AIBU for calling off marriage for good without proposal after 4 years?

[gingerandpeppermint]

Its my four year anniversary with my partner this weekend.
Im 33, my boyfriend 31.

This is the happiest I've ever been; I have never loved anyone more than this calm, cool, easygoing yet passionate, patient, loyal, funny, handsome, interesting and genuine person. I am so in love. We only moved in this year after the 3 yr mark and its been working out well. We haven't ever had a true 'fight' and generally sort micro issues out there and then. If I'm honest theres only one true fight we have which I've given up on now ; engagement. Nobody else has ever come into our relationship.

I was really surprised to learn that 2 yrs ago when my boyfriend was at a stag do and his friends drunk called me to say hi, his best friend said "hey, you better tell your man IM gonna be HIS best man at YOUR wedding!!!!!!". I felt so excited by this idea as I always thought a 2 yr mark would be ideal if you know youre with "the one". But to my horror I brought it up with him the next day and he said "yeah..im DEFINITELY not ready for THAT"... my boyfriends friends (who ive now inherited as my own) told me he is very "to the book". He was always a Mummy's boy too, following whatever his parents did (they were engaged after five yrs of dating but met at 20!).

The argument was brought up every few months as I saw our friends get engaged within 1-3 years and our last anniversary was awful! I was PMSing and a couple next to us in the posh restaurant looked like they were about to get engaged and I cracked. I told him 3 years was a LONG time not to be engaged and that knowing him with his very long timeline, we wouldn't even be married until I hit 40.

I cant lie, seeing him finally move out of his family house and move in with me has made me realise he DOES want a future. He asked that we open up a bank account together and he has been looking for houses. Quite frankly i feel like he is the one putting in the effort now. We continuously talk about our kids names and it seems he wants kids before marriage merely because the people in our city REALLY milk the wedding. Im talking big, glamour, whitest weddings. I understand that this would be the penultimate stressor.

I dont believe I'd be excited when he proposes now. Its like the novelty has worn off and I have told him that if we're not engaged by next year, I will never marry him. He seemed terribly devastated by this and I felt guilty but reminded him that this relationship isnt on his timeline only.
Honestly, his blasé attitude has put me off having children with him as he doesnt seem to understand im already in peri and most likely wont want a baby after 35.

Im anxious.
I love this man so much but worry how pathetic I'll feel announcing our 4 yr anniversary knowing we're not one step closer to being married. I feel embarrassed also being the older one in the relationship.
I do not want to end this and wonder if it is a step too extreme to completely write off marriage with him as at this point I will clearly be in my mid to late thirties when we actually do it.

There is a small glimmer of hope in me that it may happen this weekend but it feels wishful- my boyfriend was asking me about whether we could see my parents before we go away. He also asked abouy my dad's new job and his scheduled breaks in particular which he never does. He also asked if we could go "very fancy" to the restaurant and suggested I get my hair and nails done the day before which he hasn't done previously but im not holding my breath.

Advice? Thoughts?

I disagree with the ‘why not propose to him’ philosophy, not because I don’t think women can propose, but because I don’t believe it solves the real problem.

This couple has discussed marriage. Many couples do and agree that they are moving towards marriage. This couple has repeatedly had the discussion and come up with a different answer.

The reality is that if he wanted to be married, the two of you would be engaged and planning a wedding. Proposing may force his hand, but it won’t give you a lifelong successful marriage. It’s more likely to end in divorce.

Either couple can propose. It’s just that it is typically done when there have been enthusiastic pre-proposal
conversations.

Based on OPs posts, I think she lives in Liverpool.

Fuck me OP, give it a rest - even if he proposes this weekend you’ll know it’s because you forced him to and not because he wanted to.

This way resentment lies if you force it

"We continuously talk about our kids names and it seems he wants kids before marriage merely because the people in our city REALLY milk the wedding. Im talking big, glamour, whitest weddings. I understand that this would be the penultimate stressor."
Who give a stuff what "the people in our city" do? No 'they' don't! Some do. It isn't compulsory. What do you want? What does he want? That's what you do, what you yourselves want. It's a marriage, not a wedding!

As to children before marriage - that a big 'no' to me. As I told my husband of 28 years. Father of my son. But we didn't continuously talk about it, we certainly never discussed names until I was several months pregnant, so what is that all about? Stop discussing names and start discussing that the clock is ticking and he needs to piss or get off the pot.

And you also need to make some decisions and stop being so passive. Do you want children? Do you want children more than you want him? Do you want to forgo children and stay with this ditherer, kiss your fertility goodbye and then see him wander into the sunset with a younger woman because he's finally decide that now is the right time (which is always a possibility with such men)?

So do I. I've never felt more "foreign" than I did there. It's not that they weren't friendly, they were, but it was another world to me.

That said, there must be loads of people there who don't have massive white weddings, it's just that those who are obsessed with how thing look on SM do.

Honestly you sound like hard work, calm down, and you're NOT in peri FFS 😆🤣

It seems almost, op as if you are focusing on all the bits that don't matter at the expense of the bits that DO.

Far more important than baby names is the discussion of whether he even WANTS a baby. And if he does, then the discussion of timing is easily accessed from that standpoint. The name is the top dressing.

I could have written this 15 years ago. He did propose in the end, but I never truly believed his heart was in it and I didn't enjoy the moment tbh, even though he put effort in. It was crushing to feel like I was more invested than him. I said yes but we broke up before the wedding.

It was never an option for me to buy a house or have a baby before marriage. If marriage is very important to you then I personally wouldn't do those first.

With hindsight there were other issues in our relationship anyway which I wasn't open to dealing with, because I loved him.

My experience since then is that if a man wants to marry someone they crack on with it.

I agree with this.

I don't see any point in a woman - or anyone, in fact - proposing because they know the other doesn't want to get married.'

i can see the rationale more if it is used as a reason for not waiting for him to advance things when the general idea is mutually embraced.

I'd wait for this weekend to be over because it does sound as though he's building up to something.

If the proposal doesn't materialise then be clear with him that children before marriage isn't something you want (once they have the kids they often feel there's no need) and that at 33, if he wants you to be the mother of his children, he needs to get a move on.

If the proposal doesn't materialise happen, say yes (if it's what you still want) but with the condition the wedding happens by next summer. Don't be fobbed off with a long engagement, or talked into having kids first as "you're engaged now".

I understand that this would be the penultimate stressor."

And, no, op this is not the penultimate stressor.

I think you mean the ultimate maybe?

But the ultimate stress is being in a marriage with young dependants and the relationship coming unstuck. From there the financial pressures are not about how many wine options to offer guests, or how many practices for your hair so it looks just right on the day, but rather how to put food on the table and a roof over their head, or manage SEN issues, and how to navigate that with someone who you don't communicate well with and who is now having an affair because he never wanted all the drab homeliness of marriage anyway.

At that point, neither the name of your dc nor the name of your wedding dress designer really matters at all ...

Make sure the foundations are solid op, and don't rush that part of the build because you've already chosen the curtains.

Ignore the posters saying propose to him- don't do that. It's not an option. You'll cheaper yourself, make yourself look desperate and it won't be the same.

No, it's a suggestion. Just waiting for the man to propose is so passive, taking the initiative isn't "cheaper", it's just different. Preferable to the decision of marriage being entirely in the gift of the man that women have to wait nicely for

You know you don’t have to “announce” it is your four year anniversary, don’t you?
As a PP has said directly & many have hinted - calm down. Please.

if you want kids, sort out your priorities. You're 33 and think you're in peri. cart before the horse.

You sound a bit immature and entitled like the proposal is another commodity to be posted about on social media or a talking point with your friends.

The fact you’ve mentioned friends and others getting engaged only further highlights that you have envy and resentment.

And yet you said this guy makes you happy so why not give him a bit more time. Everything has to be rushed these days and no patience.

You’re not calling it off though, you’re trying to threaten and manipulate him into marrying you, and are deeply hopeful he will ask on your anniversary. I’d at least be honest. Anything else is really Immature,

The proposal is usually the result of a lot of micro conversations in which a couple discuss their hopes/dreams for the future, timelines, everything they would like to achieve in their lives and with whom. Just part of getting to know a person. If getting married is the one thing you can't openly discuss and you have to wait for this official proposal, doesn't that feel like something's missing? Just get used to talking to your partner and then you'll have the answers, and if there's a mismatch you'll figure it out together if there's any longevity in the relationship. Consider it practice for a life with that person.

If you are genuinely in peri and want a family, then surely your priorities would be to have children first?

You can get married at any time! There is nothing embarrassing about not being engaged after 4 years.

I think there is something red flagish about a man who thinks everything is on his timeline.
Ok, but it would put me off.

No way would i be having children with a man not prepared to enthusiastically marry me pre children, when i have made it clear marriage is a precursor to children.

I think only women with self esteem issues compromise on this in the hope he will come around to the idea.
Its a MN thing I read of, but have not come across it in real life.

It's ok if a man doesn't wish to marry, but absolutely no way is it a good idea to compromise on this and then have children.
Madness in my view.

Start thinking honestly about what you want and your boundaries are on this.

Has a doctor confirmed that you're in peri? You do seem young.

I don't think it's a bad idea for the woman to propose in every case, but I don't think it would be a good idea in this particular case.

If you're already in peri you CAN'T wait!

Drag him to a fertility clinic and let him hear the message loud and clear from a professional.

If that doesn't spark the urgency in him then I'd end it. You can't let his nonchalance or stubborn attitude to timings rob you of your chance at motherhood if it's something you really want.

You don't need to be married to have kids and you don't need a huge wedding because everyone else had one.

I wouldn’t have children without being married.

You can just elope or have a tiny wedding.

Of course. Only men can make a decision about a woman's future.

My sister was vastly disappointed when her future married life was the exact same as her non married life but a bit less money in the account