Will you make it to Heaven? Cont.

[VincitVeritas1]

Feel free to join me in a discussion about Heaven according to the Holy Bible/ Christianity in general.

As a Christian, of course, I respect an individual's choice to choose what they believe in / to not believe. I believe in free will.

However, I do also feel a sadness at the lack of connection and unity between myself and people who reject my beliefs entirely and perhaps are even deeply offended by them.

My only solution is to put this aside (for a moment at least) and do my best to treat those people well and engage with them kindly and respectfully the best way I can.

Why do you need a religious connection with people - surely you have friends of different religious and political backgrounds? Seems odd to feel sad about this.
Ive had some amazing debates with friends who support the removal of Roe v Wade but we’re still great friends.

@Parker231 I don't see it as a 'religious connection'. I see it as being able to share a vital part of myself.

And it's not about debating - which I tire of. Too often that is simply an eristic power play, an academic pissing contest, instead of being concerned with establishing truth/what is right. Just seems to lack integrity.

Sounds like you’re talking to the wrong people - debates are good. Who knows what the truth is or what is right regarding religion.

@heyhohello it's sad that you feel you can't debate truthfully with people who don't believe - that's basically choosing to seek out an echo chamber. I always find when debating with my friends of faith that we have far more in common than we have things that separate us - common humanity is a very powerful connection in and of itself.

Of course my friends who have faith don't pity me for not having faith - and nor do I disrespect their faith in any way.

Sounds like you’re talking to the wrong people - debates are good. Who knows what the truth is or what is right regarding religion.

@Parker231, I think you are correct in that the truth cannot be established through debating. Debates can just as easily be about who is the most eloquent and able to most skilfully wield the relevant knowledge effectively and at the right moment in time. It's just I tire of that. I don't find it helps me find connection with people. It just feels like pointless academic sparring.

@pointythings, it's not about not debating with people who lack my faith. It's about not really wanting to debate full stop. Been there, done that. Nothing to prove.

And concerning sharing my faith and sadness about not being able to. The sadness comes from feeling obliged to conceal a part of myself.

@pointythings,

I always find when debating with my friends of faith that we have far more in common than we have things that separate us - common humanity is a very powerful connection in and of itself.

Thank you. That is a comforting thought. 🙂

@heyhohello if you are in the company of atheists who make you feel you have to conceal part of yourself, they don't deserve your company. You should always be with people who respect your whole self even if they follow a different spiritual path.

@pointythings, thank you.

I know just what you mean @heyhohello 💛

As time is short again I'll let this lovely man do the talking. For anyone curious about what Heaven might be like, here is a sort of virtual tour based on descriptions in the Bible:

Shalom.

Do you spend all your time looking for fundie American youtubers with loud clickbaity videos in the hope that one of them will convert some random on mumsnet?

And why do they all believe that the current conflict in the middle east is a sign of the end times? Is that why you came back OP, to try to save us sinners before the imminent apocalypse?

He has a fun one about how progressive Christians will go to hell too. Have you ever considered that maybe you're all stick and no carrot?

Feel better now? @TriOptimim

I was feeling just fine before. Not believing in crazy apocalypse theories is better for the mental health I find.

The American websites are even more extreme than the UK versions - another site that tells me I’m going to hell!

I remember seeing a video a few days ago, which basically said, can you respect a god who will let your child burn for all eternity because they simply don't believe in him?...

Not something I worry about - neither god or hell exists. Makes for a much better quality of life living as a non believer

Actually given the number of posters on MN who clearly struggle with their mental health, I do wonder how much damage VV is doing by posting these ridiculous videos.

I doubt anyone pays much attention to them.

I was feeling just fine before. Not believing in crazy apocalypse theories is better for the mental health I find.

In the short term, maybe @TriOptimim

another site that tells me I’m going to hell!

Which websites are you referring to? @Parker231

I remember seeing a video a few days ago, which basically said, can you respect a god who will let your child burn for all eternity because they simply don't believe in him?...

Well, I would say that displays a distinct lack of understanding of the gospel message and the nature of God. @C1N1C

Not something I worry about - neither god or hell exists. Makes for a much better quality of life living as a non believer

As others have tried to explain, there is only one reality and one truth - for everyone. If someone was to jump out of a plane at 36,000 feet, without a parachute, they're going to die. Same for you, same for me.

Actually given the number of posters on MN who clearly struggle with their mental health, I do wonder how much damage VV is doing by posting these ridiculous videos.

Would you rather I just lied to them? @Elphame I think that would be far more damaging.

I doubt anyone pays much attention to them.

Mumsnet has around 8 million unique users each month. That's a lot of souls. @BrutChoronzon

You really do have trouble understanding that just because you say god and hell exist, it’s doesn’t mean it does. Your version isn’t the truth for non believers.

Basically you’re wrong!

I get your point @Parker231 It's clear from your posts across the board that you don't understand mine. I think we should move on from this now, with peace.

8 million, but the proportion that will click this thread and watch those videos is tiny and the proportion that aren't either indifferent or turned off most likely null.

In the short term, maybe

I don't think yelling about the end times and good mental health go together in the short, medium or long term.

Disagree =/= not understand. You're the one ky one who can't comprehend anyone else's point of view.

Another thing that isn't a great sign mentally: being utterly convinced you're right about everything all the time. I think there's a word for that.

This is how I like to view the return of Jesus: