Hampstead Heath Women's Pond

[Gacapa]

Hampstead Heath ladies say swimming pond is not gender fluid

dailym.ai/2El0eLA

Here we go...

[LangCleg]

Mental health charities specifically for men because of the rate of suicides... could go on.

Actually, JumpedOverTheMoon, men have a higher rate of completed suicide than women but lower rates of suicide attempts and suicidal ideation than women. Why? Because men use more violent methods and so are successful more often.

The problem, as it always is, is male violence. Even when that violence is turned on the self.

And because the problem is male violence, sex segregated spaces are needed for women regardless of trans or non-trans identification. Men who are trans (TIMs/transwomen) have the same rates of violence as other men. This is why women-only spaces should be women only or, at the very least, open only to post-SRS transsexuals.

[mirialis]

Jumped, I do get where you're coming from in some ways because I was thinking about his too recently - though not in the context of swimming pools - and I'm sure there are people here who would like to have a conversation with you about it but really to get there we need to be able to have an honest and open starting point.

a trans female is a female

I completely get that we don't want to unnecessarily upset people, so no one is going to think you are being horrible for acknowledging this: you know the statement you made there isn't true. You know that a "trans female" doesn't exist and that a "trans woman" is a man who has transitioned identity to that of a woman but is not a female. We all have different opinions about what next beyond that point, but it is important that we start the discussion from that honest starting point.

[BatShite]

So women have actually gained a pool. I am sure a lot of women will be identifying as men to go to the mens pool and be oggled. Rather than keeping things as they were..perfectly fine, womens mens and mixed. No reason at all to make the womens and mens mixed too when a mixed on exists already.

[NaturalBlondeYeahRight]

I’ve just got a reply to my complaint via email. I shall post as I’m quite new to being GC but I’m not sure they are right.

[Gasp0deTheW0nderD0g]

I expect it's identical to mine, NaturalBlonde. Doesn't say much, does it?

[cromeyellow0]

They're wrong.

It is lawful to exclude biological males, including those who identify as transgender women, from single-sex services for women.

It is lawful for a women's club or association to restrict its membership to only those who share the protected characteristic of sex.

Nicola Williams has written a very comprehensive outline here:
fairplayforwomen.com/equality-act-2010_womens-rights

[RagingWoman]

I got an identical reply and have written back to say Youre Wrong! And attached a link to that article (thank you)
The fact that they referred to it as the Equalities Act was the first red flag...

[ForalltheSaints]

NaturalBlondeYeahRight I had a similar response the week before last. Not exactly the same response as I am a man.

Text below.

'Thank you for taking the time to contact us in relation to the Hampstead Heath Ladies’ Pond.

Transgender women have been able to use the Kenwood Ladies’ Pond, and Transgender men have been able to use the Highgate Men’s Pond since the introduction of the Equalities Act 2010, which prohibits discrimination on the grounds of transgender status. There has been no change in policy, and the way in which people are able to use the ponds has not changed recently.

Staff at Hampstead Heath, including the Lifeguarding Team, undertook Trans awareness training in 2016 and 2017. This training was also extended to user groups who felt that this was valuable and supported this approach.

We are currently working on guidelines, which will further assist our staff and visitors. We will be discussing this further with our user groups early in 2018.

The City of London is committed to gender respect and equality in all forms.

We will continue to work with user groups and visitors to ensure that our facilities are inclusive environments for all, free from discrimination, harassment or victimisation.'

[VivaLeBeaver]

So basically there’s now three mixed pools? Great.

[Fekko]

Can’t they just have a willy pool and a non-willy pool and a either pool?

[ForalltheSaints]

The observation I made in an earlier comment some weeks ago was that men would be less offended if a woman who had not undergone surgery turned up in the men's pond.

I am fairly sure that the men in the men's pond would not feel threatened either.

[EamonnWright]

Can’t they just have a willy pool and a non-willy pool and a either pool

That's what they have but some with willys want in where the non willys are. Any other time in history this would be a red flag but apparently this is progress, just not as you know it.

[CertainHalfDesertedStreets]

I am so looking forward to the summer. We can all go to the men's pool together en famille ('I'm Brian and so is my wife.')

How trans do I have to be? I have short hair and usually wear jeans and flat sandals. But my toenails will be painted and I have tits and a fanjo and XX chromosomes but that'll do it right?

Ds is too young for the swimming ponds but if I coach him to say 'I identify as an eight year old' he'll pass I reckon.

[busyboysmum]

amp.theguardian.com/world/2018/feb/09/debate-over-inclusion-of-trans-women-in-women-only-spaces-intensifies?__twitter_impression=true

[Valentinesfart]

"there's more to being a woman than your genitalia"

Just once I want a reasonable answer to that that encompasses all women. Even if it genuinely includes trabswomen

[IfNot]

A trans woman or otherwise gender non conforming man would be very safe in the men's pond at Hampstead. It's definitely not the sort of crowd that are heavily invested in policing masculinity!

This!!!^
For fucksake. The men at the men's pond are in no way a threat to transsexuals, transvestites, or any man in a bikini.
And even if they were..well, once I would have had sympathy. I would have said " oh, g'wan love, all welcome" and pretended the builder in a one piece was a girl.
Not anymore. Frankly, if trans identifying men are in danger among other men, that's not my problem. The problem is violent MEN, so don't make me and other women responsible for male behaviour.
You want men to be nicer to you? Take it up with them.
I'm RAGING. I spent many a Summer at the ladies pond as a young un. Full of lesbians and you never felt like you had your shave your legs! FUCKERS.

[2rebecca]

If the "lesbian" looked and acted like a man then how do you know the person wasn't male and trans? Your post doesn't make sense unless the person was obviously just a flat chested unfeminine woman who may or may not have been lesbian.

[athingthateveryoneneeds]

#TGLWGH

[JessicaJonesJacket]

Is this part of the strategy of resurrecting old threads to distract posters from discussing current issues? Or is it part of pretending MN is homophobic?
Either way, you're being disingenuous and tedious TutTut.

[AngryAttackKittens]

On top of everything else I'm pretty sure that "lipo in her breast" is not a thing.

There has been a marked increase in the rate of trolly, goady posts and comments. If this is a strategy it's not being executed very well so far.

[athingthateveryoneneeds]

They are quite obvious, bless their cotton socks.

[DamnDeDoubtanceIsSpartacus]

TutTut you're being silly, and homophobic, please stop.

[Kneedeepinunicorns]

Reported. Yawn. Poor HQ.

[LizzieSiddal]

Homophobic nonsense, TutTut.