Sunday Times: PM to scrap plan to make gender change easier

[HeyBells]

Just seen this on Twitter. Anyone got a sharetoken please?

@HPFA

But you don't need a gender recognition certificate to do that.

Maybe not but if it helps the lives of trans people and doesn't interfere with women's rights then what's the issue?

But it does interfere with women's rights.

How does it help trans people?

The Rebecca Root piece contains the statement that women are afraid of trans people in their spaces. I’d like to say that I’m afraid of men in women’s spaces. I’m not afraid of people because they are trans.

Root’s piece is just waffle bollocks opinion column.
Presumably there to ‘balance’ the front page story, (which no doubt some will be clamouring for denounce as transphobic). It’s pretty smart of the Times to run the two together. Root will convince no one of anything.

Can someone educate me about mermaids?

RR said self id isn’t ‘about’ men wearing dresses to rape and attack women. But that’s bloody well what is going to happen if they allow self ID though isn’t it Rebecca?

It's not even a question of waiting for the law to change or wearing a dress.

The "everyone is who they say they are" dogma has already convinced M&S that they have to allow men into any changing room, because to do otherwise would be, as RR puts it, to ask them to justify their existence.

The irony is that the politicians doing most to fight this are Baroness Nicholson and Joanna Cherry, LibDem and SNP.

It's not even a question of waiting for the law to change or wearing a dress.

The "everyone is who they say they are" dogma has already convinced M&S that they have to allow men into any changing room, because to do otherwise would be, as RR puts it, to ask them to justify their existence.

This. This is what keeps getting missed by the many many newspaper inches given to the subject.

I think Baroness N is a Tory peer? She was a Tory MP originally and switched to Lib Dems, then rejoined the conservatives before taking her seat in the Lords.

Can someone educate me about mermaids?
This is a fast moving thread, perhaps better to use the search function for that.
In short, they were a small charity until Susie Green took them over. They aren't experts in anything but are consulted as such. Green's gay son was operated upon in Thailand for his 16th birthday leading to Thailand changing the law and putting in an age limit of 18.
They contributed to the ITV drama where the child threatens suicide to make his parents get back together...
Lots of drama and emotional blackmail and fake stats about child suicide.

Sorry you are right BingBong - switched back to Conservative in 2016.

Also, Mermaids tried to prosecute a transsexual for transphobia:

www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.spectator.co.uk/article/a-collapsed-case-shows-the-perils-of-policing-transphobia-/amp

And groom kids into thinking there must be something wrong with them by targeting advertising at nerdy kids:

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3710451-question-about-mermaids-ad-on-youtube?pg=1

So much for a support group for parents!

Rebecca Root was the person, I believe, who challenged a rape survivor (on national tv) who had been in a rape refuge, over what constitutes a woman. With the never to be forgotten, unutterably tone deaf assertion that their mother had had a hysterectomy and does that mean they are not a woman?

In an attempt to discredit the rape survivor who was 'unwittingly' speaking of a woman as someone who had female anatomy. Given that they had been raped by their female anatomy being used, it was bloody shameful of Root.

Oops, didn't mean to bold that

Yes and mermaids provide official training to organisations but misrepresent the actual law and use awful stereotypes that make most kids "trans" by default.
National Lottery has given them tons of money, the last big grant was half a million so I closed my account.

And yes, self ID has been implemented by the likes of Topshop, Marks & Spencer's and John Lewis. But, they are responding to what they think is public opinion, and the wrong interpretation of equality law.

They're in the business of making money, not losing money through ideological positions.

Once the changes that the government are suggesting take hold, they will soon find themselves very firmly in a minority that is obvious.

Once the changes that the government are suggesting take hold, they will soon find themselves very firmly in a minority that is obvious.
I'm not so sure. Most GC people (most people full stop) don't sit online screaming on Twitter. And unless we see bigger numbers of male predators (reported as such and not as women) in their changing rooms, they could just as easily ignore all this. It's less hassle to piss us off than it is to piss them off.
I mean, we all want there not to be ANY male predators of course. I'm just saying that unless there is, or boycotts become widespread enough to affect turnover, they might just ignore it all.

A “distraction” - like my poor brain can’t cope with two things at once. How can I possibly have an opinion about sex based rights and still try to make my voice known about the governments handling of Covid

I agree that the whole point of a consultation on anything is for issues to be raised and analysed. It's not a vote. It doesn't actually matter that 70% of the responses were in favour of self id, if people on the other side raised issues that the government would deem a problem.

And boy, did we raise some issues!

I have little idea of whether a GRC certificate should be necessary or not.

But since they've been around since 2004 and for most of that time don't seem to have caused much controversy or trouble I can't see why they should be a hill to die on.

But if people want to campaign about it then they're free to do so.

thanks for the advice re mermaids.

HPFA
Are you not aware of the changes being proposed to the GRA by the UK and Scottish governments?

The problem with the certificates now is that they're very easy to get, despite the whinging online. Several people have tweeted about getting their certificates easily after ticking enough boxes.

But since they've been around since 2004 and for most of that time don't seem to have caused much controversy or trouble I can't see why they should be a hill to die on.

A GRC is the difference between a male being automatically housed in a female prison or having to go through some kind of assessment first.

That seems like a pretty important hill for the incarcerated female people locked in with males.

Joking aside, I’m very fearful this will just harden the SNP’s stance to be more ‘progressive’ than Westminster.

Sadly this is my big fear too...

Joking aside, I’m very fearful this will just harden the SNP stance to be more progressive than Westminster

Do you think this is in part is similar to what has happened with Canada and the Democrats?

Clear dividing line with Trump - new cause to ‘progress’ over.

Re Mermaids, this is worth reading to understand the claptrap they are peddling as “training”. This is a transcript from one of their training sessions.

tradfem.wordpress.com/2019/06/24/pesky-fly-on-the-wall-account-of-a-mermaidstm-training-session-_-introducing-the-genderbread-person/