AIBU to tell my mum to stop asking about grandchildren?

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My partner and I both turn 40 in August. We've been together since we were 18 we met at university both studying Medicine and have been together ever since. Medicine at uni has that sort of environment where everyone in the same cohort kind of just sticks together. Everything I did was to do with medicine, I played hockey but that was medicines hockey etc. In a way slightly culty.

We've built the life we wanted. We both have careers we genuinely love. we've bought a house, have a great group of friends and close relationships with our families.

We've never really wanted children. I had an abortion at 35, and if anything it confirmed what we already knew. We both realised parenthood wasn't for us. We wouldn't want to bring a child into the world unless we were 100% committed to it, and we're not. We enjoy our life as it is. We like the freedom of deciding on a random day to go away for the night, eating out, travelling, spending time with friends and our nieces and nephews, and focusing on our careers.

Some people might call that selfish. Maybe it is. I'd actually rather be "selfish" than have a child because it's expected and then resent the lifestyle change. Children deserve parents who desperately want them.

I absolutely adore my nieces and nephews and happily spend time with them, but loving other people's children has never translated into wanting my own. I've never had that maternal calling, I know I would be a terrible mother and at nearly 40 I think it's safe to say the maternal instinct is not suddenly going to appear.

We're getting married in August. Neither of us is particularly interested in marriage itself, but from a practical point of view (next of kin, legal protections etc.) it just makes sense. We're having a very small registry office wedding in London followed by a nice meal with close family and friends. Exactly what we want.

The issue is my mum.For years she's brought up grandchildren. Every conversation seems to circle back to babies. I've repeatedly told her we're not having children and that the subject is closed.Recently she said, "Well then what's the point of life?"

That has shocked me. As though our lives somehow have less value because we've made a different choice. I don't judge people who have children most of the people I love do but I don't understand why some people can't accept that not everyone wants the same life.Eventually I'd had enough and told her to stop bringing it up because the answer isn't changing and I don't want every visit turning into the same conversation.

Now she's upset and thinks I was harsh.
AIBU? Should I just let her keep hoping and politely shut it down every time, or is it reasonable to expect her to accept that at nearly 40, after over 2 decades together, we've made our decision and it isn't up for debate?

Even when I’m 50 she will go on and on about it. It’s making me want to see her less every single time she talks about. A close friend of mine had her first baby recently I went to see her and meet her son. I sent a photo of me holding her son to my mum (this friend had known me since we were 7 and our mums are good friends) and my mum instead decided to comment on what I’m apprently missing in my life. Even added that my partner and I should hurry.

Absolute garbage this.

Ooh, clever.

Hence the word tend to.

Good grief, said Charlie Brown.

DS1 has made it crystal clear he doesn't want children. I have no idea what DS2 will decide. I am so excited for their futures, and spending time with them is more than enough for me.

Anyone who had children because they were an “investment” isn’t fit to be a parent. Children don’t choose to be born and they have no obligation to carry on some kind of legacy.

I said tend to. Which means some won’t be

Omg how dare DS1 halt your family legacy!!!!!1!!?!

Who is saying you are responsible for her disappointment and should have children just for her sake?

Has your mum said that ?

No one here is. Just to see why she may be disappointed.

There’s nothing wrong with not continuing it either. Nature doesn’t give a shit either way.

The mother is entitled to her feelings over it, but if she persists in banging on about it she risks alienating the children she does have (and dealing with the consequences of that).

Your mum doesn't need to understand why you don't want to have children - she just needs to 1) recognize that you don't want to, 2) make an effort to empathize, and 3) engage with you respectfully.

You don't need to understand why this is hard for to come to terms with - you just need to 1) recognize that it is hard for her, 2) make an effort to empathize, and 3) engage with you respectfully.

Your mum isn't doing much in the way of all 3, but I think you might be falling shorter than you realize OP.

Ffs saying one group of people tend to empathic doesn’t mean no one else is. I said tend to but it’s been jumped on & blown out of context

I agree with everything in this post.

I really enjoyed my childhood all thanks to my parents. They were great loving parents I can’t fault them for that but just because I had a great childhood doesn’t mean I need to have children to prove that. Maybe just maybe being a mother isn’t for me and that’s okay as it’s my choice surely

Will you continually badger them about providing you with grandchildren, tell them that you are devastated if they don't oblige, and keep saying that there's no point in life without kids? Or will you keep your devastation to yourself?

The OP understands her mother's feelings. But she can also be totally pissed off that her mother is like a dog with a bone and won't let go.

I'm not sure it was an assumption on your mother's part. She probably had some idealised future version of herself involving grandchildren. Let's face it, she's from a time (the same time as me) where women often internalised the pressures of the patriarchy without 100% realising that's what they were doing. These are quite difficult pressures to break away from, quite difficult to reinvent yourself when this is all you've ever really known, quite difficult to accept the life you were told was your inevitable right / prize isn't going to happen.

None of that is your fault. It's just a cultural shift.

What you seem to be struggling with is that she doesn't want to accept this cultural shift and make life work for her now. This sadness / grief is being made your responsibility. It isn't. As you correctly assert, she's able to make new choices now but won't. It's as if she's refusing any agency. There will be a myriad of reasons why she seems congenitally unable live her life rather than vicariously through your life, and some of these will be down to your father. She probably feels very isolated. And that's because she probably is relatively isolated. However, the 'fix' for this isn't to guilt trip you, instead she needs to invest some time into self-reflection - again, an expectation born of a cultural shift.

If you have the generosity to consider family therapy, it could be worth it, especially if it then leads on to her own therapeutic journey. It's not your responsibility but it could be something you are happy to help your mum with.

I have 3 kids, 1 grandchild. I will never have any more. I've dealt with that - myself / with my husband.

Mothers are no more sympathetic than any other demographic of the population really. And being nice to and self-sacrificing to your own child does not necessarily mean you are a nice and self-sacrificing person generally. I think the people who think giving birth makes you instantly saintly tend to be the ones who were utter selfish cows before that and now think they have become angels because they look after their own offspring. Often while displaying utter callousness to other peoples children. See for instance the attitude of many here about giving a neighbours/friend’s child a lift to school.

It's only in the individualistic cultures of the West where the idea of not having children simply because you don't want to is considered acceptable. In virtually every other society it is recognised that our life choices are not only about ourselves. That actually, yes, we do have obligations to our families, and especially our parents. Obviously I recognise that this is a very alien concept to Western ears but it remains the truth. And there are deep human reasons for that that surpass cultural differences. I'm not saying that OP should be forced to have kids, but she should recognise the legitimacy of her mother's feelings, be sensitive to them, and even take responsibility for the impact of her decision not to have children.

Deliberately misreading what she says in order to make a point is a bit cruel too.

Her mother ASKED for the photo. It was hardly Jim fucking Bowen revealing it at the end of Bullseye. I'm not sure how many times she has to say that before people stop incorrectly piling on.

Can you help / encourage her to get time with children? There's volunteering for eg. Scouting/ Guiding. There's being more involved with the children who already exist in the family. There's maybe scope to set something up with a nursery and her local U3A. (I've read about care homes that have residents interacting with visiting children - I'm sure there are ways that could be adapted for pensioners living independently). There's maybe US stuff about 'adopting a grandparent' aimed at people who've lost theirs / are LGBTQ+ and have been rejected by birth relatives it's worth her looking at.

I think this is worth attempting from the perspective of: she might get something out of it - time with children she can 'give back' at the end of a defined session (which is usually what grandparents want - to be involved with kids without having to do the day to day mundane stuff). She can probably have that style of relationship with kids who aren't her grandchildren. There's a deeper question about family and legacy and what it means. Children could certainly become part of her chosen family. If she has knowledge she was expecting to pass on down the generations maybe she wants to write a book / blog.

Time with actual children might also help her drop the rose tinted spectacles - small children are hard work, especially if you struggle getting up and down from the floor.

If you have four children then expecting at least one grandchild is really not a stretch. I do understand her being really sad and heartbroken but she's completely wrong to bring that up with you. It's her problem.

She must be wondering what she has done wrong, deep down, for all of her children to have been put off parenthood. A mum of four would undoubtedly have dreamt of grandchildren, it's natural and probably even biological. Her sadness is hers to carry not yours.

Where you’re being unfair is expecting her to have dreams and aspirations that match yours. Her dream was grandchildren. She is and will always be sad about their absence. You must accept that and respect it.

I agree that you have no responsibility to have children for your mother. I don't expect my children to provide grandchildren for me, I see my job as being to bring them up well enough to have happy and successful lives of their own and be decent members of society, what 'happy and successful' looks like is defined by however they see it.

But in the interests of understanding your mother's perspective... you're essentially approaching this with the same argument she has for why you should have children.

You say - why doesn't she travel and pursue a lifestyle that you see as fun? Why doesn't what you would find fulfilling make her feel fulfilled?

She doesn't want to travel and go on fun nights out, she wants grandchildren. She had 4 children, she finds having young children fulfilling. Travel isn't going to fill the void that she feels - that's what you like.

You don't have to provide children for her, or feel bad about not providing them. But you can do what she can't, and try to really understand and empathise with her. She finds joy from differing things to you, there's nothing wrong with that.

The problem is she can't provide those things for herself and its unreasonable of her to expect you to.

A starting point isn't to feel frustrated and guilty, you've nothing to feel guilty about. It's to put yourself in her shoes and speak to her from that level.

Parents can be disappointed without that disappointment becoming someone else’s duty to fix. Adults aren’t obligated to reproduce to manage their parents’ disappointment.

You haven’t explained why a parent wanting grandchildren creates a moral obligation for someone else to have children.

Calling an adult’s right to choose their own life “a Western concept” doesn’t make your argument true or profound. It just sidesteps the fact that no one owes another person a child, whether that’s a parent, a partner, or anyone else.

It is your choice. Maybe going forward you should say this is not a topic I’m discussing anymore, love you but im going to go home now. She’ll get the message eventually that the topic brings communication and visits to a halt. She’ll be hurting and it’s not your hurt to fix and she shouldn’t be making you feel bad. I can just see how that would make her feel. You don’t have to make her dreams come true. Your mom sounds like she enjoyed motherhood (she did it 4 times) and she sounds like she did an amazing job. 4 successful children is quite the accomplishment for not only you and your siblings but for your parents to. She may not see it in the same way as you do because she experienced motherhood. It’s getting through to her that you have a happy fulfilled life is the problem. You need her to stop turning the conversation back to the same thing and the only way to do that is to swiftly end it. Just interrupt her and say I’ve got to go now whilst on the phone & in person just change the subject and if she keeps going on just leave. She will realise it’s pointless going on and she’s best off not saying anything

oh behave

I have a family member who's worked in pediatrics and has chosen not to have children. Perhaps it's something to do with seeing, day in, day out how vulnerable they are? It's a disappointment to her mother but she accepts it.

I think you sound admirably clear and self aware about your decisions and I can understand why you can't see why your Mum is constantly banging on.
I'm closer in age to your Mum and in all honesty I think she needs to get a life. After reading all your posts it sounds like she fancies the notion of grandchildren but not the reality. Perhaps she should get her DBS over the summer and volunteer with children when the schools are back?

I think she wants to be a Disney Granny rather than a wipe the bum and nose Gran.

Stick to your guns and have a glorious wedding|!!