Woman's Hour Tues 20/11/18 "Why is the current debate about sex and gender so often called “toxic” - we hear from @Bex_Stinson and @helenlewis"

[MrsSnippyPants]

twitter.com/BBCWomansHour/status/1064804876327235584

CaptainWarbeck I've only just read your post. I absolutely think you are on to something there

CaptainWarbeck That's a good point, and I suspect that surprise/ignorance of female experience might well be a contributing factor. Although it's also important, IMO, not to underestimate the emotional high to be had from seeing oneself as a member of a hated but righteous and 'special' vanguard of liberation. And the whole group-think ideology is there on social media, ready-made to step into.

Excellent point @CaptainWarbeck

I think you’ve hit the nail on the head there.

Teamed with the whole group-think ideology.. there on social media, ready-made to step into as decscribed by @kesstrel - powerful drivers for a campaign that will aggressively drive it’s own agenda at the expense of anyone perceived as ‘getting in the way’

Yes, I think you're right there Captain

And IMO anyone who disregards the clear guidelines published by the Samaritans are the ones who would have blood on their hands

The work has been going on quietly, stealthily and utterly ruthlessly behind the scenes, with HUGE success.

Bex Stinson has in fact boasted about this. About not having everyone at the table. Meetings with select people. Certainly not asking the public.

I wish Jane had moved Bex away from talking about the danger she, Bex, poses personally to the danger transwomen may pose as a group. I thought they were going to go there but then it veered off!

I guess that wasn't the point of the discussion though and hopefully most would have seen through the obvious dodging of the real question and made the link to #NAMALT (not all men are like that) themselves.

Thanks for bringing my attention to this, just listened. Helen came across very well. What came across strongly was that Bex simply wasn’t in the room (by their choice).

Jonny Best comment:
twitter.com/JonnnyBest/status/1065387327793635329

embedded link in tweet:
'Please join us in asking Stonewall to reconsider its transgender policies and approach'
(extract)
"Stonewall’s promotion of the concept of 'gender identity’, which has it that a man or woman is anyone (of either sex) who identifies as such, is also undermining the basis of lesbian, gay and bisexual identities as orientated around same-sex attraction. Lesbians in particular are coming under pressure to accept male-bodied trans women into their spaces and as sexual partners.

At the moment, Stonewall is failing in three key ways:

By uncritically adopting a form of transgender politics which undermines the sex-based rights of women and the concept of homosexuality itself
By refusing to recognise the diversity of viewpoints on these issues, including among LGBT people.
By seeking to prevent public debate of these issues by branding as transphobic anyone who questions Stonewall’s current trans policies.
We call on Stonewall to:

Acknowledge that there are a range of valid viewpoints around sex, gender and transgender politics
Acknowledge specifically the conflict that exists between transgenderism and sex-based women’s rights
Commit to fostering an atmosphere of respectful debate, rather than demonising as transphobic those who wish to discuss or dissent from Stonewall’s current policies" (continues)
www.ipetitions.com/petition/dear-stonewall-please-reconsider-your-approach