NHS Fife tries to silence nurse - Sandie Peggie vs NHS Fife Health Board and Dr Beth Upton - thread #23

[nauticant]

Sandie Peggie, a nurse at Victoria Hospital in Kirkcaldy (VH), has brought claims in the employment tribunal against her employer; Fife Health Board (the Board) and another employee, Dr B Upton. Ms Peggie’s claims are of sexual harassment, harassment related to a protected belief, indirect discrimination and victimisation. Dr Upton claims to be a transwoman, that is observed as male at birth but asserting a female gender identity.

The Employment Tribunal hearing started on Monday 3 February 2025 and was expected to last 2 weeks. However, after 2 weeks it was not complete and it adjourned part-heard. It is planned that it will resume on 16 July and the last day of evidence will be 28 July and then there will be 2 days of submissions from counsel meaning that the hearing will end on 30 July.

The hearing commenced with Sandie Peggie giving evidence. Dr Beth Upton gave evidence from Thursday 6 February to Wednesday 12 February.

Access to view the hearing remotely was obtainable by sending an email request to [email protected] headed Public Access Request (Peggie v Fife Health Board) 4104864/2024 and requesting access.

However, as a result of problems with the livestreaming, apparently caused by a very large number of observers, remote public access to the hearing was suspended on Tuesday 11 February. It was suggested that it might be reinstated at some point but don't count on it.

The hearing is being live tweeted by https://x.com/tribunaltweets and there's additional information here: https://tribunaltweets.substack.com/p/peggie-vs-fife-health-board-and-dr. This also has threadreaderapp archives of live-tweeting of the sessions of the hearing for those who can't follow on Twitter, for example: archive.is/xkSxy.

An alternative to Twitter is to use Nitter: https://nitter.poast.org/tribunaltweets

Thread 1: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5186317-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse
Thread 2: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5267591-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-thread-2
Thread 3: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5268347-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-3
Thread 4: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5268942-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-4
Thread 5: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5269149-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-5
Thread 6: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5269635-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-6
Thread 7: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5270365-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-7
Thread 8: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5271511-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-8
Thread 9: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5271596-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-9
Thread 10: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5271723-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-10
Thread 11: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5272046-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-11
Thread 12: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5272276-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-12
Thread 13: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5272398-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-13
Thread 14: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5272939-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-14
Thread 15: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5273119-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-15
Thread 16: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5273636-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-16
Thread 17: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5273827-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-17
Thread 18: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5274332-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-18
Thread 19: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5274571-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-19
Thread 20: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5275782-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-20
Thread 21: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5276925-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-21
Thread 22: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5280174-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-22

OMG! NC not KC? FFS! NC KC ASAP!!

Just coming on to comment on the Holyrood article about Naomi. Isn’t she wonderful.

It's something you have to pay a huge chunk of money for. And it doesn't mean you're any better, or have a better reputation in your field, than somebody who hasn't forked out to get there.

I relate a great deal to NC's description of herself. I'm not the cleverest solicitor, academically, that you'll ever meet. What I am though, is very good at practising my area of law, and teaching others how to do it as well. I'm very proud of the work I do with my mentees!

I wish I practised employment law though (in another life that would've been my niche), as I'd have had a chance to work with NC then. I think it would be a brilliant experience.

Thank you for the explanation of what being a KC involves, NoWordForFluffy, I was just riffing on the wave of love for NC and the general belief that she deserves canonisation, but KC would do
I'm sure your mentees think highly of you too

I’ve managed to find the address of London Outer Temple Chambers offices but where’s MG working please? As of October it seems like she’s no longer a director of the firm she’s been at?

Law Society Scotland has her here.

A suggested alternative to a card - how about making donations to an appropriate cause, like we did in memory of SP's father? We could reference NC & MG or have a 'code' that made it clear it was our way of saluting them.

https://morningstaronline.co.uk/article/wake-call-trade-union-movement

'Peggie’s trade union, the RCN refused to represent her. The Peggie case has placed trade unions in a highly unflattering spotlight before their majority female memberships. And this is not going away. A similar tribunal case involving a group of nurses in Darlington begins soon. It would be surprising if unions were not doing a pretty quick reassessment of their positions, as Labour has done — although more likely it might be a long wait. Both the Scottish TUC and Unite issued public statements condemning the Scottish Labour leadership for its about turn on the GRR (Scotland) Act.'

Shocked that the RCN failed Sandy Peggie so badly.

I like that idea! Maybe a donation to Beira's Place? I know JKR is supporting it, but there's no reason she should do it single-handed and it might offer them a chance to expand.

Beira’s Place doesn’t take donations (I know, I offered). I believe this is so that they can remain independent and therefore can set their own rules about who they serve. Or something along those lines.

If it could be arranged - Tribunal Tweets?

Or Murray Blackburn Mackenzie? I’m pretty sure they are funded by donations.

Yes! There are only two of them I believe, and doing this unfunded. I saw something from them about this on Twitter recently.

I like the suggestion of MBM, but we'd have to come to an agreement if it was going to be a joint FWR venture. And would MBM want a bloc of donations?
Donate
We work independently and do not receive any government or other public funding. You can make a donation to support our work in one of the following ways.
Donate - Murray Blackburn Mackenzie

Edinburgh Women's Aid has been recently suggested for donations.

Or one of the Afghanistan charities working with women - Amar Foundation, Linda Norgrove.

MBM, ForwomenScotland, Tribunal Tweets are all good suggestions, though!

My thoughts would be, feel free to make a donation to whatever cause speaks to your heart, and then send a card to NC and/or MG and tell them that you’ve made a donation to X or Y in thanks for their (NC’s and MG’s) work for women’s rights.

I really liked the way NC spoke about herself and her career. It underlines that the best contributions in life are not necessarily made by the brightest or smartest but those who make really good use of their skills and talents. It does help to find the right niche.

I think sending a message directly matters.

Donations to worthwhile causes are great, but SP only knew about the ones to her father's memorial charity because it was her father's. Donations to a random charity won't have the same effect as a gesture of thanks (especially as - if given a choice - the person might not have picked that charity themselves).

And like the cards to SP's hospital it's not only about letting the individual know they're appreciated, it's a.mesaage to those around them.

This is where codes might be helpful although maybe not all banks allow you to write a memo note with a payment. (Just been looking at MBM options.)

FWR Peggie?

If you wanted a non-random charity, NC is actually the chair of Sex Matters.

Ah, now that's a good suggestion, very appropriate thanks SqueakyDinosaur.
NC and MG can be told what we're up to so they can bask in the reflected support
Cards too, if you want of course, but the way I see it, a card is going to be £2.50-£3ish and a stamp is soon going to be £1.70, and all that money could be diverted to a good cause.

I 'vote' for donations to Sex Matters, and card-sending if you want.

I don't know what her academic qualifications are like, but watching her work there is no doubt she is skilled at her job, and very clever and quick thinking. She understates her ability.

If there's a consensus for donating to Sex Matters as a gesture of appreciation and admiration for Naomi Cunningham and Margaret Gribbon, here's where to do it.

There's space for a comment, but it looks like if you tick the 'make my donation anonymous' box, that applies to the comment too?
I'll email them to clarify that; ideally we should be able to keep our names off the donation, but be able to write in a suitable comment re MG and NC.
Make a one-off donation - Sex Matters

I've just emailed Sex Matters about whether withholding your name also means you can't add a comment, I'll update you when I get an answer.