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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Urgent action for those in Scotland

382 replies

SusanSmithFWS · 05/12/2020 18:58

The amazing Johann Lamont has put in an amendment to the forensic medical services bill. This is a really important piece of legislation which seeks to make the process easier for rape victims and we support it. We are concerned, however, that although the women who testified that access to a female examiner was the most important concern, the bill still refers to the gender - instead of sex - of the examiner.

Sex, unlike gender, is defined in the Equality Act and there is provision for recruitment under schedule 9. We believe that a small change will ensure that there is no ambiguity.

We would urge anyone from Scotland to please write to all eight of their MSPs and ask them to support the motion.

As Susan Dalgety reported in the Scotsman:
Her amendment may be only six words long – “for the word ‘gender’ substitute ‘sex’” – but it gets to the heart of the current debate about who counts as a woman.

“Women should be able to choose the sex of the person who conducts the investigation,” Johann told me last night. “This is a key test for the Parliament, which is committed to rooting action in the understanding of experience. Women courageously and powerfully spoke up so that others might fare better than them.

“The amendment is tiny but would be a huge step in listening to survivors. The committee was convinced. The Parliament should be too.”

Six words can make a world of difference.

www.scotsman.com/news/opinion/columnists/transgender-debate-msps-must-stand-womens-sex-based-rights-key-vote-bill-help-rape-victims-susan-dalgety-3057640

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Motherhubbardinthecellar · 08/12/2020 12:08

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Morechocolateneeded · 08/12/2020 12:18

I've had 2 positive replies. Sadly, that suggests that the others will not be supporting the amendment. In which case there are a lot of fuckers in the Scottish Parliament. Does nobody go into politics to do the right thing anymore? Is it all just careerism and fuck the electorate?

ArabellaScott · 08/12/2020 12:28

Is it all just careerism and fuck the electorate?

It certainly looks that way.

ItsAllGoingToBeFine · 08/12/2020 13:07

Apparently in their report the Scottish government claim they are "not immediately convinced there is legislative ambiguity"

But if that is the case the use of sex instead would also not cause legislative ambiguity, and would also mean they get all of these people off their back. There is no reason for them not to use sex.

Gibbonsgibbonsgibbons · 08/12/2020 13:20

"not immediately convinced there is legislative ambiguity" and they’d like as much ambiguity as possible Hmm

Not a single reply here but still time for others to email Grin

Dances · 08/12/2020 13:31

I have had a reply from my MSP saying that the Scottish Conservatives are going to support Johann Lamont's amendment to the Bill to change gender to sex

ItsAllGoingToBeFine · 08/12/2020 13:33

@Dances

I have had a reply from my MSP saying that the Scottish Conservatives are going to support Johann Lamont's amendment to the Bill to change gender to sex
If the SNP vote against the amendment they are going to look really bad for the next election...
Gibbonsgibbonsgibbons · 08/12/2020 13:36

That’s great news Dances

TheShadowyFeminist · 08/12/2020 13:51

Rape Crisis Scotland Tweet

Suggesting there's 'misinformation' being spread about, yet switch off replies while they suggest that the language of the bill doesn't matter.

This org is shameful in how its operating, denying women the language they asked for and telling the world it doesn't matter.

ItsAllGoingToBeFine · 08/12/2020 13:55

Ooh. First response and they will be supporting the amendment (Labour)

ItsAllGoingToBeFine · 08/12/2020 13:57

@TheShadowyFeminist

Rape Crisis Scotland Tweet

Suggesting there's 'misinformation' being spread about, yet switch off replies while they suggest that the language of the bill doesn't matter.

This org is shameful in how its operating, denying women the language they asked for and telling the world it doesn't matter.

Fucking hell. What is wrong with them!

All these people saying that sex vs gender makes no difference, then fighting incredibly hard to make sure "gender" remains in the Bill...

ArabellaScott · 08/12/2020 13:58

That's good to hear, Dances. Not heard back yet but I hope my Conservative MSPs will be supportive, then.

And hopefully at least some Labour.

Let's hope the SNP women's pledge is making some waves - I read an article this morning that said it was stirring things up.

ArabellaScott · 08/12/2020 13:59

All these people saying that sex vs gender makes no difference, then fighting incredibly hard to make sure "gender" remains in the Bill...

Aye, you can have any colour you like so long as it's pink.

terryleather · 08/12/2020 14:03

Is it all just careerism and fuck the electorate?

I'd say it's partly this but throw in institutional capture, liberal narcissism and the spread of genderist ideology/ critical theory etc and we end up where we are...and where we are is pretty bloody shitty for females and their rights.

And while writing this I've just had a response from one of my Labour MSPs to say she will be supporting the amendment. Excellent.

Dances · 08/12/2020 14:12

Maybe they have finally realised that isn't the vote winner they thought...

I have thought for some time that Gender Ideology would be what brought the SNP down. I still think so. Do they really think the '45' plus the extra they need are all genderists?

Dances · 08/12/2020 14:15

There is nothing that would persuade me to vote SNP now. They have proven themselves to be unworthy of looking after our freedoms.

terryleather · 08/12/2020 14:28

I can't say I'm wise to the internal machinations of the SNP but it looks to me like the factional war going on within the party is partly being fought through each side's stance on genderism.

It's shocking that our rights are being used as an ideological/tribal battleground.

ArabellaScott · 08/12/2020 16:27

www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2020/dec/07/sturgeon-faces-growing-snp-rebellion-over-leadership-style

It's one of a couple of issues, I think.

terryleather · 08/12/2020 16:46

That's an interesting article Arabella, quite a few different things going on within the SNP.

Can't believe they want to bring back Salmond though, he was an odious wee man even before the court case that was brought against him - have a few friends who work in the civil service and the stories they tell...

ScoldsBridle · 08/12/2020 16:54

I’ve just got a reply from one of the MSPs who was very polite but informs me that as Presiding Officer for the Scottish Parliament and the Chair on Thursday‘s Bill he cannot vote on the amendment. I thought his name was very familiar (Ken MacIntosh). He thanked me for sharing my thoughts and my interest though Smile

I also got a good reply from from Maurice Correy (Scottish Conservatives) saying they will support the amendment.

Still to hear off 2 Labour, 2 Conservatives and the lovely Ross Greer..,

sparkysdream · 08/12/2020 17:05

I’ve got one positive reply from my Tory MSP, nothing from the list ones.

Gibbonsgibbonsgibbons · 08/12/2020 17:16

Getting paranoid mine have me on a “do not reply” list Confused

MsF1t · 08/12/2020 17:21

Just wrote to all 8- and then saw the comments about Write To Them. Sigh.

GreyishDays · 08/12/2020 17:28

Can anyone summarise what I should say and then I’ll reword it? I’m worried if I get it wrong it’s worse than not saying anything.

terryleather · 08/12/2020 17:31

Getting paranoid mine have me on a “do not reply” list

I worry about that too, but then I remember when I first became aware of the magnitude of what was happening to our rights under this assault from genderists and their ideology and how it seemed overwhelming.

I decided then that even if the ship went down I couldn't live with myself if I didn't try to do something to stop it, no matter how small and insignificant. If that means my MSPs get sick of seeing my name so be it Grin

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