NHS Fife tries to silence nurse - Sandie Peggie vs NHS Fife Health Board and Dr Beth Upton - thread #51

[nauticant]

Sandie Peggie, a nurse at Victoria Hospital in Kirkcaldy (VH), has brought claims in the employment tribunal against her employer; Fife Health Board (the Board) and another employee, Dr B Upton. Ms Peggie’s claims are of sexual harassment, harassment related to a protected belief, indirect discrimination and victimisation. Dr Upton claims to be a transwoman, that is observed as male at birth but asserting a female gender identity.

The Employment Tribunal hearing started on Monday 3 February 2025 and was expected to last 2 weeks. However, after 2 weeks it was not complete and it adjourned part-heard. It resumed on 16 July and the last day of evidence was 29 July 2025. It resumed again over 1 to 2 September for closing submissions.

The hearing commenced with Sandie Peggie giving evidence. Dr Beth Upton gave evidence from Thursday 6 February to Wednesday 12 February 2025. Sandie Peggie returned to give more evidence on 29 July 2025.

Access to view the second part of the hearing remotely was obtainable by sending an email request to [email protected] by 5pm on Wednesday 9 July. Detailed instructions were provided here:
drive.google.com/file/d/16-9POEZ7yHWUr6EmbfquJZO18Gv78bSm/view

The hearing is being live tweeted by x.com/tribunaltweets and there's additional information here: tribunaltweets.substack.com/p/peggie-vs-fife-health-board-and-dr-005 and tribunaltweets.substack.com/p/peggie-vs-fife-health-board-and-dr-bd6. This also has threadreaderapp archives of live-tweeting of the sessions of the hearing for those who can't follow on Twitter, for example: archive.ph/WSSjg.

An alternative to Twitter is to use Nitter: nitter.net/tribunaltweets or nitter.poast.org/tribunaltweets

Links to previous threads #1 to #50 can be found in this thread: mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5379717-sandie-peggie-list-of-threads-covering-employment-tribunal-and-afterwards

Thread 50: mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5387893-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-50 7 August 2025 to 1 September 2025

Head meet brick wall 🧱🧱🧱🧱🧱🧱🧱

Good Law Project. Run by Jolyon

Does anyone know how much longer JR has for her subs?

Maybe the Fife board have decided that the TRA agenda is more important than the reputation of the hospital or tax payers money

LM doesn’t get to decide for all women. Also the TP she changes with could be women who identify as trans - trans men.

Eternity?

some links any readers new to this may find interesting with examples of women and girls who need SSS (eg following VAWG) or they are either excluded or lose other human rights- privacy, dignity, safety.
https://transcrimeuk.com/
https://childrenoftransitioners.org/not-shutting-up/
thecritic.co.uk/survivors-of-male-violence-need-single-sex-spaces/

Till about 11.15 then 15 minutes for amendment.

About half an hour I think.

I thought judging a person in their 'stage' of transition and personal appearance was considered transphobic? I actually agree that judging the 'commitment' of a trans identifying person based on their appearance or medical care is discriminatory- a TIM can't help having male pattern baldness, or medical conditions making cross sex hormones and surgery too dangerous to contemplate. Anyone who says they are trans is equally trans as the next trans person surely.

15 mins. It's just it'll feel like eternity.

God this is painful! The bad sound is really not helping.

<Adds more weed to my weed tobacco ratio>

Not to mention LM chooses to go to rugby club. She doesn't rely on it for an income. She doesn't have to go if she has any objections about it. She can also change before and after the club has started or finished if she wants to.

There are so many differences between LM and SPs examples.

JR keeps referring to Vic Valentine's "unchallenged" evidence (which was written, so we haven't seen it, I think). NC's final submissions at paras 490-491 discuss this and say she didn't challenge it because it's utterly irrelevant to anything the tribunal has to decide.

I thought that was just me, along with the scene where the jester is being prepared for knighthood. I wonder if a certain DEI officer was promoted in the same way?

From TT

and is a way to smear TP. C will say the HR comm is also in the sway of GI theory, this is asking you to hear zebras not horses. C has said that all of it's propositions are within judicial knowledge.

None of the 4 props fall into that category. Proportionality - there was not a breach of 1992 regs, there were separate facilities elsewhere. The 1st R was not asked to comment on why separate SSS facilities were made available. The C asks you to draw inferences on production of docs. Most of the additions in July, were from C.

Another link to prison stats re trans sex offenders %
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Fwbdwh9XoAA6yD9.jpg:large

from herald
10:43am
Russell says there was not a breach of 1992 Workforce Regulations Act because there were separate facilities for people who did not want to share a space with a transwoman.
10:42am
Ms Russell says that courts should not make findings which are not evidenced-based.

Thanks. I really want to hear the amendment but I can't bear to listen to any more of her waffly submissions!

The arguments for not producing Jamie O'Doyle are laughable.

Did she actually say that? Males?
Any judge who has been a judge for any length of time will know males are more violent. She’s implying the judge is an extremist by knowing this.

Bizarre.

I now can't hear JR at all.

You raise a very interesting point. The hardline trans activists are actually in line with their ideology and, in their eyes, people like JR are transphobic because they want to allow only the "good ones" in while excluding the "bad ones" when there's no way to discriminate. JR is like Nicola Sturgeon and her "rapist gender".

"Discussing Sandie Peggie's conduct on Christmas Eve 2023, she says it was "objectible"."

I hope she did use the word 'objectible' but I suspect the Herald has misquoted!

Observer: What there's 15 minutes left?

Too long!