I think I have to leave my husband

[PlaidJane]

I have had a nice little life the past few years with my DH, we get on well he’s a nice guy generally and we have an enjoyable time together. He’s quite insecure in his looks and not overly confident so I do feel I fall into the pattern of being a bit motherly, you know giving him reassurance. He says a lot of the time that I’m out of his league. This isn’t wildly attractive I’m sure some people would agree and I can find it annoying as I am not that shallow, I want someone who makes me feel loved and is nice that’s all.

I’d say the issue in our relationship up until now is that I feel like I am putting on a perfect persona all the time as he finds it hard to cope with me in any other raw format version. He gets defensive and upset if I have any Big Feelings - even if they aren’t related to him at all. Therefore I don’t share many big or small feelings with him. Hence the plodding along.

Over time I recognise I feel friendly affection for him with our lives tied together in a house and joint assets etc and I wasn’t going to disrupt anything.

I am a people pleaser and I find it so hard to let people down or put myself first.

I have been working on a short term project with another man for some months now which has ended. During this time we got along great, but I didn’t think anything much of it as I knew the project would end and mostly thought just this guy is a nice guy.

I don’t think we spoke emotionally or overshared our personal lives more than normal colleagues, we worked well as a team and had good fun in the process. As the project came to an end and we said goodbye, we both simultaneously appeared to realise we had formed some kind of feelings for each other.

I assume this is what happens to movie stars on film sets or strictly shows, when you spend a lot of time with someone in close proximity. So I’m not sure it’s real at all. I got worried I was in limerance so was working on detachment

We have had one honest in person conversation about this where we shared exactly identical experiences and thoughts about each other - it’s so weird and uncanny. I feel like we just wanted to check we were not going mad and deluded in our own minds? These moments in our minds were totally identical realisations or memories, matched each other in sync. This has never happened to me before. We both admitted we had grown attracted to each other physically but more than that, we liked each others personalities and couldn’t stop thinking about the other. It’s affecting both our sleep and appetites. We have agreed we need to detach because it’s very dangerous

Running off together is ridiculous, this isn’t some big romantic movie, also this is an awful thing to do to my husband. I’d rather be single right now and have none of this hassle I just want to run away from everything and everyone

I think I’m having a midlife crisis of some kind and I have to leave my DH but I don’t know where to even begin to detangle our complex finances. We don’t have any savings and a huge mortgage and the market is terrible right now for selling. I also feel sick at the thought of telling him I’m not romantically in love with him as it would break his heart.

Worse still really he didn’t say anything at the time when I sat down, he just sulked about it, it wasn’t until much later that I got it out of him that he has been annoyed by this. He said oh when you sit down you just ‘opt out’ and it’s unfair. I said sorry, I had already done the majority of the housework there wasn’t much left to do! Did you want me to follow you around watching you hoover? He said no but you should have asked me if I needed help, because that’s a team dynamic. I said wow ok well.. I don’t know what to say surely he’s just going to appreciate what I had done?

He’s also super tight with money and he does this one thing that really has bothered me. I like fizzy drinks. He will never buy cans of drink, only big 2L plastic bottles. This means you can’t ever grab to take a drink out of the house, like for lunch at work, so I have to buy my own cans that I keep in my office because he won’t get cans at home. The big plastic bottle drink is always flat, and takes up loads of space in fridge or someone leaves it out in the side. If I do have a can and leave any drink in the can he will complain about wasting drink. He also complains as I never remember to deflate the empty bottle to save space in the bin. We aren’t skint we can afford the cans.

Well even after I told some family members about the rape, they still weren’t supportive. And still aren’t. Families are complicated. I’d still rather have their lack of support than be stuck in that relationship. I understand you needing to get things off your chest here and it’s great you have somewhere to vent. But the message from (most!) posters isn’t going to change no matter how many examples of his behaviour you share. Most of us on here who recognise this behaviour about can see what we need to see pretty quickly. Most of us have been there. If you are done, then please be firm with everyone that it is over.

@isthatstillthesame I know I think because I feel invalidated every where else this place does help keep me sane. I know I’m not losing my mind. I’ve stuck to my guns so far so I am not doing all bad. I appreciate everyone helping me

Yes, I do understand that it can be difficult to walk away from a controlling situation. Sometimes posters get impatient when OPs don’t LTB quickly enough for their liking and that’s not how I wish to come across. Just keeping up the consistent messaging that it’s ok to say ‘no more’ firmly to your husband and other family members.

The unfortunate truth is that he's a wanker, OP. You've learned this and are beginning to accept it, but others will need more time and might not ever be pepared to see it.

😂

He sounds just awful, no wonder you have the Ick.

But you know, you don't owe anyone a relationship, especially not a sexual intimate relationship. You can walk away for ANY reason.

My sister once dumped a rather nice and kind bf of 2 years because she woke up one day and got a violent case of Ick from seeing his hairy toes peeping out from under the covers.

Of course, it wasn't really the hairy toes - it was the realisation that they were fundamentally incompatible, and that realisation was just happened to be precipitated that morning by the sight of his toes in her bed.

You don't owe your partner - or any man - a relationship.

And you need to put down your foot with your patronising family as well. You're a grown woman, you clearly know what you want here, don't let them flimflam you into staying with this dreadful man.

Unfortunately the shit family to awful partner pathway is a well trodden one. 🙁

In the words of Kate Bush:
"I know you have a little life in you yet
I know you have a lot of strength left"
I'm relieved to sense that in you.

I think you are traumatised but I don't think that you fully understand that after years of being undermined. I have a 4th person I'll mention, a friend of over 33 years who is a little older than I am. She is imho, traumatised by her father. He was in the air force, a senior figure, a military man to the bone. He was stationed in the both the US and Germany. When he died, people came from both the US and Germany to attend. For 33 years I've heard the same types of conversations repeated over and over - "My father used to say..." "My father didn't agree with this..." "Of course you can guess my father's reaction..." "He never..." "He always..." "My father..." "My father..." "My father..." "My father..."

It's an acute stress reaction - her thoughts start running and she can't stop until you halt the conversation abruptly and tell her to change the record. Her father was a domineering man; opinionated, controlling... and from a young teenager she felt she could never do enough or the right thing to earn his respect or affection. She still lives her life like this... doing too much to win everyone over, to gain their approval. She succumbed to ME and was lifeless for 8 years, couldn't work, became equally obsessed about her health, gut biome, spending thousands on private lab work,... she talked incessantly about all of her ailments and theories, ... long story but through her recovery she learned to put herself first - if anything - that was the mechanism of her recovery. Frankly... she's too far gone the other way now but I love her as a friend anyway - I've put up with her trauma talks about her father and her ME for so long now that I'm sure I can hack it going forward - she's in a better place now.

I've read all of your posts and I hear them in the voice of my traumatised friend because that's how they read to me. I don't think you realise how deep you are in the quicksand that is your husband or how difficult or how long it will take you to break free - I just don't think you can see the reality of it, the scale - not the way other people can. IMHO you have been treated horribly, especially over recent weeks.

As I said before I don't think you need to have an explicit conversation with him about what you want or want to happen next - just get on and do it - you're not seeking his agreement are you? You have 2 weeks - what are you going to do with that time?

Hi OP. How is life without him going? (If he is indeed away for 2 weeks and hasn't reappeared) It all sounds so exhausting and I hope you are managing to reclaim some of yourself.

This relationship takes up so much of your mental and emotional energy. It reminds me of the concept of the 'mental load' - usually spoken of in regards to housework and childcare but in your situation you are carrying his emotional load.

Think of all that potential creative energy you could utilise without him. Your family should just butt out. Its not their business and you are not his caregiver. Keep strong.

Thanks for your kind words.

He is still away and he reached out. The language he is using puts me on edge.

Before he went away he spoke to my DD and because I was vague and non committal, DD has decided I am the villain now

He makes a lot of statements about things he doesn’t want. So he doesn’t want me to feel unsafe. He doesn’t want me to feel hurt. He doesn’t want me to feel stressed. He wants a face to face discussion and to make it work.

But I did have all of these experiences. Are they less valid because of the intention behind them? Am I meant to be making excuses that it’s ok if you didn’t have an intention? Am I meant to care what he wants? He might want these things now but he didn’t care or think about them before.

In another life grenade, I reconnected with my colleague from the original post. He had heard about my situation and reached out to me for support (He is single FYI) We have spent some time catching up and talking as platonic friends

As I never go out, my children got all suspicious of my wearabouts and quizzed me and I confessed that I had met up with a man and are now very angry with me, not speaking to me. I don’t have a wide group of friends, meeting up with a man for a coffee isn’t exactly breaking my marriage vows but I do see why this might be hurtful and look bad. I was trying to be honest with them this backfired. I explained DH broke our vows when he was abusive to me and someone is being kind and supportive but they think this is very immoral.

People pleasing doesn’t seem to be going very well for me does it

This is the young adult dd that could afford to pay rent with you if you were to leave the mortgaged family home before you actually divorce/sell the house.

What have you done during the time your husband has been away ? have you spoken to a solicitor / started a divorce on line / had 3 estate agents in to value the house.

Your children have no right to judge or criticize you. They have no “ standing” here in a legal or moral sense.

Just say firmly “my private life is not up for discussion. Its right there in the phrase: PRIVATE life.”

If they bring it up either repeat this ir directly address their behavior “stop bullying me. This is none of your business. I have made my decision and we are not discussing it anymore. If you can’t treat me respectfully you can move out and support yourself.”

As I never go out, my children got all suspicious of my wearabouts and quizzed me and I confessed that I had met up with a man and are now very angry with me, not speaking to me.

It's certainly not just your husband you have problems with. You are an adult and do NOT have to answer to anyone about your whereabouts especially not interfering offspring.

How wonderful though, that their reaction is to not speak to you. I suspect they are waiting for you to apologise. Is that how it usually goes?

I cannot start an online divorce due to it being less than a year since we married

I cannot put a house up for sale without his permission/consent.

I can get the house valued but I have a good idea of the value anyway based on what we paid and what next door just sold for.

I do not need a solicitor we do not share pensions or children. We have one house to deal with and no other joint assets or liabilities.

I have had financial advice and I can afford a shared ownership mortgage

What I need to discuss with DH that I can’t discuss with anyone else really, is that we did not sign an agreement not to split the equity he put in so I am now entitled to 50% of it via marriage, but I wouldn’t take it because it’s his.

We also need to discuss who lives where until our house sells. We are both entitled to be in the house

Its such a complicated situation and immensely difficult for you. You've done so well to come this far with trying to establish new boundaries especially when it goes against your people-pleasing ways.

The equity thing is good leverage for you even if you won't take it.

Would it be worth getting a mediator? Other posters will have more knowledge on whether this is a good idea or not.

I'm more focused on how you keep your energy from being depleted by him and your daughter. Can you sleep separately? Have you a safe space like a cafe you can escape to? Is there anyone in real life you can talk to about this?

DH has been on holiday and he’s coming back today. He’s asked for a sit down talk in a public place. Up until last week we were still ‘talking’ (texting) but this wasn’t going well at all, so we stopped completely which has been a lot better for my wellbeing it’s far less stressful.

Essentially he had decided he’s done the work he needed to, that I expected him to do it and what more can he possibly do but just be a better person and I’m not giving him the chance to prove himself.

It’s not up to him to decide this on my behalf and this is where my frustration ramps up. It feels so controlling. Any decent person would be mortified and trying anything to help the other person feel safe, even if that meant leaving them alone, right?

We have been stuck in a communication stalemate. If I say ‘you don’t listen to me’ he will respond ‘you don’t listen to me either’. If I say I don’t feel emotionally safe he will say ‘but I am doing the work and I have new tools now’. If I say ‘I don’t like it when you shout’ he will say ‘sometimes you shout too, all couples shout, if you listened I wouldn’t shout at you’

so he has an answer for everything. This is why I over explain so much.

I looked back on my other older threads under different names and some of them were upsetting as it was clear he had less respect for me than I ever realised. It wasn’t obvious LTB situations but it was red flags. And I never told anyone in real life about the incidents because I was so good at smoothing things over and not holding onto resentment and having hope we would grow from the incidents. Now I have a ton of resentment about no growth and it’s not going away but it’s a shock to everyone who knew us as a settled couple.

The upcoming conversation is going to be the hardest conversation I’ve ever had because he’s so defensive. I am dreading it. I’ve been role playing it with my friend and by myself to try to get a strategy. I’m not going to relist all of the problems of the past and try to get him to understand me. What’s the point, all it does is hurt me all over again. I’m going to set a time limit of one hour and I will listen to what he has to say and not get caught in defending myself. I’m just going to hold my own line and say it’s not working for me and we need to separate properly and get the house sold.

I wish him all the best, I don’t hate him, I want him to be happy but he’s clearly not happy with me so why do we keep trying to find the magic key

Hi OP, well done, that sounds like a good plan, hope it goes as well as it can. I don't think it's that he's not happy with you, it's more likely that this is just who he is and you're not complying anymore so he's trying to frame it a communication issue or something that can be worked on etc. I have been in good and bad relationships that I've ended and the decent men realised I meant it and accepted it and wished me well. The others were v much like you described your OH, refused to accept my version of reality, endless promises to change and be better and adapt and grow etc. I look back now and see it was manipulation by someone that didn't give a fuck about me unless I did exactly as he wanted.

You know, I had this same dynamic and it’s partly why I divorced my husband. I was always, always infantilised by my family and my (older) DH and I had to make this big STAND in order to be seen as a fully functioning adult capable of doing hard things and making hard decisions.

My family haven’t known what to do with this new slightly fiercer version of me tbh, and I would say we’re less close now. But that’s alright. I am in my 40s living my own life, the one I CHOSE.

Don't waste your time listening to anything he has to say - doesn't that perpetuate the myth in his mind that he can fix this relationship? Just cut him off at the start and tell him there is no going back under any circumstances, you've put up with too much for too long and you want a life totally on your own terms without him in it - tell him your mind is made up and they're is nothing he can do or say to change that. You have got to be "all in" on this - anything half hearted leaves the door open in his mind - he will not give up trying to argue you into submission - make the conversation this short - 90s and don't say anything else, don't answer his questions, just repeat what you said over and over and tell him you don't have to explain anything - he is going to resist you all the way isn't he unless you are totally unequivocal. It's time to be strong. Slam the door on his face, on his arm, on his hand - he's not accepting it is he? You can't go away for a couple of weeks and reprogram yourself - that's a ridiculous suggestion - it's not like rebooting a computer.

@mmmarmalade problem with not listening to anything he says and going in bluntly, this will enrage him so much he will become completely unreasonable immediately and I will have to do this all again to talk about the house.

I didn’t know if I was better off just letting him have the floor for 15 mins to get it all of his chest.

exactly as @mmmarmalade said
and you say ' it’s not working for me and we need to separate properly and get the house sold.
on repeat

@JJkate similar here, I’ve ended relationships and had mixed experiences. I do think there can be a narrative by some people that love needs to be fought for, and it’s meant to be hard at times and takes work. This is what DH thinks. It feels like he’s not fighting for me, he’s fighting me for himself. In my experience that’s a selfish take. He wants me to fight for him to make him feel wanted and validated.

Love for me means sometimes you have to let go because the other person is hurting and you want to help them. DH sees this love as ‘weak’ and it’s giving up too easily and it’s selfish easy way out.

One of us is comfortable letting go of control and the other one isn’t.

I believe in radical acceptance. But maybe ask me this again if I am getting my heart broken next time…

It's too late, OP. Nothing he can do will fix what's broken.

My ex-DH also gave me all this shit about "if I had ever loved him at all, I'd have the decency to give him time to prove things could change..." but it's bullshit.

Everyone makes wild promises with a gun to their head. And it might look like a sudden decision to him, but that's because he was quite satisfied with the situation as it was, with you suffering at his expense.

I once read that change happens v-e-r-y slowly, and then all at once. What you feel now is not a sudden change of heart. It's the build-up from all the tiny incremental hurts you've endured over the years, the ones you can read again when you look back at your old threads.

Fuck him. You have a new life ahead of you.