairness though, if you want children, and sensibly want to be married before having them, there's only so long you can wait really.

is the house rented? Because if you own it I would think very seriously whether marriage is the right step- should you split you may have to hand him half your house.
marriage is only good for the person with fewer assets or career potential.

This is a very important point - the marriage is a legal contract and does come with implications- if you do want kids marry is usually a good idea but if you are one with assests it may not be.

So far a perfect relationship @LochKatrine We found it considerate. Her knew her ring taste. I think she “knew” it was on the cards. She’s a divorce barrister so pre nup drawn up.

Ok.

You sound a bit too focused on engagements. If you do want kids and think you're approaching menopause you really should assess the priorities in your relationship.

Plenty of people plan for babies before marriage, or babies before buying a house. Think about if having a biological child is the priority and discuss this with your partner - if you can financially support the baby first, you need not save all your money for the house, the big wedding etc. A long engagment is fine. Renting a house is also fine. Consider what your priorities are here.

Yes, I think that's fair enough. It's also fine to assert yourself and be clear about this; not passively waiting for the gift from the man.
At least then you know where you stand, OP.

This sounds slightly unhinged. It’s giving ‘he didn’t organised a videographer to capture the proposal’ vibes tbh.

At the bottom of OP’s original post she talks about how her boyfriend has been asking about her dad’s work schedules, when he’ll be off, can they go and visit her parents before the anniversary weekend etc.

Obviously implying he intends to ask her dad for permission to propose.

She might be ??

and it seems he wants kids before marriage merely because the people in our city REALLY milk the wedding

1. don’t get pregnant & have kids before getting married.
2. a big wedding is a luxury, not a necessity. If this is the problem or concern for him (or you) compromise & prioritise.

Why are you nervous ? I don’t understand?

Well no-one wants a roast without all the trimmings!

You could get another half dozen SM posts out of the pre-proposal!

I'm being a bit snide: I actually think it's rather nice, though I'd probably ask for their blessing rather than permission. It takes a lot to be a parent and I think it's nice to show you hope they are happy and on board.

Calling off marriage - odd turn of phrase. You can call off a marriage only after a proposal, engagement, invitations sent out, paid and booked venue. Then you can call off and start cancelling everything, no?

There seems to be a lot of focus on what other people think and how other people do things. Honestly, why do you care about that?
If you want to get engaged now and he doesn't, you'll need to make a decision about whether to continue in the relationship or not.

Honestly, his blasé attitude has put me off having children with him as he doesnt seem to understand im already in peri and most likely wont want a baby after 35.

I'm not sure I understand this.

Being in peri (at 33) and wanting a baby after 35 are two different things.

Do you have irregular periods? Have you had any checks if that's what's going on?

FWIW I have two friends, both got married at 36 and both had two children before 40.

I had a rational conversation with my now husband about marriage when we were just dating, but I didn't 'propose' to him. I doubt there are many men who would be anything but mortified by being proposed to by a woman. You can be offended by that all you want, it's still so.