AIBU to feel upset after engagement plans and seeing his grief?

[ihatesonic]

Not sure if this is the end of my relationship.

I have had a difficult life with physical, sexual and financial abuse so my radar is not always right.

My two adult children live with me which is relevant as I can't live with my partner all the time and he had always been accepting of. They are both disabled.

His kids and grandkids love me and he says I have brought them together in the last six months.

This weekend we bought an engagement ring. Wedding is planned for next year. He wants to get my and his (adult) kids together in the next few weeks to propose. Sent a pic of said ring to my kida and they were less enthusiastic than expected. They like him and were originally happy for us.

I come home and one shows me his social media of last week at his deceased wifes (not his kids mum) grave. He was clearly still grieving in the video. He was widowed 18 months ago and we started a relationship about 12 months ago.

Constantly asks me if I am sure but gets annoyed if I ask him the same.

I was so excited as I never really wanted to get married again and came home so full of plans but feel like a fool now.

So AIBU to be upset. He thinks so

A multitude of studies on grieving and marriage after losing your spouse. You don't think people have studied it? Checked the stats?

Very much second this. My biggest concern and red flag by a mile off would be the fact he’s posting himself grieving at his wife’s grave on social media. I actually don’t care if I get flamed for this… it’s a VERY covertly narcissistic thing to do … garnering sympathy …that’s not at all normal to post that… you’ve said yourself you have a history of trauma which makes you vulnerable to an extent… I can relate to that… my advice… Watch him … that’s a serious red flag.

It all sounds a bit performative to me.
Performance grieving on social media.
Buying a ring in advance of a planned performance engagement.

I wouldn’t be enthusiastic about this at all.

Till you have been in that place of losing a spouse you don’t know how you will react

yes 6mths is soon. Equally I met my 2nd dh 9mth after my first died - tho wasn’t looking - happened naturally

tho I didn’t have kids to take into it

you do have doubts tho and getting a ring /showing you /kids seems weird before proposing

there is no rush and more important for you as you have adult kids who live with you

does he want to move in - where does he live now @ihatesonic

a pic by dead wife’s grave isn’t bad. I post a pic of dh and been 15yrs on anniversary’s

seems men move on quicker then woman

They will always live with me. Their dad is not in the picture (his decision and possible why he left). I think that is part of why I have been swept along, I have been single for about 20 years

They will always live with me.

OK, but you need a long-term plan. What happens when you get very old and can no longer care for them? What happens after you die?

If your plan is that they stay with you for several decades to come, then don't get married and don't move a man into their home.

As I said before, marriage is a legal financial contract - why would you give a man potential rights over your DC home?
In your position, you should not marry anyone until or unless your DC are living in residential accommodation and no longer need you to house them.

Of course, you can still have a long-term, meaningful and committed relationship, just not marriage.

Apart from "loving him", what are the good financial reasons to marry him?

Tell me you aren't a homeowner with vulnerable dependents looking to financially tie yourself to a man that you've known for a year? Please?

Your partner started a relationship with you 6 months after his wife passed away. Now, I absolutely appreciate, if she'd been ill (I'm assuming), he may have done an awful lot of grieving prior to her passing. However, 6 months is still a relatively short space of time, and I don't believe anyone is truly ready for another relationship in that time span.

Unfortunately, men are more likely to rush into a relationship after a spouse passes or a relationship breaks down. It's often a case of 'any woman' will do', as long as she's willing to have a relationship now.

I wouldn't be getting engaged. You've only known this man 18 months, in within that timeframe, he's clearly still been grieving for his wife...as your son pointed out. Personally, I don't think your partner is ready for a relationship, let alone an engagement or wedding. By all means keep dating him, if you wish, but you need to slow your partner down. You both need to get to know each other properly before even thinking of engagements.

I know there are stats on people moving on quickly after bereavement. Where are the studies that say people in happy relationships move on more quickly than those who were in unhappy relationships?

Sorry, he’s not over his wife. Don’t split up but properly wait until you’re both ready. You shouldn’t need to be asking all the time if you’re “sure”. It also sounds like you have a complicated situation with your kids.

Don’t rush into marriage for the sake of it, it would be a huge mistake.

So they will always live with you, is he prepared to take on that role considering he has never lived with you? How do they feel about you moving a man in? A man who potentially will be in some part responsible for their care?

If he marries you, will he have a claim on your house?

What is the plan for your children when you pass away or become infirm?

Sorry @ihatesonic this is quite messed up

I wouldn't be attracted to a man who leaps from one woman to the next. Or one who was seeking out a girlfriend such a short time after the previous wife died. It would make me deeply uncomfortable.

Do you have your own property and financial independence? Would marriage put that at risk?

I don’t remember where I read this but it was explained as men who have had a positive experience of marriage wanting that again.

Sorry OP. I voted YANBU to be upset.

But in reality I think you have been unreasonable to expect a bereaved man to just magically fit into a new relationship with no after effects of grief, attachment to what he had before, the long process of grief etc.

Men do seem to develop new partnerships startlingly quickly after bereavement. And it seems not because they are ready to ‘move on’ but because they look for a woman to support him, take care of his emotional and other needs, The new partner is part of the process of grieving, not a ‘fresh start’ .

Have a think about why you were so keen to accept the idea of marriage when? If I read you right, you haven’t even lived with him yet. With flashy public ‘proposal’

And have a serious calm talk with him about his life and feelings.

And obviously put the whole idea of marriage on ice for at least another year.

When are you planning on moving in together?

Surely this needs to happen before you even consider getting engaged.

If this relationship benefits you then I wouldn’t end it.
The majority of women on here are in relationships with men who realistically just didn’t want to be alone/were horny and then the feelings came later (for some).

I would just slow down a bit.
There is no benefit to you getting married, so what’s the point in rushing it.

He wants someone to wash his socks and pick up his dirty underpants from the bedroom floor. Why get married or live together? Fuck that.

I think that's massively simplifying to extrapolate to them being happy marriages. We know that marriage statistically increases men's happiness and decreases women's, so it remains likely that these men are looking for replacement domestic woman appliances rather than trying to recreate a genuinely happy marriage.

It’s too rushed. You don’t know someone properly at 18 months, especially with the fact he was widowed not long ago. I say you could get engaged but do not marry for some time, maybe even a couple of years. Marriage creates a huge mess of complications if it doesn’t work out. You don’t just forget someone after 18 months do you. Of course he will still love his wife that died. He may never stop.

A couple of posters have written the relationship is 18 months old but they've only been dating for a year, very very quickly after the wife died.

If you're not even going to live together and you have disabled children who will need long term support, why do you need to get married? You could have any kind of party you want, a commitment ceremony, anniversary party where you have a nice frock on and all your friends round, a church blessing if you're religious, or just carry on as you are. Your children are unenthusiastic, he's not over his late wife. You may as well say you want to hand him half your disabled children's house. It's bad enough if you divorce but if you die he could do anything - contest wills, make it difficult for your DC's etc.

Yes, but what people are asking is what actual studies correlate speedy male remarriage with male happiness in a previous marriage?

It's thrown around the place on here with the same dopey, unquestioning authority as 'You have to spend three months salary on an engagement ring!' and 'The arrow on your dashboard points to the side your petrol tank is accessed from!' Often by the same people who thought that the Channel Tunnel was an aquarium-style glass affair from which you could wave at fish on your way to and from France.

I've never seen a source. It gets associated a lot with a dubious Mormon 'relationships expert' called Abel Keogh, who has made an entire career out of remarrying after he was widowed, writing endless books called Dating a Widower, Marrying a Widower, Life With A Widower, and at least two memoirs about his own experience of remarrying after his wife died, and how that works in the afterlife. But as his entire career depends on widowers remarrying, I wouldn't see him as likely to be that invested in peer-reviewed studies.

I am worried by the pattern of the video at the graveside and the public proposal in front of all your children. It feels a bit performative. I understand that you have been alone for a long time but maybe slow this down a bit? Also, consider whether marriage is the best future for you and your DC, if they will always be dependent on you.

This makes you and your children sound very vulnerable. If you go ahead and marry this man, he moves in eventually and then you pass away before him, what do you envision happening to your children? He could potentially quite easily make sure that they are left without anything, especially if they are in any way intellecutally disabled. Your primary responsibility is towards your disabled children, not this man and his children.

To answer a few points, we will not live together full time. That was not the plan because of my caring responsibilities.

So why marry if you don't plan on living together? You can stay in the relationship, you can be engaged but why marry? It's a financial and legal contract so what do you get out of it, what does he? I just don't get that part. Either way wait a few years and if you both feel the same after 5 years or whatever, then go for it but right now it spells insanity and heartache.

My DH died just under 4 months ago, aged 46, and I have some insight into what your partner's thought process might be. There are a number of things and it's fairly complex and I think you have to be fully comprehending of this stuff to get where he's at in his head.

Firstly, the fact he is deeply grieving his late wife does not mean he doesn't love you as much. You and his late wife are two different people, but what it probably means is that they had a good relationship and because of that he craves the same again. If they had had a terrible marriage perhaps he wouldn't be so cut up about losing her or so quick to be with someone new. It's natural that he is grieving not just the loss of her, but also the whole 'being in a relationship' way of life, and I think that's why he has moved on so quickly with you. Probably incredibly lonely after losing his wife, missing the companionship, missing having someone to 'do life with', being part of a team, being best friends, probably suffering with 'skin hunger' (it's a thing, I currently have it badly - missing being touched, missing sex, missing physical intimacy, cuddles etc). Having all those things and then suddenly losing that person is incredibly traumatic. He will also be thinking about everything she has lost, and that in itself is a whole other pain that mingles in with the rest.

He is never going to stop grieving his first wife, he loved her and visa versa, and they didn't split up, she died. The end of their life together was not a choice, it was forced upon them. He will always miss her and think about her, so that's something you have got to be okay with because it's natural and would be a disservice to her if he didn't. If you suddenly died he would be the same about you I'm sure - and I'm sure you wouldn't want him to forget you or put all his photos of you in a cupboard because somebody new came on the scene, that would be horrible, and cold. He needs to be able to grieve and that could be life long - HOWEVER, it absolutely and categorically does NOT mean that he loves you less. I have no doubt he loves you very much. Those two things are co-existing inside him. For myself, I do believe I have the capacity to love somebody new one day (although I have very complex feelings about that) but it won't change the fact that I love my late husband and always will forever. It would feel like a massive betrayal to put my love and memories of him aside to suit a new person in my life - what sort of person would that make me? And the same with your partner - surely you don't want to be with somebody who can just forget about someone they loved because they have died? You wouldn't want him to forget about you if the worst was to happen?

What I am getting at is that the fact he is still deep in grief is normal and shows he has depth and integrity. I would judge somebody who moved quickly on but then seemed to bury all thoughts of their previous spouse, that would be really cold and unfeeling.

I do think getting into a new relationship 6 months after the death of a spouse is too soon, but I can see why it would happen. Loneliness and the craving of that companionship and love and intimacy - it is really fucking awful to lose that, it's so so awful, beyond describing. So I think you need to give your partner the space and time to grieve and don't take it personally. You have to understand he will always carry that grief - but it absolutely does not mean he doesn't love you just as much. I think getting into a new relationship that quickly probably does complicate the grieving process because I don't think he's given himself enough time to process his grief before you came along, but I guess that is something you both now need to muddle through. I do think that getting involved with somebody who is widowed is quite a brave thing to do, and you have to understand what you are getting yourself into, because there are emotional complexities involved that there wouldn't normally be in a straight forward relationship. I actually think to myself, who would ever want me now, a woman who is still in love with her dead husband? There are photos of him everywhere, his stuff is all over the house. But I still have capacity for love, loads of it. I don't think people who have been widowed should be consigned to a life of loneliness forever because they once had a spouse that they loved. It just takes the right person with understanding to help them move forward in life.