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Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Handhold please- exH marrying OW and my DDs will be flower girls at the wedding

401 replies

Mensuckbigtime · Today 07:11

When does the pain stop?
it’d been 4 years, but I am constantly reminded of what he’s done as we have two DDs together- I have to smile when they tell me stories about her, pretend that I don’t mind. It’s absolutely awful

now DD has told me that they’re getting married and she and sister will be flower girls.

I know it’s well within his „rights“ to do so. But the thought of our girls being flower girls while he’s marrying the woman he betrayed me with- is killing me

How am I ever supposed to heal and get over this, if I have to have contact with him and OW spends loads of time with the girls?

it’d like the wound can never heal and I feel stuck in a life I didn’t choose or want

OP posts:
cloudtreecarpet · Today 14:47

Pinkrosesforme · Today 14:26

"Because it's using his children to get back at him"

Why is it "getting back at him" to suggest he acts like a father?

It seems to me, he's putting his kids on display like performing seals and then wants them whisked away when they have done their bit. That's using them as window-dressing and it isn't nice.

It's fine if it's organised between the parents themselves but pp have been suggesting more or less dumping the children on him with no discussion or agreement which is not helpful or the same thing.
Of course he needs to do his share, I'm not going to argue with that, but there are sensible ways of doing these things that don't use the children as pawns.

Anyway, the OP sounds like she will be making mature decisions around this & will have it sorted in the children's interests.

cloudtreecarpet · Today 14:51

Mensuckbigtime · Today 14:31

Just to reiterate- I won’t stop the girls from going to that wedding

Knowing they will be there, will hurt me, but hey ho, I’ve survived worse and will continue to try and minimise the effect this mess has on them

but by god do I hate him for putting us in this mess

and now please call me „bitter“

😂

Good for you, OP, it's incredibly painful for you but you are acting with dignity.

outerspacepotato · Today 14:52

Mensuckbigtime · Today 14:31

Just to reiterate- I won’t stop the girls from going to that wedding

Knowing they will be there, will hurt me, but hey ho, I’ve survived worse and will continue to try and minimise the effect this mess has on them

but by god do I hate him for putting us in this mess

and now please call me „bitter“

😂

He's moving on with no consequences for cheating and breaking up your family and it's ok to feel badly about that. He was wrong asking your kids to keep a secret from you, much less something so major and you really need to text him about that. I think in person wouldn't:y be a good idea because your feelings are running so high right now.

But to hold so much resentment for nearly half a decade and hurt so when he takes a major life step, that keeps you tied to him. He is still very present in your headspace while the same is not true for him.

Those saying to weaponize the kids against him and withhold them from going to the wedding don't have your kids best interests in mind, their priority is to see the cheating ex hurt.

Do you want to move on or hang on?

Pinkrosesforme · Today 14:57

BeaRightThere · Today 14:36

Wishing ill health and misery on people for the crime of ending a relationship badly is pretty vile imo

No-one has actually said that.

Are you the OW, AKA the Mrs Mensuckbigtime to be, because it sounds like it !

grumpygrape · Today 14:59

ChiefCookandBottlewasher7 · Today 14:31

Being flower girls is not the least of it, it is the most of it. It is participating in the celebration of treachery and being taught, from such an early age, that vows and family means nothing, as long as you 'fall in love with a new lady'. It would be a firm 'no' from me, with an explanation, that your father left us as a family and are you happy to celebrate it? I would say 'go and stay with him when it is his 50% custody', but to participate in the celebration of treachery? What does it teach the girls? Suck it up and put a happy face when you own family is destroyed by the abandoner? Seriously?

When they will go and stay with him on his days, it will not be normal life, albeit interrupted, but not a celebration.

I don’t think 8 and 5 are appropriate ages to introduce the concept of celebrating treachery. They will find out in the future at an appropriate age why their father left but until and after then they have a right to have a relationship with him.

I don’t think OP has said what the ratio of time spent with is but if it during a significant period of time they spend with him then he should be making plans for them to be involved dring the preparation and aftermath of the event.

Yournevertooldtolovehamsters · Today 15:00

You have every right to express your emotions, children understand many complex things, this includes the ability to see their mother crying and being upset in exceptional circumstances. Give them credit to feel empathy for their mum, ( who according to their post, didn't bad mouth the father, just cried) they must of hurt too from their father's infidelity.

SummerDive · Today 15:03

This thread is like many others on MN. Plenty of ‘shouod’. Plenty of blame fir being human - no woman is ever allowed to be human and not react the ‘perfect and appropriate way’.

It’s a standard that is simply impossible to attain. And none of the posters blaming the OP have ever managed to be what theyre expecting her to be either. I suppose it must make them feel better to reflect their own issues on others maybe??

@Mensuckbigtime you did your best.
Carry on showing up for your dcs. Carry on showing up for yourself too.

My only advice would be, now that things are a bit more stable financially, routine wise etc… would be to concentrate on yourself and to heal your hurt. For YOURSELF. Not to be able to say ‘look I’ve moved on’ to others (and your ex). Not because that’s what you’re supposed to do. But just for yourself and stop all those ‘secondary/rippled hurts.

SunshineOnARainyLeith · Today 15:04

Have you read Tracy Schorn's blog chumplady.com and her book Leave a Cheater Gain a Life? Lots of practical advice on navigating this shit-show including when you have kids. The aim is that you come through the other side happier (minus a fuck-wit is how she describes it). Very very funny too, as well as supportive. She has an AMA on youtube plus regular podcasts on Tell Me How You're Mighty (your story would make a great episode!). Xx

ThatCyanCat · Today 15:06

SunshineOnARainyLeith · Today 15:04

Have you read Tracy Schorn's blog chumplady.com and her book Leave a Cheater Gain a Life? Lots of practical advice on navigating this shit-show including when you have kids. The aim is that you come through the other side happier (minus a fuck-wit is how she describes it). Very very funny too, as well as supportive. She has an AMA on youtube plus regular podcasts on Tell Me How You're Mighty (your story would make a great episode!). Xx

Not sure it's relevant here? The marriage is already over and there's no need for there to be any shitshow at all over the children being flower girls.

user134913049923 · Today 15:09

This is a shitty situation and you are in a form of grief for a life lost. You will get over it eventually but it will take as long as it takes so don't worry about people telling you 'you should be over it by now'. They don't know because they are not in your exact situation. Every person and every relationship and every relationship breakdown is different.

If you want to protect yourself, you can take steps to minimise any kind of contact and interaction with him and the OW.

You may also be worrying unnecessarily about extent of the OW future interaction with your daughters. How old is the OW and does she have children? If she is younger and wants children, it is likely that your ex will have at least one if not more children with him and when that happens for a period of time, both his and her focus and time will be on the babies rather than your daughters. It may not be the case but if it is - it will give you more time to adjust to this change.

Something that is worth reciting to yourself constantly is that great phrase "Holding on to anger and resentment is like drinking poison and expecting the other person do die."

Sorry you are dealing with this.

Mensuckbigtime · Today 15:11

outerspacepotato · Today 14:52

He's moving on with no consequences for cheating and breaking up your family and it's ok to feel badly about that. He was wrong asking your kids to keep a secret from you, much less something so major and you really need to text him about that. I think in person wouldn't:y be a good idea because your feelings are running so high right now.

But to hold so much resentment for nearly half a decade and hurt so when he takes a major life step, that keeps you tied to him. He is still very present in your headspace while the same is not true for him.

Those saying to weaponize the kids against him and withhold them from going to the wedding don't have your kids best interests in mind, their priority is to see the cheating ex hurt.

Do you want to move on or hang on?

I go by what sex and the city taught me

it takes half the time you spent with someone to get over them

so that makes it 9 years for me, add an affair, an OW and children- I’ll add in a few years for good measure

you can move on and still get hung up on certain things

whats with all the dichotomy

most of the time, I don’t hurt as much

sometimes, like when he asked our children to keep secrets from me and I find out he’s marrying OW- I hurt some more

that doesn’t mean, I’m not also moving on with my life

OP posts:
MixedFeelingsNoFeelings · Today 15:12

It's so hard to be the bigger person in this situation but ultimately the rewards are yours. I thought it might be helpful to give the child's perspective here.

I was a kid of divorced parents and lived with each of them for a number of years. In the few years I was with Mum, she never badmouthed Dad - even though he was the 'leaver' and wrecked her health and security. She always kept her gentleness and sense of humour, and tried her best to make things fun for me.

Dad badmouthed Mum though. Even though he earned ten times more than her and lived in big modern house, he was always complaining to me and my brother about the (average) child maintenance he paid her, the (tiny amounts of) money she took from their joint account as a SAHM... etc. He married his latest OW and they had two babies. He divorced her a year or two after I fetched up.

From the age of 6 I recognised the absolute injustice of all of this and I was always wholeheartedly on Mum's side, though I had to be careful not to say so to him.

If Mum had badmouthed Dad too, I wouldn't have known where to turn. I'd have been in no-mans-land, caught in the crossfire between two angry adults who put their own feelings before mine.

So while it comes from a good motive, I think the argument for sharing your upset, rage and disdain for their Dad with your kids - in the spirit of empowering and not gaslighting them - is misplaced. Of course that doesn't mean going to the other extreme and smiling through the pain like some Stepford Wife. And tbh, in my case, a tiny bit more reality from Mum might have helped.

But that's the tricky course that all parents have to navigate with their DC. And on the whole I'd say that tempering your emotions and modelling a sense of humour and proportion, while acknowledging life's inevitable shit, seems to be a good basis for your own and DC's emotional health.

Sure, I liked that dad could buy me a bike. And I loved the school I went to in the nice suburb where he lived. Same as your DDs will enjoy being flower girls. But apart from that, living with him was unpredictable, scary and grim. Your situation isn't exactly the same of course OP, I'm sure your exH isn't in the same category as my Dad! But what I'm saying is, behaviour will out. Your exH cannot help but reveal his true colours to your girls. And even if they don't talk about it, they'll never forget who makes them feel loved, secure and prioritised, who's always there for them, whose home is more relaxed...

You asked how you get over it OP. The first and biggest step is to admit to yourself that the man you loved turned out to be a Grade A shit. Not your fault, it happens to the most discerning of us(!). It's just life. And once you stop grieving the ghost of the lovely man you married, your life will feel right again.

Pistachiocake · Today 15:18

I am so sorry. It is awful he's done this to you and your kids. And if someone cheats once, they'll probably do it again, so I'd say feel sorry for the new wife. Unlike someone marrying a person they can trust, she KNOWS he lies, cheats, and betrays the woman he swore to be with forever, and their innocent kids. Any time he is late, gets a message from someone she doesn't know...she'll have that anxiety, because she knows what he is. But why feel sorry for someone like her? Anyone who has an affair with a married person is just as bad as the cheater.
Feel sorry for her future kids. And just tell yours the old line about any man who marries his mistress creates a vacancy. Maybe they're too young yet, but tell them to marry decent men/women who don't cause all this pain and suffering.

Mapletree1985 · Today 15:20

Pinkrosesforme · Today 14:26

"Because it's using his children to get back at him"

Why is it "getting back at him" to suggest he acts like a father?

It seems to me, he's putting his kids on display like performing seals and then wants them whisked away when they have done their bit. That's using them as window-dressing and it isn't nice.

Not it isn't nice. This ExH is not nice.

But using the children as tools to "punish" him or "teach" him is also not nice.

The way mum wins at this is by doing all she can to facilitate her DDs flower girl dream and making it a wonderful experience for them. They will remember.

Fernhurst · Today 15:22

Mensuckbigtime · Today 15:11

I go by what sex and the city taught me

it takes half the time you spent with someone to get over them

so that makes it 9 years for me, add an affair, an OW and children- I’ll add in a few years for good measure

you can move on and still get hung up on certain things

whats with all the dichotomy

most of the time, I don’t hurt as much

sometimes, like when he asked our children to keep secrets from me and I find out he’s marrying OW- I hurt some more

that doesn’t mean, I’m not also moving on with my life

For some reason people have strong ideas about how quickly you should be over someone when a marriage either breaks down or ends due to being widowed (in my case.) A marriage wouldn't be worth much if we just forgot the person in a year or two. There's no right way or correct time frame to grieve a marriage ending. However it ends. I agree with you

Mapletree1985 · Today 15:23

Lavenderandbrown · Today 11:02

I wanted to echo @UninitendedShark….my own dear
mum deceased since 2015..believed and witnessed the “marrying of the mistress” to justify all the pain and confusion they caused by imploding other peoples lives.

Im a little surprised by how many MN know happily remarried couples who started as an affair. I can’t think of any right now…
what I have seen is many secondary divorces, affairs within the second marriage, dc whose futures were derailed by the implosion of their nuclear family, an early death of the exH, a murder of the exH by the spouse of his affair partner.
my own exH didn’t marry his affair partner but someone else pretty quickly then cheated repeatedly on her divorced and spent a lot of money on a second contentious. Remarried again and still cheating on her.

And it is often a difficult road for the second/ third wife. Nothing to be envious of

My ex married his affair partner and it has not been happy. They remain together because they have two kids and she is financially dependent on him, but they lead separate lives. The kids - my own kids' siblings - are sweet.

SnappyOpalJoker · Today 15:23

Well OP you have far more grace than I would in a similar situation. I think infidelity to you and your children is cruel and asking them to be flower girls indicates someone without a shred of compassion or sorrow for what your XH has done. He sounds predictably self centred.

You sound a strong amazing human and great mother. I hope you can plan something wonderful over the time of the planned wedding eg go abroad with friends or have an adventure. Prioritise your health peace and happiness. And build a fresh future for you and your family that is infinitely more joyful and full of amazing people than the time that has gone.

Brightlittlecanary · Today 15:26

SnappyOpalJoker · Today 15:23

Well OP you have far more grace than I would in a similar situation. I think infidelity to you and your children is cruel and asking them to be flower girls indicates someone without a shred of compassion or sorrow for what your XH has done. He sounds predictably self centred.

You sound a strong amazing human and great mother. I hope you can plan something wonderful over the time of the planned wedding eg go abroad with friends or have an adventure. Prioritise your health peace and happiness. And build a fresh future for you and your family that is infinitely more joyful and full of amazing people than the time that has gone.

That’s too much, he wasn’t unfaithful to his children, he was unfaithful in his marriage, to the op. People really need to stop trying to weaponise these children, yes the marriage ending impacted them, and no one leaves a happy marriage, as hard as that is for fne op and cheating is never the way, but to say he was unfaithful to his own kids is too far.

the7Vabo · Today 15:33

Brightlittlecanary · Today 15:26

That’s too much, he wasn’t unfaithful to his children, he was unfaithful in his marriage, to the op. People really need to stop trying to weaponise these children, yes the marriage ending impacted them, and no one leaves a happy marriage, as hard as that is for fne op and cheating is never the way, but to say he was unfaithful to his own kids is too far.

Don’t agree. If I walked away from my marriage today it would hugely impact my children. Once you have children IMO your loyalty should be to your family unit, to keep your kids in a stable household with both their parents.

No it’s not infidelity but he took from his kids they life they could have had & that’s no small thing. It has fundamentally changed their lives. They will forever have two homes, have to try to manage their parents etc.

He had 10 years with the OP before DD1. He could have walked before deciding to have her if he didn’t want to be with the OP. But of course he waits until he has 2 kids!! His youngest was tiny!!! They both were!!

Pinkrosesforme · Today 15:34

@MixedFeelingsNoFeelings You asked how you get over it OP. The first and biggest step is to admit to yourself that the man you loved turned out to be a Grade A shit. Not your fault, it happens to the most discerning of us(!). It's just life. And once you stop grieving the ghost of the lovely man you married, your life will feel right again.

This is good advice.
Easy to read but not so easy to apply.
The man you thought you were married to never existed. He was a hologram/fantasy/projection.
He may have misrepresented himself to you.
Or you imbued him with qualities he never had in the first place.
So when he showed his true colours you were devastated.
Either way, it isn't your fault.

You got this OP.
Upward and onward.👏

the7Vabo · Today 15:34

Brightlittlecanary · Today 15:26

That’s too much, he wasn’t unfaithful to his children, he was unfaithful in his marriage, to the op. People really need to stop trying to weaponise these children, yes the marriage ending impacted them, and no one leaves a happy marriage, as hard as that is for fne op and cheating is never the way, but to say he was unfaithful to his own kids is too far.

They had just had baby 2. They were in the thick of it when off he went. The men I work with are taking parents leave, not having affairs!!

MajorProcrastination · Today 15:38

Have you read the Let Them Theory? (I recommend listening to the audiobook on spotify), I think it might help you here. Let them get married and let your daughters have a day getting dressed up and going to the party and all of that but also let you choose to do something you enjoy that weekend with people who you love and will be understanding of the situation. Maybe a city break with your bestie or a spa weekend with your mum.

The good thing is that you're out of the relationship with a cheater. You're free of him and from your follow up posts here it sounds like your acing life.

Rise above, smile and wave, kill it with kindness.

If it helps when talking with your daughters about it, keep the focus on what they will get out of the day - a new pretty outfit, a fancy meal, dancing with I'm guessing their paternal grandparents, cousins etc. But don't make a big deal of it.

I don't know how he's expecting you not to find out. That is very odd.

I've just seen where you've mentioned that you've spoken about it now. Good. Secrets are weird and damaging. Obvs I'm not talking about "we bought your sister a new bike for her birthday but it's a secret" temporary and positive secrets, I'm talking sneaky secrets that you know could cause upset or drama when they're revealed.

Your DDs need to see and know you as an honest open parent and it sounds like you're doing a cracking job of that.

Four years is nothing and I totally get why it still feels raw and hurtful and cruel that they'll have this huge life event celebrating something that broke you and changed your life. BUT like I said, you are free! You don't need or want him! And of course there's bound to a lot of people there who will tut and raise eyebrows behind their backs because that's what people are like. That's not a reflection on you though. Don't engage with that.

I don't know if your daughters will get how much this all hurts now but one day they will know. It's better for them that you keep things calm and civil and all of that even though I'm sure that's not how you feel inside.

He's a cheat. She's marrying a cheat. You're better off without him. You're awesome without him. Your girls are lucky to have you.

Rachelshair · Today 15:43

Four years isn't that long really. It was awful of him not to tell you, before telling the kids. He sounds like a coward, he must have known you'd react strongly and he gave that job to his kids! Telling them to keep it secret, as if they would. But you already know he's a shit, this is just more proof.
I hope the shock wears off soon and it's another step to no longer being upset about him. I don't think "always a cheater"/ "marry a mistress" etc is always true but he sounds like an idiot anyway, so who cares if they are happy or not? Let them. You'll feel indifferent sooner or later and that's a really good place to be.

ReadingSoManyThreads · Today 15:44

You're getting a bit of a hard time on here sadly, especially given your exH is such a cunt.

You've done nothing wrong by shedding a few tears in front of your children, you have not traumatised them, you are human and can express emotions - that's healthy. You were not using your children as emotional crutches, you've done nothing wrong. Some people on MN are nuts.

Anyway, you exH, cheating on you whilst you had a wee baby? What a fucking cunt, is the OW not fucking embarrassed?

You were together for 18yrs and have two young children together, of course this is going to be hard for you. I found it a bit hard when I saw my exH had gotten married (no affair), but he was a very angry man who was extremely violent to me, I didn't want him back but I was quite upset at knowing he'd remarried. Wondering if he was abusing her too, and if not, then why me? etc.

Your thoughts and feelings are what they are, and it's not for anyone to judge you or criticise you for them.

I'd suggest doing something really nice around the time of the wedding, a pleasant distraction, a day out or a few days away, and not spend it wallowing at home on your own.

In your shoes, I'd be pretty fucking bitter knowing that my beautiful daughters were being flower girls for this cheating pair of scumbags. Hopefully when your daughters are old enough to do the maths on the relationship timings, they'll realise what a fucking scumbag their dad is.

outerspacepotato · Today 15:46

whats with all the dichotomy

Because that's life. Things can be multiple things at the same time and due to our own personal biases, we only see parts of the whole and even that can change.

Move on or hang on is about how much mental space you give this after nearly half a decade and staying stuck in a past that's moved on. You asked how to heal.

You said you contacted him about how you feel about the wedding. Maybe write down a burn letter about how you feel about the wedding and burn it.

The keeping secrets from you is a big deal because it affects your children's welfare and is a basic safeguarding no and it's a good thing you addressed that so quickly.