AIBU to not want to have a baby with autistic partner?

[MeVengo]

Hi everyone. Apologies about the grabby title.

I guess I'm looking for any advice or words of wisdom here. I already have 5 year old DD with ExH. I've been with my partner a couple of years, this year slowly introducing him to DD with the plans of hopefully living together next year. As long as DD is happy and settled that is, she is a priority of course.

Anyway more to the point. My partner is autistic. I know there is risk of having an autistic child regardless of genetics and that was a risk I was willing to take when I had DD (2 NT parents.) My partner is autistic. It does come with its challenges but I love him and he's been very open and honest about it. Recently we had a conversation about having children. I'd like one more, and he would like one. We were speaking about what he was like as a child. Him and his brother are both autistic. He was essentially telling me that he didn't sleep for the most of his childhood, he ended up in respite care for periods of time as did his brother. There's also a big genetic link with autism too. To be honest I just don't think I can willingly TTC knowing there's such a big risk. It's a different risk to TTC with no history of neurodiversity and that was a risk I was willing to take 6 years ago.

I feel pretty selfish for having this point of view and I can't really articulate how I'm really feeling. Of course no post chooses to have an autistic or disabled child, but I'm going to have to tell him that I don't think I can willingly try for a baby with him knowing there's such much bigger risk factors. The impact it could have on my DD. I've read through many threads on here recently after we discussed this, and there are so many many threads where (mostly mums) struggle, how their life is turned upside down, the impact on any siblings etc.

As mentioned I know there's a risk for any child to have any sort of disability, and that's a risk I'm willing to take. But when there's genetics and immediate family history of it, I think that's different.

Am I being unreasonable to feel like this? Can any parents who have been in this situation give me any words of wisdom? Do any parents of autistic children in hindsight would you change anything?

If he really wants to have a child, and he's so within his rights to want that for himself, as much as it will break my heart I will have to end the relationship because I wouldn't want him to feel stuck or resentful towards me because of how I feel.

As much as he has been open and honest about his autism, now we spent a lot more time together, there are definite struggles, some adaptable but some challenges for sure. I desperately don't want to end a relationship 'because he is autistic' but I just know that's how he will take it, if I tell him I don't want to have a baby with him. And that breaks my heart. I feel awful about this and don't really know if I'm entitled to even feel like this.

This is so bonkers to me that you can uncritically make this generalisation and not think it's rooted in ableism. It is also demonstrably false, since many people with austism have wonderful relationships. And many people value their autistic partners precisely ba use of their autistic traits.

The bottom line is that autism is generally not compatible with what most would consider desirable traits in relationships that most would understand them

I stand by EVERYTHING I say.
I usually, if not having an off day, try to be quite precise.

What part of 'most people' don't you understand?

@MeVengo is talking about having a child.

The world would be a better place if more people gave consideration in bringing any child into the world regardless of risk factors.

There are other questions he should be asking himself, could he be a dad and partner? How much would he be able to adapt? Can he overcome his food aversions, or lack of domestic skills, or function on no sleep with a change in schedule? Is he capable, at times, of putting all his needs aside for his partner and child?

What makes him believe he could be a dad? Is this partly because he is supported by a family member right now that he believes he could slot in the good bits of a child when he was prepared and felt able to cope but all other times someone else would pick up the slack?

It could be because of his ND he is blinkered to the practicalities of adult and parenthood life. At the moment he doesn’t live independently or even in an equal house share. He himself right now isn’t an independent adult, dealing with the daily grind of living with equals and pulling your weight (even if it’s the last thing you want or your preconceived routine is utterly screwed).

Perhaps he and his brother were put into respite because his parents were/are ND, not because he and his brother were particular difficult children but just that his parents couldn’t adapt to what they needed.

These should be the questions he should be exploring honestly.

It feels like the weight of closing down the possibility of having children with OP is all on @MeVengo and that isn’t fair.

You can’t just have a baby and then think that’s all good I will take them to the park on a sunny day - parenting ticked.

There are many NT adults who aren’t really ready to have a child, this isn’t saying who should or shouldn’t have children.

H & I went through a rigorous interview process before getting pregnant, it was way beyond “ableism”. We went through the worse case scenarios we could and then hoped for the best. As with most people you end up somewhere in between.

ND or not, right now @MeVengo partner is an adult male where there is no evidence yet of him being able to look himself and a home never mind a pregnant partner, step daughter and then a baby. It’s sensible to question this. It’s a shame that @MeVengo feels this decision is all on her and is worrying about how he will take it instead of him being able to understand why, right now, it wouldn’t be a good idea.

Can you summarise both your positions in this argument for us weirdos who are skill reading the back and forth? I’m lost.

So update, I've spoken to DP. I was honest about it but went in at an angle that due to my cancer / chemo / chance of recurrence I won't be having a child with him, with the autism rates. Due to the impact it could have on my daughter and us both as people.

He doesn't see the concerns really, specifically about him being a dad. I broached the topic of how intense any child is. That rigid routines won't be stuck to especially in the newborn phase, as well as toddlerhood and beyond. That we need watertight financial stability but we'd never merge finances anyway due to his being managed by relative and my worry is that is then be lumped with most of the financial costs. He said he's a very patient and laid back person and he will take each day as it comes. So I pointed out that he should be able to take that approach with being able to use a different fork, or not having a 'crash out' when a black T shirt is in the wash when there's 20 identical black T-shirts in the cupboard.

He just didn't see it unfortunately. At all whatsoever. He just thought it'd be sensible to wait a bit longer before discussing children.

I am sad but I know I've done the right thing. The relationship is over.

I don't see that in most people's posts.

I see that in the poster I replied to. That's internalised ableism from the poster I replied to.

As an autistic parent to an autistic child I think the OP is being very sensible.

Well done, OP. I genuinely think you did the right thing (for everyone involved), and that the hurt now, acute though it may feel, is small compared to the potential for serious and ongoing negative impact to your life, your DD's life and your partner's life, even if he doesn't realise it.

But his response tells you how little insight he has into how badly his coping mechanisms would be likely to deal with parenting. Hold to that if you wobble.

I did not dismiss your dislike to a particular post. I was not commenting on your dislike to a particular post at all. Being late to the thread, I didn't even see the deleted post you took a dislike to, as it had already been deleted. You've made it up that I was responding to your dislike of that post and made assumptions about me due to having that mistaken thought in your head.

My comment about your behaviour and it's possible cause was about your defensive behaviour throughout this entire thread. It was a comment to OP to illustrate a point, because she wants to learn. It was not a comment to you at all.

I also don't think you know what gaslighting means. It means trying to make someone think they're crazy. I'm not doing that. Apart from responding to your attacks on me, I haven't been conversing with you at all.

The key word is can, it’s a spectrum in how it presents and varies . NTs also vary
as do relationships.Many many NT people can be a pain in the arse.

You do understand the difference between people posting about their own personal experiences as experienced by them themselves, and other people posting about what other posters should or should not be allowed to post?

Which of those do you imagine that you are? If you have positive experiences why not post them? We can all draw our own conclusions about what is relevant to us and our situation.

Amazing, who knew?

So if you had a child who was happy, going well etc you'd tgen be ok with having another whose needs blows the first ones life to pieces??

Op, I'm sorry, I know you really do love him.

I think his response tells you he lacks insight into how much you and his mum (or relative he lives with) faciliate his life, by making sure the washing is done exactly how he needs it, food, living life, he's basically still dependent but doesn't see that, I mean I might feel calm and laid back if I didn't have to do all the housework, wifework and everything was facilitated for me, but that's not shared parenting.

If he 'got' it and you were able to talk openly and honestly about the problems ahead in parenting, which surely happen to anyone, it might have just about worked, but he's kind of a bit in denial about his own functioning if he's still at the having to have a special fork, can't attend family events and melts down about s-shirt stage. No shade, we are ND in my family and we do struggle a bit with these things, but we all have a go at them and aren't dependent on others to make the environment perfect for us- you have done the right thing for you and your daughter but very hard.

If you can't bear the thought of inflicting a disabled child on your daughter then you shouldn't have a baby with anyone. Disabled children (and not all ND people consider themselves disabled fwiw) deserve more than being seen as a burden and an inconvenience to older siblings, and anyone can have a disabled child, or have a child who becomes disabled.

It's probably a good thing this relationship has ended but I dread to think where your ex-partner's self-esteem will be left after being told, "I cannot risk bringing another child like you into the world."

You talk about it as though this reaction is because he's autistic and somehow not a reasonable response, and maybe it is as I am also AuDHD, but I really do not see how a NT person would not react the exact same way to being told that they are so difficult to be around that it's better that no more of them exist.

It is whataboutery to say NT people can be a pain in the ass too.

Autism clearly has specific traits and behaviours attached to it: else it would not be a condition with its own label at all!

If you are going to argue that autistic people are just like everybody else who are not autistic why bother with the label 'autistic' at all?

Or is it so watered down as a condition now it is utterly meaningless to call somebody autistic?

Exactly this. Nobody said that all people with disabilities are undesirable, nobody said that once. That’s not true. YOU might be amazing in a relationship and coparenting.

EVERYONE IS DIFFERENT.

Most people came on and gave their experiences, if they are predominantly negative experiences trying to coparent with an autistic partner, then: yes, roll up, roll up everyone with their positive experiences.

There is plenty of room to post.

ALL WELCOME.

I think you’ve done the right thing OP. Ignore the posters who are trying to turn this into an ableist debate; you’re doing what’s right for you and your DD. Your DP really doesn’t seem to have any understanding of what’s involved in being a parent or of his own limitations. I hope you’re not too sad right now.

No, I cannot bear the thought of inflicting a disabled child on my daughter's life. I really can't. And that's the gods honest truth and about as blunt and as honest as I can put it. Who would want to bear that on someone? Realistically? Fucking nobody. NO ONE asks for a disabled child and a lot of people want to lessen the risk which is what I've done. I am sick to the back teeth of posters like you shaming me and others with the same opinion because it fucking offends you. GET OVER IT. Not everyone wants aspects of your life. And that is okay. I am choosing to prioritise my daughter and will not risk blowing her life apart by bringing another child into the world, knowing the risks, that will impact my time and devotion to her. She was here first and she is more important than any hypothetical child I will or won't have. So no, I do not want this for her, or me. And I definitely do not want her to become a carer for a sibling she never asked for, if something happened to me, because the siblings dad cannot parent effectively. I do not want to spread myself so thinly trying to parent another child with needs, and parenting the dad because a fucking fork he wants is currently in the sink because he didn't wash it up. Or end up out of work due to not having the finances to have carers or support, and sucking up the expense because he can't manage his finances. So yeah, fuck that. I don't want that. I love him but love isn't enough. It certainly isn't enough for me to risk blowing my daughters life apart.

Hopefully I've made that clear.

I dread to think where your ex-partner's self-esteem will be left after being told, "I cannot risk bringing another child like you into the world

Once again, dating and having babies are not equal opportunities games. No one is owed a wife or baby.

You should be shamed. Your ableism is disgusting. I had a child in the full knowledge that she would likely by AuDHD. She is, and she's incredible and I ABSOLUTELY WOULD NOT CHANGE HER. She hasn't blown apart her sibling's life AT ALL, she has brought untold joy to all of us, and she is not defective or a burden, she is perfect. You would not deserve her.

I sincerely hope that your daughter never suffers an illness or accident which causes a disability (what would you then do? Leave her on the steps of a hospital?) and I really hope you don't have any more kids.

Well said OP, some people are a bit bonkers on here!

It is not ableist to put the needs of an existing child first.
It is not ableist to not want to bring a child into the world with a man who is incapable of looking after himself, let alone being a parent.
As a child of an autistic father, my life has been severely impacted by his disability. I know he can’t help it but it has had a negative impact on me. I’ve been the parent since I was about 12. It’s not ableist to say that. It’s the truth.

Some people with autism are incompetent. Some NT people are incompetent.

Some ND people are bad parents. Some ND people are brilliant parents.

I'm a wonderful parent with happy kids. So are my parents- both ND. I know many crap parents who are NT.

Don't have kids with someone you don't think is going to be a good parent, by all means, but saying that you don't want a child in case they are autistic is shitty and anyone autistic has every right to take that as the insult it is.

Do you think possibly that could be because your father didn't get the support he needed from a young age? As he would have grown up at a time when there was a lot less awareness about autism, and many autistic people were not taught life skills as a result. I suspect similar happened to OP's (now ex) partner, being stuck away in respite care instead of being taught how to function in society as a neurodivergent individual.

Things are different now. Autistic people are generally not shoved in homes, and many SEN schools and SEN bases within mainstream schools have specialists, such as communication experts, Occupational Therapists, and sensory rooms where they can take a few minutes to self regulate without disrupting others around them.

They have specific classes where they are taught independent life skills, such as cooking, cleaning, and how to maintain executive functioning.

Now there is a debate to be had regarding the battle many parents face in getting their children this support, but it IS out there. The autistic adults, such as your father and OP's former partner, are difficult for NT people to understand or live with because their needs were not met early on. However, the autistic young people and children we see growing up today will be different due to the level of support they get compared to what they would have in the past. Yes there is much room for improvement and things are far from perfect. But I'm thankful my autistic children are growing up today with the current support rather than 40 years ago.

having an incidentally disabled child vs deliberately bringing a child in to the world when there's a risk they will be autistic or disabled is vastly different. And if you cannot see that, that's your problem. Great that your daughter's lovely. Really. But countless people on here have written their experiences as not so lovely. I am not risking that for my daughter. She doesn't deserve that. You are choosing to be offended. I'd rather be labelled as 'ableist' than risking blowing up my daughter's life. Nothing you say is cutting any ice unfortunately.