Supporting women in prison.

[dylexicdementor11]

I’m delighted to see so many mumsnetters are concerned over the welfare of women in prison. However, I thought it might be good to point out that there are many organizations doing incredible work within women’s prisons.
If you have the time to engage with the it would be wonderful if you could support them and find more information about the issues women are actually facing in prison.

Here are some links that may point you in the right direction.

https://www.womeninprison.org.uk/

So should we ban male POs from women's prisons or shouldn't we? I'm confused about what your point is?

Instead of arguing on here, take proper action and apply to join the IMB.
I've been doing it for years, but recently had to resign due to my health problems.
https://imb.org.uk/

I think we should. Current femsle prisoners do not. Their views trump mine

I'm saying that if prisoners were ever your concern, you'd listen to them abiut their concerns and address those. They wouldn't only interest you because you can shoehorn in your own hyper-interest in trans women by using female prisoners.

Well I'm shocked, shocked I tell you that this is a wafer thinly disguised scolding thread about what women should or should not devote time too 🙄

Also the slightly patronising tone as though Women in Prison and other groups concerned with women who are incarcerated have never been mentioned on FWR before!

Not sure if its the same poster or another who had been in prison and explained that male screws are a far bigger problem.

Female staffing seems a sensible place to start otherwise every female prisoner is effectively sharing a cell with a man. Ones with keys.

But she did, the opening of this thread didn’t mention trans at all

I'm confused by the 'problem is minuscule' argument.

It rather reminds me of the argument about meningitis or polio not being a problem and therefore we shouldn't vaccinate our kids.

Well yes, the reason (men in woman's prisons) is a 'small' problem is because of the hard work of campaign groups (some who met here!) who have raised awareness and litigated on this very issue and as a result there are likely a fraction of the transwomen in female prisons as there would be otherwise. The fragrant Isla of purple leggings fame, being just one.

The very fact that there are still ANY in woman's prisons means there is still some kind of loop hole or undermining of the law. While that is still the case, women's prisons and the women in them are still at risk.

Not OP's first rodeo on the 'this is really not the main issue in this particular area why aren't you talking about - ooo look a squirrel' horse either.

@dylexicdementor11 if you’re bored, why don’t you go on all the threads on MN and tell women they’re too concerned with the wrong thing?

What exactly do you claim "doesn't happen"? These have all been reported in the press:

• women being compelled to share cells and showers with men claiming to be women
• women prisoners being punished for misgendering
• women prisoners being subjected to voyeurism & indecent exposure by male inmates
• women prisoners (and women prison staff) being sexually assaulted by male prisoners incarcerated in women's prisons.

I am reminded of the way this usually goes:

• That never happens
• It does happen but not a lot - this is a fuss about nothing
• It happens all the time and most women are not bothered about it - only bigots
• It is a good thing and we should encourage more of it (because it makes men happy).

I would hope that the last one is out of bounds on this thread.

It is surprising that some PP claim that women prisoners are not bothered about men being incarcerated with them when male prisoners in the men's estate have expressed concern and disgust that violent sex offenders and paedophiles get "Prison Onset Dysphoria" in order to avoid being placed on the Sex Offender Programme and some are then moved into women's prisons.

@dylexicdementor11 This is the "Feminism Sex & Gender Discussions Board, by the way, which is why there is a focus on the impact on women prisoners of men being incarcerated with them. There is a "Feminism Chat" Board for threads like this one which are NOT about "Sex & Gender".

Women face punishment for using wrong pronouns
https://insidetime.org/newsround/women-face-punishment-for-using-wrong-pronouns/

‘Trans-imposters’
https://insidetime.org/mailbag/trans-imposters/

Are they stupid?
https://insidetime.org/mailbag/are-they-stupid/

‘Some trans prisoners are faking it’, MoJ study finds
https://insidetime.org/newsround/some-trans-prisoners-are-faking-it-moj-study-finds/

(ps. I can't help noticing that you and the OP not only are of one mind but also have such similar User Names, lexically and semantically. What are the chances!)

I'm seeing the "I don't understand what you're trying to say" ruse being used on other threads on the board.

In real life, I've seen it being used by men who don't want to admit to losing an argument to a woman or women.

Men pretending to be women and accessing women's spaces is my area of concern. It affects women in many different areas of life. It has affected me personally. I can campaign on whatever I like.

Quite. I believe the PP’s point was to clarify that if people were concerned about the needs of women prisoners, they would listen to women prisoners.
But as you say, that is not your concern. 😊

I look forward you coming back and apologising when that trans identified male 'Alexandra' Stewart is found guilty of sexually assaulting a woman in a women's prison then. 99% of sex offenders are male. Even if every woman prisoner voted to include male prisoners in the female estate, it still wouldn't be the right thing to do.

Yep I was side eyeing the op from the start. Perhaps people could get on with doing the things they feel are more important, rather than lecturing women on MN about their priorities?

You are missing the point, but that’s okay. 😊
I’ll bow out of this thread now, but I’m glad that some people have found the resources useful.

Exactly. The policy change in England under the last government was in large part due to the lobbying of the brilliant Dr Kate Coleman and her organisation Keep Prisons Single Sex.

We’re not missing the point 😊 have a great day!

And obviously there’s just last month been the FWS win over the Scottish government, forcing them to move male prisoners out of women’s prisons.

I think you're missing the point but we'll agree to disagree. Thanks for all the useful links and do come back to share those petitions/campaigns to improve things for women in prison. I think we all agree it's important that some very vulnerable women are supported.

Absolutely.

Yes you are :-) if you care about a group of people, you care about what they care about.you help them with the things they need help with.

Trans women in women's prisons just isnt something female prisoners ever speak about because they have bigger and more pressing issues that present danger to their wellbeing

I can see perfectly what your priorities are without the benefit of telepathy @Lexibletheflexible given that you seem to spend a lot of time in FWR telling women what to do.