The Invasion is ongoing...Part 6

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Things are ramping up. No end in site as yet.

Link to thread 5 here: www.mumsnet.com/Talk/_chat/4494173-The-Invasion-is-ongoing-Part-5?pg=1

I need to get off Twitter. Just read a tweet someone had written saying “We’d all better accept death is coming and make peace with it” #worldwarthree I’m literally shaking and in tears. I think about my 3 year old asleep upstairs and I can’t protect him. I want to see him grow up. I’m so scared

@Ghastlyghoul thank the heavens mumsnetters all know how to make a roast chicken last 7 meals - times are hard.

@Alexandra2001

Won't happen. Too many legal problems. But the idea of it, makes good headlines

why can't they use emg legislation and make it legal? after all they can crush my car if i don't tax it......

Clash with other laws still mean that you could end up with a legal mess and challenge. Oligarchs have good lawyers.

@Logburning

I need to get off Twitter. Just read a tweet someone had written saying “We’d all better accept death is coming and make peace with it” #worldwarthree I’m literally shaking and in tears. I think about my 3 year old asleep upstairs and I can’t protect him. I want to see him grow up. I’m so scared

Some people talk utter crap Please don't take it to heart

@Logburning

I need to get off Twitter. Just read a tweet someone had written saying “We’d all better accept death is coming and make peace with it” #worldwarthree I’m literally shaking and in tears. I think about my 3 year old asleep upstairs and I can’t protect him. I want to see him grow up. I’m so scared

FWIW I am considerably more relaxed today than I was a few days back.

Russian TV has been full of relentless, quite frankly crude anti-NATO rethoric and waxing lyrical about all the new desperate measures to prop the economy. I'm not sure they are fooling anybody. My impression is that the 50+ are swallowing Putin's rethoric but anyone reasonably internet-literate and minimally intelligent has a good idea what's really going on.

The very fact that there are any protests at all in Russia is amazing and incredibly heartening. Whoever finds themselves in the wrong side of the law in Russia has a lot to lose - those protesters have guts. I am still hoping against hope that Putin will be stopped by the Russians.

There aren't any Putin supporters in the Lab party.

Starmer sees things differently...

The Labour leader used a Guardian article last month to attack Stop the War, in which Corbyn continues to play a prominent role, effectively accusing the group of siding with Russia.

“At best they are naive, at worst they actively give succour to authoritarian leaders who directly threaten democracies. There is nothing progressive in showing solidarity with the aggressor,” Starmer wrote.

I think its a bit of red herring and as Lab aren't in power, so unable to enact law, irrelevant.

Whether they can enact law is irrelevant. It's unacceptable for UK MP's to suggest NATO may be responsible for Putin's actions.

FWIW I am considerably more relaxed today than I was a few days back.

And me.

People on twitter whip themselves up into a frenzy.

www.itv.com/news/2022-03-02/russian-forces-line-the-roads-around-mariupol-as-last-convoy-flees-city
ITV News joins last convoy out of Mariupol as key Ukrainian city is besieged by Russian forces

When the journalists bail, you know its BAD.

Properly bad. This is Bosnian level bad by the sound of it.

@HeadPain
What sort of government is scared of a little old lady holding placards?

The US government arrested literally thousands of peaceful protestors during the invasion and occupation of Iraq. So the answer is: pretty much any government big enough and bad enough to launch wars of aggression.

Obviously it's not all, as we can see the results of Russian actions... But..

"Russian troops are in disarray and ‘crying’ in combat, radio messages have revealed.

Soldiers are refusing to obey orders – including to shell Ukrainian towns – while others have walked away from battle

Thread 🧵👇"

mobile.twitter.com/TelegraphWorld/status/1498975675507789833

"A senior Pentagon official said on Tuesday that parts of the Russian army made up of young, poorly trained conscripts were "ill-prepared" for battle.

In some cases they "deliberately punched holes" in their vehicles' fuel tanks to make sure they did not reach the front line"

Indications of poor Russian morale can be heard in audio recordings of radio messaging between troops obtained by British intelligence company ShadowBreak Intl

mobile.twitter.com/TelegraphWorld/status/1498975708173201412

The intercepted conversations shed light on troops' confusion about engaging targets in civilian areas and voice stress and frustration about the lack of supplies.

➡️In one conversation, a soldier sounds as though he is crying

💬Samuel Cardillo, who founded ShadowBreak, said troops were struggling to maintain communications.

He said they would often spend 20 minutes doing a "sound check" to make sure they could be heard, offering opportunities for radio hams to listen in
There were periods where we heard them [Russian soldiers] crying in combat, a period where they were insulting each other – obviously not a sign of great morale"

Mounting evidence from messages sent back home suggest the Kremlin had convinced Russian troops that they would meet little resistance in Ukraine and instead be treated as conquering heroes

💬"We were told we would be greeted with open arms, but they call us fascists," one Russian soldier reportedly texted his mother

Ukrainian officials released myriad videos in recent days, showing captive Russian troops claiming they had no idea they would be sent into Ukraine

Valentina Melnikova, a veteran Russian human rights activist, said soldiers' mothers groups were receiving calls from young men in fear of being called up for the invasion"

Read the full story👇mobile.twitter.com/TelegraphWorld/status/1498975772740042753

@Logburning

I need to get off Twitter. Just read a tweet someone had written saying “We’d all better accept death is coming and make peace with it” #worldwarthree I’m literally shaking and in tears. I think about my 3 year old asleep upstairs and I can’t protect him. I want to see him grow up. I’m so scared

@Logburning , I can fully sympathise. I'm finding this thread actually really helpful, non scaremongering and insightful. I also have a 3 year old and a 1 year old and was crying at the thought of things. As previous posters have said, I do feel more relaxed now than I did a few days ago. Try and stay off of Twitter and FWIW, I find FB just as bad at the moment.

@RedToothBrush can I ask why you feel less worried than you were a few days ago?

@Logburning

I need to get off Twitter. Just read a tweet someone had written saying “We’d all better accept death is coming and make peace with it” #worldwarthree I’m literally shaking and in tears. I think about my 3 year old asleep upstairs and I can’t protect him. I want to see him grow up. I’m so scared

Please do get off Twitter it will help

@Ghastlyghoul - thanks for posting, their piece was a great summary of all the “best” takes from MN. A bit of dark humour which we all sometimes need.

Can’t remember who asked further up, so haven’t tagged, but Chat threads no longer disappear - think this changed a couple of years ago (covid seems to have resulted in a distortion of time for me!). There are now 30 and 90-day-only threads for those who want to post but don’t want to be accessed for ever.

And I can’t remember who the poster was on the previous thread, it filled up too fast for me to quote, but it was a very short and succinct post re Russia “asking for ceasefire negotiations”. The point they made was great - no one is firing at them, they can cease their bloody fire as soon as they want to.

@RedToothBrush

www.itv.com/news/2022-03-02/russian-forces-line-the-roads-around-mariupol-as-last-convoy-flees-city ITV News joins last convoy out of Mariupol as key Ukrainian city is besieged by Russian forces

When the journalists bail, you know its BAD.

Properly bad. This is Bosnian level bad by the sound of it.

"An ITV News crew joined the last convoy out of Mariupol, as the city became besieged by Russian troops.

Our team was left unable to access electricity, water or fuel as one of Ukraine's key cities endured what's been described as relentless attacks.

A port city, Mariupol in the south east, has been pounded by artillery over the past week.

Our team, along with other journalists and some diplomats in the train of cars, was stopped just five miles outside of the city.

Russian tanks stopped the cars. At one point the tank turret turned towards the vehicle, soldiers knelt and aimed their rifles at the convoy.

The situation eventually calmed and our team was allowed to drive on after searches of the vehicle and inspection of their identification.

On the road waited "dozens" of Russian vehicles, tanks and lorries, as well as "hundreds" of troops. The filming appears to confirm reports the city has been encircled.

On Wednesday alone, the mayor of the city said hundreds of civilians had been killed by Russian shelling.

At least one teenager died in the city and two more were wounded in attacks. The boys' families told The Associated Press the attack came while they were playing soccer near a school.

The city of Kherson was also under pressure, with reports on Wednesday night it had become the first major Ukrainian city to fall under Russian control since the invasion began.

Mariupol's Mayor Vadym Boychenko said the attacks there had been relentless.

"We cannot even take the wounded from the streets, from houses and apartments today, since the shelling does not stop," he was quoted by the Interfax news agency as saying."

@RedToothBrush

www.itv.com/news/2022-03-02/russian-forces-line-the-roads-around-mariupol-as-last-convoy-flees-city ITV News joins last convoy out of Mariupol as key Ukrainian city is besieged by Russian forces

When the journalists bail, you know its BAD.

Properly bad. This is Bosnian level bad by the sound of it.

Yes, it certainly is. Some stayed in Baghdad in GW1 and Saigon after the evacuation...they have seen the writing in the wall I guess. Kherson has already fallen.

@FOJN
Whether they can enact law is irrelevant. It's unacceptable for UK MP's to suggest NATO may be responsible for Putin's actions.

I support Starmer, certainly over Johnson, but I must say I'm getting tired of this fascistic policing of thought and opinion which is becoming increasingly prevalent in the UK and elsewhere. Limits of freedom of expression are set under UK law and are the barometers are (at least for now) set far and wide for good reason. Not defined by you or any other self appointed judge of "acceptable" opinion/acceptable avenue of discourse.

[quote Cam77]@HeadPain
What sort of government is scared of a little old lady holding placards?

The US government arrested literally thousands of peaceful protestors during the invasion and occupation of Iraq. So the answer is: pretty much any government big enough and bad enough to launch wars of aggression.[/quote]
It was literally about 200 and they were arrested for blocking roads and access to government offices.

www.reuters.com/article/us-iraq-usa-protests/at-least-200-arrested-in-u-s-antiwar-protests-idUSN1930128420080320

@RedToothBrush

www.itv.com/news/2022-03-02/russian-forces-line-the-roads-around-mariupol-as-last-convoy-flees-city ITV News joins last convoy out of Mariupol as key Ukrainian city is besieged by Russian forces

When the journalists bail, you know its BAD.

Properly bad. This is Bosnian level bad by the sound of it.

Press have moved out of Kyiv as well

We moved out of Kyiv today so we can continue broadcasting at a more secure location in Ukraine .Never easy decisions. So many reasons to stay, one good one to leave
twitter.com/markaustintv/status/1499102027749724162?s=21

@RedToothBrush I had a very bad day on Sunday. I don't suffer from anxiety at all but I was literally having palpitations (I live very close to Faslane). I feel much better the past couple of days and that is in part thanks to your posts. So thank you.

For some reason I can’t tag the poster or link something from thread 5 (though I’m not the best and only have an old iPad to use!)

It was a link to a video with body language experts going through footage of a Putin interview summer 2021 and also his address announcing the “special operation”. It’s interesting viewing (though also understand that analysis could be skewed one way!). It’s quite long, at just over 2 hours.

@Logburning

I need to get off Twitter. Just read a tweet someone had written saying “We’d all better accept death is coming and make peace with it” #worldwarthree I’m literally shaking and in tears. I think about my 3 year old asleep upstairs and I can’t protect him. I want to see him grow up. I’m so scared

People write all sorts of crap on the internet. Please try not to worry.

@Logburning

I need to get off Twitter. Just read a tweet someone had written saying “We’d all better accept death is coming and make peace with it” #worldwarthree I’m literally shaking and in tears. I think about my 3 year old asleep upstairs and I can’t protect him. I want to see him grow up. I’m so scared

Hugs to you

Mother of a 4yr old, 3yr old and 4mo baby here. Diagnosed anxiety and PTSD. I get it completely. There have been days where I've been paralyzed by fear and could focus on nothing else. Total unrelenting fear.

The past two days I've felt much better. I've taken comfort in little things such as Boris correcting Liz Truss' stupid comments and saying we don't support it. In my mind, whether it makes a real difference or not, I was able to resonate "right ok, our government is trying to prevent things escalating" which I couldn't have convinced myself of three days ago.

The best thing you can do is to tune out of the news and speculation. It's hard to fight the compulsion to keep reading, but it helps to concentrate on other things.

Try to remember that there are highly trained and experienced people looking out for our best interests, they will do whatever is nessecary to protect us.

[quote Logburning]@RedToothBrush can I ask why you feel less worried than you were a few days ago?[/quote]
Lots of reasons.

Putin is busy with multiple crisis blowing up. He has to deal with those or concede defeat immediately. We have to assume he wants to remain President atm. The moment of most danger is the one just before he feels like its all over. Not there yet.
There lots of signs of ill discipline going on at multiple levels of the military.
There's also some good looking inteligence going on, which is reported one day and then seems to get verified a few days later.
Because only the attacks in the South are making headway. (Though reports there are of genocide).
Because Western leaders haven't got the 'stern face' on atm. The one that Biden did and Johnson did when they said invasion about to happen. We have gone down a level to 'concerned face'. Without fucking off to a fridge. Visibility is a good sign.
Just 'signs' that are heard to put a label on.

I think if they are more worried, we will get a sense of it by actions, even if they lie through teeth.