To wonder why we have more than one child?

[whydowe]

I posted recently on a FB parenting group at the end of my tether with my two kids. I was honest that I like parenting them both apart but not together. Was pleasantly surprised by the kind responses and overwhelmingly the responses were ‘me too.’

I guess I’m wondering why we do it. I know a lot of people seem to have a second to give the first a brother / sister but have to admit that wasn’t my motivation; I really wanted another child, think I had a feeling of having missed out over covid.

Why do we want a second so much?

That might be the case overall but for a highly structured society like the UK its a big problem - as it creates an ageing society, meaning there are ever less younger taxpayers to pay an ever bigger NHS / care / pension bill etc.

Trying to offset the inadequate birth rate is one reason why the govt is so lax and permissive with the small boat people.

There is obviously some practical limit to the world population, but I do not think we are anywhere near it and our society should at least be able to sustain itself - currently it isnt doing so.

You hear conspiracy theories like "population replacement" - but this is just people arriving at the wrong answer as to why our society is changing. Our problem is inadequate birth rate. It wouldn't be that difficult to fix this - 3 kids per couple would do it (instead of just 2).

@BlueSherbet so your answer to people having too many kids in the past is for everyone to have THREE kids. Really? So the generation that come after them will also have to have three kids to sustain it? And how are you going to implement this-force everyone to have three kids?

God no, 8 billion people is far too many as it is. We need another solution. And I couldn't be happier the birth rate is dropping either!

Or, we get over the "immigration problem" and allow skilled worked from elsewhere to fill those gaps. Society here continues, the world population stabilises.

Diversifies the gene pool here too, not a bad thing.

I think we don’t realise we’ll be unhappy with two until the second one comes along…by which time it’s too late obviously

Beats me. I don’t have any 🤷‍♀️

Now I have no opinion on the number of kids people have nor any desire to be telling people how many kids they should have due to population decline etc etc.

However, if we want people to have more kids then there actually needs to be proper investments in the structural and societal issues that prevent people who want more kids from having.

PROPER investment in early years childcare for example places like Finland where it is mostly state run not for profit, the people working there are degree educated and the cost is subsided from a young age so that families aren't paying out astromonical amounts on childcare. Better paternity leave, more affordable housing, more investment in community spaces like the Sure start centres which many were closed down, affordable childcare during the holidays.

The problem is all this costs money and tax payers money which I'm guessing the people banging on about having more kids aren't willing to pay. There are many people who would have loved kids earlier or a bigger family and for them it is simply out their reach or unaffordable for them.

The population decline isn't for women to solve. Women can't be expected to just pop out more babies if the supports and structures aren't there to support them.

Looking at my decision to have 4 children, with hindsight, I think that I was very aware that giving birth to a child doesn’t mean the child will outlive you. I was one of 10 cousins - only 2 died before I had my first child, and one was seriously ill, and died shortly after I had my last child. That’s a 30% premature mortality rate.

I guess subconsciously I thought having more children acted as a kind of insurance.

I don’t regret my choices, btw. In fact we referred to dc4 as our luxury extra - expensive, unnecessary, probably unjustifiable, but makes our life that little bit better.

I also feel better about having four, as all of my children say we should have had another, so they clearly don’t feel short changed by our decisions.

I felt it wasn't good for one child to be the sole focus of all our attention, it was too much for his own good. A second child spread the love out more evenly. And now they are grown they have their own relationship which is brilliant.

I think this could be personality dependent.

It is true for me.

Dd1 is a high achieving, diligent people pleaser. I am prone to high expectations. If she had been our only I think it could have been pretty intense.

By having dc2 in close succession, I had to drop my standards completely. Dc2 is mad and feral and feels no pressure to please. So I have had to chill the f out.

My parenting has been more about fire fighting and keeping everyone fed and alive which has meant less pressure for everyone. We all have a lovely time!

A different mix of personalities may have led to different conclusions.

I do have a sliding doors comparison in the extended family of someone who just had one, and they are very intense and over involved and perfectionist and I can so see that is how I would have been before it was beaten out of me.

The flip side is their child gets a lot of time and attention and is always in the right place at the right time with the right and clean stuff. Not something that can always be said for my family. They do lots of travel and trips and experiences that can't really happen in a gang.

It is all swings and roundabouts.

I'm one of two, and the high expectations of me didn't get dropped because my younger sister was a different kettle of fish.

Instead I was expected to achieve, and met with either "well yes because you're very capable" or disappointment it wasn't better. Whilst my less capable sister had the tiniest of achievements celebrated loudly and proudly.

DH is the middle of three and found the same, his elder brother had high expectations on him, his younger had everything celebrated. DH, unfortunately, had the typical middle child experience where he was kind of skipped over.

As a result we only have expectations of DD to do what makes her happy, and we make sure she knows this, other than being expected to try her best.

Lord only knows what the expectations on me would have been as an only. Could have gone either way, too intense or having no frame for comparison (sister) they'd have just let me be happy.

I was never broody for my second but I didn’t want an only child.

I had a different experience to you OP, I had my first and he demanded my attention the whole time which was lovely but when I found I was expecting my second I was worried how I would be able to share my time and affection. When my second son was born my eldest had an initial period where he was jealous (3 year gap) but then they became close and spent lots of time together and it actually made everything easier, I then went on to have my DD and as I also looked after my sisters 2 DDs who were a similar age while she worked, it was much easier as they all played together.

Why?

No idea. Satisfied my curiosity after one - it is very very hard work. DH had a vasectomy not long after and I happily drove him to the appt!

I find this attitude completely baffling. What is so appalling about having one child that you’d make yourself have a second you don’t really want?

I loved being a mom to my first and wanted a second so I had another child to love and bring up as well as my first having a sibling/playmate and I love life with them both. They’re only 19 months apart so one is now 2.5 and the other is 11 months, I love playing with them together and watching them interact, today I took them both to a trampoline park and Friday took them both to soft play. As I said to my partner it’s bloody hard work doing stuff like that with them both as my oldest wants to run off and I chase behind with my non-walking baby! But I wouldn’t have it any other way, it’s the best thing ever spending the days with the two of them, so for me that’s what made me want a second!

Like lots of other posters I was strongly driven by really being against having an only child. I know 2 people with only children and both really regret it, they often join us to be part of a family on days out and both say how difficult it is for them as parents and for the child.

Having our 2nd was the best decision we ever made (this is just our experience). As adults we can't play with a child like another child can, ours have a best friend and make up the most amazing games and make believe lands and stories! They sing and dance, watch movies, oldest reads to the little one. We do a lot as a family and are very close so when we are off travelling it means they have each other and me and DH also get to spend time together. They absolutely adore each other. I know all siblings are not like this so we are very lucky.

I know 2 people with only children and both really regret it

To provide balance to this anecdote, I have never regretted sticking to one child. 🙂

Nor me.

I’ve got one child because I knew my limitations and I’d probably have ended up in the psych ward if I’d had two.
My DS is suspected AUDHD (on waiting list) and is enough for two, other parents have said this to me, so not just my perspective!

You don't need to balance it 😊 That's great you haven't regretted it so it really shouldn't bother you that other people have different experiences if that's the case?

Op asked what made people want 2 children and I answered it 😊

Me too. I had 1, never felt the urge for another and have 0 regrets.

My mate openly said she had more than 1 incase 1 predeceased her

The end game of this scenario is that every developed nation ends up fighting over young, well educated, skilled people. That is already happening to some extent. Places like Australia, with the good weather, will always do well against the UK in that game.

Also, diversifying the gene pool too much means we are not really a nation or people anymore; fair enough if you are fine with that, but a lot of people would not be.

Ultimately, successful, stable societies have the be able to sustain themselves.

Any student of history knows how important the birth rate is to a nation and its fortunes.

Well then it needs to be affordable and practical for people to have more children. Otherwise, we have no other option do we?

And Australia will seem more attractive in climate but they are much better at controlling immigration than we likely ever will be. And it's much more expensive to live there. Plus, they don't just hand out benefits to people who arrive.

So, you know, they might not get the young skilled workers...

We are still Brits if we're born and raised here, by the way, regardless of the genetics.