NHS Fife tries to silence nurse - Sandie Peggie vs NHS Fife Health Board and Dr Beth Upton - thread #17

[nauticant]

Sandie Peggie, a nurse at Victoria Hospital in Kirkcaldy (VH), has brought claims in the employment tribunal against her employer; Fife Health Board (the Board) and another employee, Dr B Upton. Ms Peggie’s claims are of sexual harassment, harassment related to a protected belief, indirect discrimination and victimisation. Dr Upton claims to be a transwoman, that is observed as male at birth but asserting a female gender identity.

The Employment Tribunal hearing started on Monday 3 February 2025 and was expected to continue for 2 weeks. However, it is going to overrun and there will be an adjournment with the hearing resuming in July (current best estimate). The hearing commenced with Sandie Peggie giving evidence. Dr Beth Upton gave evidence from Thursday 6 February to Wednesday 12 February.

Access to view the hearing remotely was obtainable by sending an email request to [email protected] headed Public Access Request (Peggie v Fife Health Board) 4104864/2024 and requesting access.

However, as a result of problems with the livestreaming, apparently caused by a very large number of observers, remote public access to the hearing was suspended on Tuesday 11 February. It was suggested that it might be reinstated at some point but don't count on it.

The hearing is being live tweeted by https://x.com/tribunaltweets and there's additional information here: https://tribunaltweets.substack.com/p/peggie-vs-fife-health-board-and-dr. This also has threadreaderapp archives of live-tweeting of the sessions of the hearing for those who can't follow on Twitter, for example: archive.is/xkSxy.

An alternative to Twitter is to use Nitter: https://nitter.poast.org/tribunaltweets

Thread 1: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5186317-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse
Thread 2: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5267591-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-thread-2
Thread 3: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5268347-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-3
Thread 4: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5268942-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-4
Thread 5: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5269149-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-5
Thread 6: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5269635-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-6
Thread 7: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5270365-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-7
Thread 8: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5271511-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-8
Thread 9: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5271596-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-9
Thread 10: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5271723-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-10
Thread 11: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5272046-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-11
Thread 12: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5272276-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-12
Thread 13: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5272398-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-13
Thread 14: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5272939-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-14
Thread 15: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5273119-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-15
Thread 16: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5273636-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-16

Continuation thread: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5274332-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-18

This is showing how foolish it is to rotate your globe around an axis as contested and irrational - nebulous, you could say - as the concept of transgenderism. The centre cannot hold and things, and witnesses, fall apart.

It gives me so much hope to know there are so many of us out there, cheering her on.

A few years ago you could be forgiven for thinking from reading mainstream media that we were an aberration.

NC [look at new doc, reads re issue is sharing CR]
ED That's what initiated IX
NC WHat worried u
That and pat safety
NC One obvious mitigation for CR wld be not to have overapping shifts, but another to find single occupancy room for DU

Aye, we all know that a single occupancy room was not acceptable to DU because . . . reasons.

(including, but not limited to - the lockers were in the female changing room - so offered a locker in the corridor outside - refused because this would be “othering” . . . )

Of course the real reason is “I want to be in with the ladies!”

The women ARE the resource.

So if ED was investigating, she shouldn’t have been because she was a witness
and if she wasn’t investigating then SP was suspended without an investigation?

Check mate

edited spelling

It's private to you - at the end of the thread let @nauticant know your numbers

I'm learning - that's concrete evidence you know flounces off looking supercilious

The petition to "fully" repeal the GRA has hit 4000 signatures. That's 1000 more than when I came across it last night. Someone was worried it wouldn't hit the target... I think there's no need to worry.

NC Letter 3 Feb confirming SX and IX still ongoing?

Yes

NC So SP told IX ongoing

AS wrote letter. Still waiting SP was fir for the IX

NC Did u talk to anyone else

No, IX hadnt started yet

NC Shld have said IX is stalled

ED Or waiting to commence

Add me to the count.

I’m of a mind that the reason they replaces KD was because they needed an more serious allegation for a formal complaint in order to justify extended suspension and knew that KD didn’t have the sophistication of AG and which would be required to massage the patient safety ‘incidents’ to a suitable level of risk.

Ianal but I have taken an ex employer to ET and from my experience the relevant nhs policies would be in the bundle for reference and to show how Fife blatantly disregarded them.

I’m not a robot and I am biological so………all together now…..

Off the investigation again....

Lurking too. I have a lot to lose (family members, job) if anyone knew how I feel on these matters. Thanks to all who speak out.

Christopher McKenna is the medical director for NHS Fife

https://www.nhsfife.org/about-us/senior-management-team/senior-management-team/chris-mckenna/

Oh now I'm going to have the beatles stuck in my head all day.

NC Suspension revoked in March. MG says to AW, [reads re revoked] Reinstated in late March due rota problems

ED I dont think was reinstated. We asked her re day shifts for senior support.

NC Page 322, Lottie Myles says [reads re reinstating SX due to not wanting to work days]

I work in healthcare and have also following the case. Lots of discussions at home and at work

This is why I say there's a real problem with EDs competence that has nothing to do with trans issues.

You have a blithering idiot who is unfamiliar with Trust policy on suspensions. This could have been a problem for any incident.

It this case it's combined with an inability to understand safeguarding/equality issues are not hierarchical.

She's over promoted above her ability I'm afraid.

And that's going to hang over her future career.

ED Not my recollection that reinstated. SP on A/L in April and returned [describes work pattern]

NC Shld have been a RA for SX at each stage eg extension of SX and when revoked?

ED I was involved in 1st RA but AS involved later

NC Have seen one RA [finding docs]

What is an RA?

AHH but back then it was two of you and a basket of socks. 🧦🧦🧦🧦🧦🧦🧦

Same!

ED Lottie wrote it

'Do it to [insert name here]'

I would bet on Fife having someone in the room who may have had a "friendly work" they wouldn't want to risk a trail of messages that might be revealed