To think I should be able to take my daughter on holiday

[jj3457]

Hi everyone. I know some people may not like this, but I am a dad posting, just looking for some advice.

I told my ex I would like to take our daughter (3) on holiday to spain for 5 days with me and my mum.

Now this is where I messed up, and I will hold my hands up. I was dishonest when I told her I would be going with my mum. We will actually be going with my partner who my ex hasn’t met. I know this was a stupid lie but I was just worried my ex wouldn’t give consent for the holiday if she knew who was actually going.

To make matter worse, my ex has now found out that my mum is actually going to Florida for 2 weeks at the time I said she was coming to Spain with us.

My ex has messaged to say that she will not be handing over the passport until I give explicit details about the travel. I know that once I tell her I’m going with my partner she will refuse to consent. The holiday is booked and paid for.

I know I’m in the wrong for being dishonest but I am on the birth certificate and have as much right as she does to take her on the holiday. My ex has taken her abroad several times before and this is my first time.

what can I do if my ex refuses to give consent?

thanks

You've really screwed thingd up for yourself here. Holiday in 1 week? Its a good job your ex found out really .

You might just have time to introduce ex to your new partner, but doubt if it will change things or why lie about her in first place, you must have been with her a while for her and your daughter to have a good relationship. I wonder if your daughter has mentioned her name to your ex.
I think you will have to leave your daughter behind and arrange a holiday with her on your own or with your mum another time I doubt if her not going will lose you a lot of money No more lying either lol

When I got a new partner I introduced him to my ex. My ex was entirely unreasonable (abusive) but it was still the right thing to do.

My brother is in a relationship with a woman with children and he was introduced to the ex (and ended up becoming friends and now all 3 are in a band together... coparenting goals right there!)

If your ex refuses consent, then this time you will have to with just your partner assuming your ex will have your daughter for the full time you are away. Then when you get back you will have to introduce your new partner ( assuming she is a long term prospect, and willing to become a step mum in mind,) to your ex and let your ex get comfortable with her building a relationship with your daughter and hopefully next time she will give you permission. Or go back to court but the deception does not help you case especially if your new partner is not well known over a period of time to your daughter.

Also a dad. You're..um..brave asking that in this particular forum.

People here may read about your little lie and focus on that (it was a mistake to tell the lie) - the big picture is that you said it because things are sadly tense after the break-up. It can be a heartbreaking scenario, and relations with your ex will probably need very careful navigation.

When I last checked, there existed support & information groups for dads in your position. Find them. You'll also need to mug up on the law, but try to settle things without having to use it - and that means good communication with your ex if at all possible. She'd have found out eventually, and what then?

All I can suggest is be as kind, transparent and level-headed as you can. FWIW I'd be inclined to communicate to your ex how much you love your daughter, and as such believe you can be a good dad.

My personal opinion is that kids need a good father too, and it's best, if possible, if it's the biological dad. I wouldn't start the communication with that fact though! Hopefully you have a good bond with your child already - it would be sad for that to be broken, with everything she's already going through.

It's hard to judge other people's relationship situations - knowing nearly nothing about them. Having heard quite a lot about equality all our lives: yes, in principle a father should have equal rights but we often simply don't (sorry, but it's true). I think things are improving in that regard.

Good luck. I'm not sure my advice is pure gold - I'm not separated from my other half - but it may give some balance. I've seen breakups play out a few times.

Telling your child’s mother you are travelling overseas with your child and a person known to your child’s mother when you are actually travelling with someone the mother has never met is in no way a “little lie”!

It is an option it’s just one you don’t want to take.

What did your mother make of your deceit OP? Or didn’t you tell her that she was your cover story?

You lied - there is now no trust at all. No trust that you will maintain appropriate boundaries between your GF and DD, no trust that you will manage DD's gentle introduction appropriately to the new GF. No trust that you are able to be sensitive to DD's feelings of torn loyalties to you and her mum. This implies also that even if you had common sense before, you are now so besotted with the GF that your common sense is in the bin. So no indication that your ex should trust you any time in the near future with a small child.
You've brought it on yourself.
Stop being stupid and spend the next few years behaving appropriately in order to build trust.
But good idea to put it on mumsnet so we can set it out straight for you.

You said in your original post they hadn’t met?
Based on the little I’ve seen so far, you’re dishonest, untrustworthy and not someone I’d trust.

Or just be the adult and put your daughter front and centre. Don’t lie. Be honest. Be the grown up. You say your ex can be verbally abusive. Has she ever stopped contact or threatened to?

Why don’t you want them to meet?

Why do you live so far away? Was it your choice?

These are relevant to your question.

If you lived away for you, it’s a sign that you didn’t put being a father front and centre. If she moved away, it’s a sign that she didn’t put your role as a father higher on the list. If it was unavoidable it’s a moot point.

If you don’t want them to meet because your ex will abuse your girlfriend that makes sense. But they will have to meet sometime. And how do you know your ex will be difficult? She hasn’t about you lying and hiding the fact that your daughter essentially has a new step mum that she wasn’t told about. That seems extremely reasonable given your behaviour here.

Those questions do make a difference. They speak to your general attitude to parenting and help make sense of why you’d lie.

Legally the mother of your child has no right to meet her daughters new stepmom but the most grown up and adult thing to do is to recognise the three of you are in a parenting role with your daughter and need a good ‘working’ relationship.

Im sorry but I strongly suspect you don’t want them to meet in case your new girlfriend sees behind the mask. I’d bet good money on it.

Agree.

Not a chance I'd let my 3 year old abroad with a woman I hadn't met.

If the shoe was on the other foot, how would you feel if your Ex said that she was going to Spain with your daughter and her Dad, but then you found out that it was actually her boyfriend, who you'd never met, and they would all be sleeping in the same room? Seriously, how would that land for you?

So are you going to choose going with your girlfriend over going with your DC?

Are you not remotely embarrassed?

Excellent question.

Just had a thought - is your girlfriend a Spanish national OP? Is that why you are so reluctant for your ex to contact her? That would put a totally different spin on things wouldn't it? That would certainly be one of the things I'd want to check on, if I was your ex and the more you try to prevent an introduction the more concerned she'll be one about what you are trying to conceal.

Have a great holiday op, when you get back maybe it’s a good idea to show some courtesy to your child’s mother and discuss future arrangements, child safety and show some respect both for her and your child.

You have another 18 years to go until your dd graduates… it’s a long stint with many unforeseen bumps in the road, you will be in a better place to navigate them with a healthy and respectful co parenting relationship.

Lots of people haven’t even mentioned the fact that you haven’t actually told your ex about your gf at all in the 19 months. So, what if your little 3 year old hasn’t mentioned the gf? Kids don’t all say every thing that they’ve done or everyone that they’ve seen. Especially if they feel some kind of tension around the subject from the adults in their life.

Even if your DD has mentioned her, has she called her your gf? Why haven’t you mentioned her in all this time? It all looks like you attempting to hide something. Then the lie, involving others. Do you really know you shouldn’t have, or is it just that you regret how it’s affected your plans?

Why does it matter that you feel uncomfortable about introducing your ex and your gf? If they are both happy to that would end this problem. Why isn’t it an option to go without your gf? You may have to go without one of them, and lose out on some of the money you’ve paid (because of you not being upfront) so why not agree to take DD alone? Your gf is a grown up, she ought to understand.

In principle a father should have equal rights but we often simply don't (sorry, but it's true)

Usually the primary carer has slightly more rights and a lot more responsibility. Usually the primary carer is the mother (sorry but it’s true).

All you can do is tell the truth about the arrangements. If your ex refuses to let your daughter go, then you need to accept that. Nothing can reasonable be done in less than a week.

I find people who are very strong on rights somewhat weaker on the responsibilities. As someone married and no ex in the picture, I can’t recall a time when I wondered what was my my right to do but every day I make decisions considering what’s the best for my children.

your ex sounds very reasonable. You lied and she caught you out, forcing you to come clean.
now that you have, she’s OKd the holiday with a few requests that are also extremely reasonable ones , of course she should have your gfs contact for emergency purposes.. unless you have something else to hide?
also requesting a brief chat so she knows who your daughter is living with for a week seems completely reasonable. Imagine if the situations were reversed and your ex wanted to take your daughter for a weeks holiday with a man you had never met

100% this is madness... so what does it look like to your new partner? If I was her and you were stamping your foot refusing to give her details to the mother of your children, I would have serious doubts about your intentions and commitment to your children and the relationship. But maybe she is the one turning the key on your back? 😕

You cocked up. FAFO.

The lie is an example of why your ex should and does mistrust you.

Until you mentioned the lie I was like "of course he can take his child, and he's going with his mum, that'll be a lovely holiday for all three generations" and then boom plot twist, you made it weird.

What were you expecting to happen? That your girlfriend wouldn't be in any photos? That you'd photoshop your mum into the holiday pics? That you'd get your daughter to call your girlfriend "Nan" so her holiday stories wouldn't ring alarm bells to your ex? This is all proper mental.

I suspect this is a reverse but my feelings about it remain the same.

I have a step daughter who is now 20 and I've been with her dad since she was a baby (her parents weren't together before or after she was born, there was no cheating involved). We were very open and honest and clear about all holidays, whether they were in the UK or abroad. Before booking we checked the dates with her mum, we paid for her passport, we gave her mum the addresses of where we were staying and what kind of stuff we'd be getting up to while away, and who would be on the trip (us and the child, her siblings when they came along, sometimes my parents or my other family or sometimes family friends). She'd also go on holiday with her mum and we'd have the same conversations.

YABU, what an idiot. Grow up.

He doesn’t take much responsibility for his child, I think parents rights should be earned, proportional to the amount they prioritise their child. That doesn’t give the op much.

Absolutely, your rights as a parent are conditional. As soon as you neglect your responsibilities as a parent, you’ll find your rights quickly disappear (as it should be).