Archers thread #142: Kill Jill? Is Ambridge heading for a Tarantino-style bloodbath on Stir Up Sunday? Discuss The Archers here!

[Gasp0deTheW0nderD0g]

Thank you, @PseudoBadger, for kicking off this long, long series of Archers threads.

All views on The Archers welcome here! New blood welcomed. We don't all agree on all points, although we do mostly try to be civil about it. Most of us are posting tongue in cheek a lot of the time, so don't worry about revealing that , or other unusual views.

Spoilers: not on this thread, please! We don't wait for the omnibus to discuss the weeknight episodes, but we do try our best to avoid cross-contamination from www.mumsnet.com/talk/radio_addicts/4636789-the-archers-spoilers-thread-7-cant-wait-for-702pm-join-us-here, where spoilers are positively welcomed!

For newer listeners, lurkers or those who just have no idea what we're talking about, @DadDadDad has created this useful thread: www.mumsnet.com/Talk/radio_addicts/3557323-For-Archers-fans-a-guide-to-acronyms-on-the-long-running-discussion-threads-and-any-other-meta-thread-questions-you-may-have - BOOP point for him! (See thread for explanation.)

Well, things have taken a turn for the better in the last few days! The SWs have re-discovered their form and the actors and directors have risen to the challenge. I won't say much more than that for fear of jinxing things. Over to you!

(Thanks to @JanglyBeads for the thread title idea!)

Elizabeth opined to David and Ruth that Vince was not really like that - and that he was sure to calm down and change his mind eventually.

She absolutely failed to say he must never darken her door again. (It was strange; the SW put words in her mouth that just sounded unconvincing.)

Admittedly I'm not up with the early 20s people but I'm a bit surprised that Paul is going around sort of outing Ruairi to people who might not know he is bi. I feel like it used to be that you would make out that it was just a friendship (or fob off any relevant chats) unless the person themselves had told you that their Auntie Lizzy (or whoever) knew. Hopefully there are so few homophobic people now that it's no longer necessary? But that seems unlikely.

I liked the Diana Ross bonding. I would like Paul to have at least one non-stereotype characteristic though! Maybe he could play the guitar, be really into keeping fish, be messy - something that isn't cardboard cutout camp man.

My problem with the Diana Ross bonding was that within the one scene Ruairi went on about Diana Ross having been his mother's favourite, and also said his mother had died when he was very young so he never really knew her. I would have thought that Paul might have found that a bit confusing.

Did Ruairi mean tht Jennifer loves the music of Diana Ross? I didn't think that was what he'd said, but did anyone notice?

I think he meant Siobhan, as he used the past tense about her. I suppose he might know that about her from his Irish family.

He said she had lots of her CDs.
Agree about the stereotyping but Adam & Ian aren't camp, Paul is.

I know, but it would be nice if each was a rounded character. It's a bit like having a new young lesbian character and she's got a buzzcut and lefty politics and hates men and likes bricklaying or something.

God, Vince is a vindictive bastard. I don't think David should have offered to pay anything towards the holiday, but am now thinking that maybe David and Ruth will end up "buying" the holiday from Vince and the two of them go to NZ for a holiday of a lifetime and to repair some marital harmony. Ruth loved NZ and always said she always wanted to return.

I loved the chat between David and Tracey.

David was reluctantly to take the loan from Vince but was heavily leant on by Josh and of course Elizabeth, both of whom have gone very quiet about the forced early repayment. David's instincts and judgement about Casey were spot on.

Ruairi didn't really go on about his mum liking Diana Ross, he said he liked her. Paul then said his mum loved her, and Ruairi said 'my mum loved her too, she had a load of her CDs' (I noted the past tense), that was all he said. Paul said he and his mum had gone to DR concert together and that Ruairi should take his mum, that was when he said that Siobhan was dead. He said it happened when he was young, but not that he never really knew her. I don't think it was confusing, it was clear that Ruairi had known his mum but that she had died while he was still a child.

I think for us it's confusing because we know that Ruairi was too young to really remember his mum's music preferences first hand, so he must have inherited her CDs and heard other people talking about her love for DR. But as far as Paul's concerned he could have been 9 or 10 when she died.

Thanks! That does make it clearer. I definitely felt confused, but I can now see how Paul wouldn't have.

incredible that Vince makes out that Beth is the victim in all this when there's a young girl who had to have a late abortion
presumably he knows that this ONS happened when they'd split? was Ben supposed to stay celibate for the rest of his life in case Beth decided to resume a relationaship???

Judging by what Vince had to say in The Bull on that first night, he knows very little about what actually happened.

Does he even know that the barmaid who didn't want to serve him last night is the mother of his (not Ben's in this case, because Ben didn't yell about her abortion in the pub in front of half the village) victim?

Mince knows that Tracy is Chelsea's mother, and Beth knows about the termination.
He's goady. I hope Lizard dumps him and Kenton bars him from The Bull

He's goady. I hope Lizard dumps him and Kenton bars him from The Bull.

Me too.

Gerr aatta maah paab!

Yooooour baaaarred!

One of the things that Vince was broadcasting to the bar was that Ben had caused Chelsea to have an abortion, so he has clearly heard about it; he just got it wrong. That's why I said he didn't seem to know very much what had actually happened.

"He seduced the young Horrobin girl, got her pregnant and packed her off for an abortion, then threw Beth onto the street" was his account of events, and it did coincide with the facts slightly, just not in any important particular.

I'm fairly sure Beth told Vince that Ben slept with Chelsea while she (Beth) had split up with him. Not 100% sure, but reasonably.

We have a university student roughly the same age as Ruairi in the family. I cannot imagine him having this particular sort of complication in his life.

Rent and car??? How have Brian and Jenny not noticed he’s not living like a student?

So he is a prostitute! Sex was part of the deal. Ruari, that is

Ben was right, and predictably Julianne is ramping up the pressure.

Yes, that's how it went.

Apart from the potential for Vince to make life unpleasant for Ben, the NZ trip was a gift, so he hasn't got a leg to stand on. I suppose this is all the consequences riff going on. And buying Vince off will not stop him from piling into Ben with this later, so the guilt and hurt will not be avoided.
Better to have told Vince to shove it.

Although I wasn't keen in the beginning, I'm actually somewhat impressed by the ruari/ julianne story line. The subtleties of pressure he feels, the way she grooms him. It is horrible yet plausible and quite chilling.

Though Stella came bearing offers of cash, I think Ruth could do with having a chat with her old best friend! David is an utter fool for agreeing to pay any money for the NZ trip. They need legal advice.

Is the Julianne thing not weird though in that if you knew a high flying business woman who turned up to business socials with this teenager in tow wouldn’t you think she was creepy/odd/question her judgement and generally avoid her? I really can’t quite imagine her trailing Ruairi around but maybe I just move in different circles.

I'm a bit surprised that Paul is going around sort of outing Ruairi to people who might not know he is bi.

I don't think Paul's outing him as bi - I don't think he knows Ruari is bi. All Paul knows is that someone with the initials JW is somehow involved with him, and has probably assumed it's a male JW.

But your point still stands about outing him as gay. I suppose Elizabeth never mentioned it - she had assumed Ruari was bringing a woman until Paul said he was coming with Ruari, but she didn't enquire if it was as a date or just mates, and maybe Paul assumed, with the lack of comment, that Ruari was already out as gay to all the family.