Did he cross my boundaries despite saying he just got carried away?

[SofiaJessica4]

I'm a woman in my late 30s and have been dating a guy for a few weeks, and getting pretty close with lots of feelings involved. On our fifth date, he came to my home for dinner and we ended up in my lounge making out.

I'd explicitly stated before previously that I wanted to wait for sex, I'd said that on the day too, and when we started cuddling/kissing. I said I was open to messing around but no more. At one point he was touching me and I got quite overwhelmed, and had to stop as I was on the point of crying (I have some trauma around sex and sensory issues which he knows).

Around this time he took most of my clothes off, and I didn't understand why as sex was not on the table. Anyway, after I'd calmed down from my overwhelm episode, I gave him a hug, lying on top of him but not moving. I then realised he was trying to go for PIV by stealth without me knowing what was going on, when I got off him immediately. I was pretty shocked by what he was doing to be honest.

I'm not in contact with him now, but we had a discussion the next day and he said lines were blurred and he got carried away. He does have ADHD. I think he knew what he was doing and was chancing it. Especially as I'd been practically in tears 5 minutes earlier, I felt it was clear I didn't want to have sex but was happy to touch a bit but no more.

I find his attitudes around sex quite odd to be honest as he said he needs intimacy to "be reciprocal" ie we're either doing full sex, or nothing - but he didn't communicate this beforehand - and also he said some weird stuff about wanting sex 'to prove I liked him'.

I have autism and I get confused when words and actions misalign. His actions to me say, he's unsafe and he intended to cross my boundaries, but his words say different. Would appreciate some input as I'm getting stuck in my head on it. Obviously there's what I think happened, what he thinks and then reality, but the cognitive dissonance is real right now

I wouldn’t see him again.

No means no wherever you are on the spectrum imo..
My dh is on there and my boundaries are acknowledged and respected..
He needs dumped op

It sounds like the lines were all very blurred. He should not have done what he did. But you also shouldn’t lie naked on top of a man who is sexually excited.

What you think is spot on. He was chancing it and then tried to gaslight you. Thank god you’re not in contact with him any more

hope you’re ok and take this as a lesson to trust yourself more, there’s no cognitive dissonance here, you are exactly right in what you’re thinking so don’t dismiss that, you’ve stayed true to yourself and your boundaries and sussed him out all at once!

Please stay the fuck away from this man.

I have ADHD. It does NOT stop you from reading the room or understanding boundaries.

You’ve experienced SA. You’re allowed to be upset and talk about it.

Well done you. He was pushing his luck. You made it clear that you did not want sex. That said you need to maintain VERY clear boundaries with people you have no real reason trust, fooling around is one thing, no clothes is another.

You did the right thing, but be wary of getting into a situation where things can get out of hand. He certainly falls into the category of rapey fucker vibes.

This is a very common but very dangerous attitude. She said no repeatedly, she said she was happy for sexual contact but she did not want to have sex. It sounds like he then did something to cause her to cry, and then took her clothes off whilst she was crying.
regardless of whatever else was going on at that point a decent man wouldn’t try to slip it in (without protection!)

any decent man I know would be mortified if a woman started crying, and would be focused on making sure she’s ok. This woman repeatedly said and indicated no to sex. Allowing some contact does not mean you have consented to everything. We must credit men with a bit more self control too, a naked woman lying on him doesn’t stop him controlling himself and forcing himself, and if it does he should not have allowed himself to be in that position. There were no blurred lines here.

ADHD is not an excuse for attempted rape sorry.

I think you should not have let him take your clothes off or lay on top of him half naked . Very mixed messages from you . You probably should not see him again .

You REALLY don’t understand how some men operate.

Which is a good thing. Hopefully there’s only a small percentage of the fuckers.

I would trust actions over words. Words mean little if they're not followed through on. It tells me actually that his words can't be trusted

He sounds like a right creep.

And I future, feelings should not be involved in anything that’s a few dates in.

Any man who tries to rush feelings will try to rush other things too.

Be aware of men who want really long dates early on (this can speed up feelings of false intimacy). Be aware of men who overshare their life story (eg: traumas) early on. This is a tactic again to get you to get really close, really fast and, also to get YOU to over share, again, rushing feelings of intimacy. And of course, be aware of any man who doesn’t listen to the word NO.

Of course I do , I have 4 adult sons and 2 x husbands 😂.

Girl, you in danger.

Never speak to him again.

He undressed and tried to have sex with a crying woman that had told him she didn't want to have sex? Yup perfectly normal behaviour from a safe and decent man. 🤨

Sorry to clarify, he was touching me which was wanted. I got overwhelmed and was on the verge of crying so we stopped - that bit was a me thing, not a him thing, it was more sensory overwhelm.
At some point in this (not when I was upset) my clothes mostly came off, but I didn't understand why (!)
The half naked hug was after I'd calmed down. In my head it was a comfort hug, not restarting anything sexual
In previous long relationships I've navigated issues around overwhelm with partners , it is an autism thing for me. And a hug after I'm overwhelmed is normal for me, but of course that was in the context of a committed relationship

Nope. She was quite clear where the line was drawn. He took advantage of her in a distressed state.

@SofiaJessica4 Actions speak louder than words. The disconnect is because your instinct (subconscious) is telling you this, but you can't reconcile that to his words (conscious). If in doubt, instinct is usually right. It's a mechanism that has evolved over millenia to keep you safe.

Also, someone saying you have to have sex with them to prove you like them is a huge red flag. You don't have to do anything you don't want to do to prove anything to anyone.

He shouldn't have took your clothes off when you were crying, that really, really crossed the line.
You did blur the boundaries lying on top of him. If you hadn't been crying, I'd think it understandable if someone mistook that for you initiating sex.

@Lesina Im not crying rape. for one we didn't have sex. I think, and I've told him, that I believe he chanced it, and crossed a line. For me, it felt unsafe and I feel uncomfortable with what happened. I am trying to sort through if he meant to chance it, or if it was a genuine confusion. Perhaps it shouldn't matter to me, but somehow his intent does matter.

I would expect a discussion at a minimum around contraception before sleeping with someone and even possibly STI screening if it was without protection. So for me this situation was way out of my comfort zone.

Then please tell them that when a woman says ‘no’ then it means ‘no’.

And not to undress crying/distressed women and confuse them.

No means no. I do not want to be penetrated means just that. Op is free to do whatever she likes sexually and still have that boundary respected.

This
Applies to both men & women

He doesn't sound a safe man to be around. Undressing you when you had been clear you didn't want sex was a red flag. Trying to get his dick inside you without you knowing is attempted rape. Personally I would dump him and move on.