Stephen King retweets JKR

[ScrimpshawTheSecond]

A Dworkin quote.

Benny have you looked at the link yet?

@exLtEveDallas

I don't think that any man should be able to walk into a female space because he's said he identifies as a female. There should be a process and someone with everyone's best interests at heart should approve you before you can access them? Fair compromise?

And how would we know he’d ‘been through a process’? Surely the fairer ways would be either a third space option that is mixed sex for anyone that doesn’t mind, or for men to be more welcoming of transwomen in their spaces?

You know what actually a third space option would absolutely be the best option. There are reasons not to Trans people use female spaces and there are reasons to let them use female spaces.

Yea like a card, and if someone entered a space but didn't have the card they would be in trouble as they would be if they were just a regular offender

Also, this is transphobic as fuck, according to Stonewall. Careful now.

‘This would never happen, you would scream and he'd be dealt with. There's been some good points made on here. But everyone on both sides of this focuses on the extreme exceptions to the rule rather than the vast majority who are the people actually living this who want to harm no one or take advantage of no one it becomes so emotionally charged‘

I think what you’re missing here, Benny10, is just how un-extreme and horribly common sexual assaults and flashing are. It’s not the sort of thing that happens to a few women occasionally, it’s virtually every woman a number of times. And we all have experiences of being disbelieved, of shouting out and being ignored, of being punished in some way for making a fuss. Remember #MeToo? What do you think that was all about?

The problem is that although the vast majority of transwomen aren’t flashers or peeping toms themselves, by opening our spaces to anyone who claims to be trans, you’re making it inevitable that there will be even more shit for women to put up with. We will be victimised even more and even younger. That’s not extreme, it’s tedious, shitty reality.

[quote Benny10]@RHOBHfan
Aren't lots of transgender women working in prostitution and often killed and raped by men especially in less developed countries?[/quote]
Killed and raped by men, yes. Prostitution is awfully dangerous for its practitioners, largely cos the type of men who use them are scum.

Ah right so a kind of we dont want them so you Ave them? Doesn't that miss the point a bit?

They are already yours. I am asking that males stop rejecting other males from the category male for superficial reasons.

Benny third spaces have been roundly rejected as hateful. Sorry.

@TehBewilderness

Ah right so a kind of we dont want them so you Ave them? Doesn't that miss the point a bit?

They are already yours. I am asking that males stop rejecting other males from the category male for superficial reasons.

Hear hear

Screaming is so old hat. Moving away and tutting is the woke option.

Oh bless. Benny, mate. Third spaces don’t validate transwomen as women and anyone who suggests third spaces is a bigot.
Naked men are already in women’s changing rooms. You are allowed to ask if they have a GRC. (Stella Creasy suggested that any teenage girls traumatized by erect penises in showers could be offered therapy.) that’s alright innit? 13yo girls are just unfortunate collateral damage when viewed against the rights of men to bring their penises into women’s changing spaces.
You are so unbelievably fucking naive and arrogant you genuinely don’t think women have been through all of your new shiny ideas Already and been told to fuck off.

Benny, Almost every single woman I have read or spoken to about this issue has said the fair compromise is the third space. Conversely almost every single transwoman has shouted it down, often with threats or TERF/Bigot calling.

The Vancouver Rape Relief Shelter was defunded by a Transwoman politician because they refused to open their doors to males - they even offered a third space. Defunded. Females that have been raped have no safe space to recover because a man demanded to be let in. Can you see now why we feel the way we do?

@SirSamuelVimesBlackboardMonito
I will read it now.

@robin1984 put it better than I ever could, seems like the reasonable take on the whole thing. Why such impassioned opposition against trans people when they are the vulnerable the majority of the time? Just don't get it, straight men are far more of a threat.

Benny, you are sounding more transphobic by the post I'm afraid to say!

Also:

That I as a man might identify as a woman to get ahead in my career?

Yes, exactly this!

Google Laurel Hubbard, Fallon Fox, Hannah Mouncey, Rachel McKinnon. Males mediocre at their sports who are suddenly doing very well!

Google Pips Bunce - bog standard fairly successful but ten a penny bloke working in Credit Suisse. Starts wearing dresses into the office a few days a week and suddenly is in Financial Times Champion of Business lists.

Lily Madigan became a women's officer - looking at their old Twitter feed and their TV appearances, I would imagine that they would struggle to have got anywhere near a Labour officers position if they were not transgender.

@TehBewilderness

Ah right so a kind of we dont want them so you Ave them? Doesn't that miss the point a bit?

They are already yours. I am asking that males stop rejecting other males from the category male for superficial reasons.

by this logic would you be happy to accept very male looking trans men into these spaces as you consider them women?

Sorry, typo. Aren’t allowed to ask if they have a GRC.
Transwomen must not at any cost be asked to prove their rights. No certificates. No badges. That is totes outing and puts them in immediate danger of their very lives. They must be allowed to access wherever whenever they want, with no barriers, and no justification.

You know what actually a third space option would absolutely be the best option. There are reasons not to Trans people use female spaces and there are reasons to let them use female spaces.

Thank you! Now can you convince Stonewall about your ingenious solution please?

[quote Benny10]@RHOBHfan
Aren't lots of transgender women working in prostitution and often killed and raped by men especially in less developed countries?[/quote]
Are they?

On a macro scale similar numbers of trans women prostitutes are killed and raped by men as biological women?

Source?

That was for @Benny10

We know it's men who are the threat. Has this just occurred to you? We want to be separated from men linguistically, legally, and in some circumstances, physically. That's the whole fucking point!

This would never happen, you would scream and he'd be dealt with.

You would scream and he'd be dealt with........until gender self ID is introduced. Under self ID - you scream, and then they say they identify as a woman - aka they ARE a woman - and you're called a nasty transphobe, or asked to leave yourself. A woman was famously banned from a gym (Planet something or other) for objecting to a male in a female changing room.

You really don't know what you're talking about - or what women are dealing with here - do you?

Just don't get it, straight men are far more of a threat

Statistically they’re the same level of threat.

I’d love to see your evidence that they’re less of a threat than straight men.

Drums nails whilst patiently waiting

by this logic would you be happy to accept very male looking trans men into these spaces as you consider them women?

Happy to accept a female into a female space? Of course. It’s a female space. For females.

by this logic would you be happy to accept very male looking trans men into these spaces as you consider them women?

Is it all about passing then, for you? Interesting. Because we sure as hell aren't happy to let very male looking male men into those spaces, which appears to be what the TRAs want?

@Smallsteps88

by this logic would you be happy to accept very male looking trans men into these spaces as you consider them women?

Happy to accept a female into a female space? Of course. It’s a female space. For females.

Also it isn’t up to females to decide whether other females get into female spaces based on their appearance. All females are entitled to be in female spaces. No one gets to “accept” it or not accept it.

This would never happen, you would scream and he'd be dealt with

Fucking hell, do you realise you’re essentially telling sexual assault victims that they should have screamed louder so the attackers would be dealt with.

I mean, I’m sure that’s not how you meant it, but that is literally how it comes accross