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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

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a letter to the woman who called me a terf

1000 replies

carrotandcornsoup · 10/12/2017 07:01

To the woman who shrieked at me that I am a bigot and a terf and a hateful transphobe for defending women's rights,

Ten, fifteen years from now, I ask you to remember me.

Remember me when you have your first baby and you're referred to throughout your pregnancy as a birthing individual, a pregnant person, and it makes you feel kind of dehumanised and you wish they'd just call you a woman, a mother, because that's what you are. But they're not allowed, because it's illegal to say only women can be pregnant and give birth.

Remember me when you give birth and you feel vulnerable and exposed and you really want a woman beside you who understands what you're going through and instead your midwife is a six foot man with stubble in a dress and you know he isn't a woman but you're not allowed to object, even when you need to be examined and you just want a woman to do it but you know you can't say anything because that would be hate speech, even though your body is screaming no.

Remember me when your elderly mother, who has lost her mind to dementia, goes into a care home and is told that her carer, Susan, is a woman, because you asked that she only be cared for by women. And even in her addled state of mind, she knows that Susan is a man, and you know Susan is a man, but you cannot object, and she has to allow Susan to perform her intimate care, because to object would be hate speech.

Remember me when your daughter comes home from school crying, the daughter who has spent the last five years training to be the best athlete in her class, her school, her district, she's crying because Lucas in her class, one of the fastest boys, has decided he identifies as female for now and so is allowed to run in her race, and she knows it doesn't matter how hard she trains, he will always beat her, and she can only ever hope for a silver medal now. Or bronze, if there is another Lucas.

Remember me when you go into a toilet late at night, perhaps in a bar, and there's noone else around, and a guy walks in, he has a beard and is wearing jeans and a t shirt, and the way he looks at you seems off, and you feel afraid and unsettled and worried he might hurt you. But you can't challenge him, because if you do he'll say he's a woman and has as much right as you do to be in this toilet, a place where many years ago you might have come to feel safe.

Remember me when you go for a promotion, for a board position at work that's designated for a woman. You've put in the hours, you've worked so hard, you know you deserve it. And the position goes to Lola, who until last year was a 50 year old man. Lola will never do anything inconvenient like needing time off to have babies, or to deal with any health issues that you, a woman might face, like endometriosis, breast cancer, PND. Lola is a woman just like you, and your company are happy that they have fulfilled their quota of women members on the board.

Remember me when you read on the news that crime statistics for women committing rape and murder are on the increase, and now women carry out a much higher number of rapes and murders than they did when you were a teenager or a young woman. And you know that these 'women' are men and that the statistics are wrong, but to challenge this would be hate speech. Remember me too, when these women rapists are locked up with vulnerable women in female prisons and cannot escape, because to challenge the presence of the women rapists with penises in prison with them would be hate speech.

Remember me when your son comes home from school and says that he's learned at school that you can change sex and that some girls have penises and some boys have vaginas and that his teacher said that because he likes playing with girls and dolls that maybe he is really a girl in the wrong body. And you think, no, you are just my wonderful, unique, son, and you were born in your own body. Remember me when a few months down the line the teacher calls you in and says she's concerned that you are not validating your son's identity and that she's noticed you are still referring to him by the name you so carefully chose for him when he was born, and calling him a boy, when he is actually a girl, and that she doesn't want to have to involve social services but she's worried she might have to if you continue to misgender your son and deny his real identity. And you know that she will, because it's happened before in a school near you, and you are afraid.

In this brave new world that you helped to create, look around for your transactivist friends, your lefty male allies, the ones you stood beside and yellled 'terf, transphobe, bigot' with, with you shouting the loudest, because you wanted to show what a good ally you were, how inclusive, how progressive. Where are they now? Why, they are where they always were. Benefitting from the patriarchy. Enjoying the new, improved version of it that you helped them to build by crushing the resistance from the women who spoke up for their rights. This has all cost them nothing; it has made the world a better, easier place for men. It has cost you and your sisters who campaigned with them for virtue cookies, everything.

And me? I'll be where I've always been. Fighting for your rights. Fighting to undo the damage.

I'll have your back, as I always have done.

OP posts:
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LangCleg · 13/12/2017 09:43

There is no such thing as a male brain in a female body or vice versa. Every cell in the human body, except for red blood cells, is sexed male or female, including brain cells. There is some evidence that certain male brains have certain characteristics more commonly associated with female brains and vice versa. But this just means that some male brains are slightly more "feminised" than others. They are still male brains. Additionally, none of the studies the TRAs quote about this have controlled for sexuality. Exactly the same evidence exists that some gay men may have brains that are slightly more "feminised" than the average male brain. The brain is still male, however.

There is no evidence for dualism - that the brain exists independently of the body.

Madhairday · 13/12/2017 09:50

Incredible post, OP. It was brought home to me when my DD (17) read it over my shoulder and started crying. I asked her what was wrong, and she said that it was going to be her children affected by this, wasn't it, and that nearly everyone her age went along with the narrative. The other week she lost a good friend because DD questioned the sense of a known rapist being in a women's prison. Friend said she was a transphobic terf and slurred her all over social media Sad DD didn't know how to respond to this so just blocked her and hasn't talked to her since.

DDS reaction to this has horrified me and made me wake up to itall the more. I need to do something. But we are so silenced.

Aeroflotgirl · 13/12/2017 10:49

Thanks very much, I was like 😶. What is Terf btw, bit embarassed to as earlier.

Aeroflotgirl · 13/12/2017 10:50

Very sad Mad, this is killing democracy, we all have to be government drones

Thermostatpolice · 13/12/2017 10:54

TERF = Trans exclusionary radical feminist.

Aeroflotgirl · 13/12/2017 11:09

Oh right, thanks Smile

Lancelottie · 13/12/2017 11:20

Actually, a TERF would appear to mean 'anyone who disagrees that a male is a female because they say so', Aeroflot.

That probably makes your grandparents into TERFs, along with any sharp-eyed child of four or so who hasn't yet had the memo.

perfectlywretched · 13/12/2017 12:12

Oh I thought it stood for transphobic, egotistical, ridiculous fool Blush

TammySwansonTwo · 13/12/2017 12:30

Excellent letter.

As far as the HCP argument goes, I've been the victim of multiple sexual assaults. I struggle massively with being examined by men. I have come to trust my specialist gynaecologist and have no issues with him examining me now, but a minimally qualified HCA performing intimate care? The sort of thing that people could get into quite quickly and easily if they wanted access to vulnerable women? Yes, I would have a problem with that.

As far as rights go, there are very vocal TRAs insisting transwomen have access to everything specifically designated for women and many are happy to comply because they'd rather have another man on their board or receiving their scholarship. Does anyone believe a transman would ever be treated the same as natal men when it comes to career prospects and so on? It will never happen.

BeyondAssignation · 13/12/2017 12:36

I’ve seen it used as “transphobic elitist radical fascist” too 🙄

Lancelottie · 13/12/2017 12:43

It's a daft term anyway. Most people who disagree that males are women are neither radical nor feminist. Most radical feminists would happily include trans-identified females into anything reserved for that sex, from what I understand.

There would be much more point in having an acronym for trans-excluding or trans-bashing men who disagree that other males should be allowed to wear skirts and makeup.

SparklyUnicornTractors · 13/12/2017 12:51

Terf doesn't actually mean anything, it's a word to dehumanise and 'other' someone who shows the faintest hint of not being On Message. It's supposed to create 'them and us' and aims to shame. Newspapers who pick up stories without bothering to research them have added to the issue as they're convinced there must be a large group somewhere who call themselves Trans Exclusionary Radical Feminists instead of realising it's a made up and pretty meaningless term for abuse. TRAs might as well call you a Jonk or a Srup.

The word fascist is an increasingly beloved one. Like many words the TRA lobby have appropriated and applied randomly to mean what they want instead of what it originally meant (cis and intersectional being two examples) they basically mean by it 'person who says things we don't agree with'. There's a whole lot of projection involved too, since fascist actually means 'forcibly suppressing opposition and criticism'. Who no-platforms whom? Who rings around venues scaring them into abandoning events featuring speakers sharing unagreed with viewpoints? Who tells who to die or that they should be raped for their views? Who beats up and publically intimidates dissenters?

BeyondAssignation · 13/12/2017 12:55

Maybe they should be the “trans especial rights fascists” Grin

BatShite · 13/12/2017 15:25

Telling Everyone Real facts

WTAFisthisshit · 13/12/2017 15:29

Telling Everyone Real Facts this needs to go on twitter as a hashtag.

BeyondTellingEveryoneRealFacts · 13/12/2017 15:32

Old name Grin

Thermostatpolice · 13/12/2017 15:39

SparklyUnicornTractor I wish that I could summon up the courage to share your second paragraph about fascists on my social media. The fact that I'm too scared to do so shows how right you are.

bluewoollyhat · 13/12/2017 16:53

batshite I shared on fb and got a single response of a sad face. Not entirely sure what it meant but I’ll interpret it as support
Pretty disappointing to say the least
I’ve also sent it to my MSP and am waiting for a response...

perfectlywretched · 13/12/2017 17:02

Telling Everyone Ridiculous Falsehoods

Turning Everyone Rightwing Fascist

The possibilities are endless Grin

blackdoggotmytongue · 13/12/2017 17:07

I can’t share it on fb. In my professional environment it would be career-ending.
It’s extremely hard. I have a friend whose dd has requested to be referred to as ds/ new name/ erasure of history. She loves her child so much that as a parent she has no real choice except to follow the zeitgeist and say ‘I can see how much happier he is now.’ The most she would admit was that it was ‘hard’ to have to redefine the history of her family, but I could see the stress and concern and fear. What have we come to where even a parent can’t express their fears about their own child in case of a backlash?
I really didn’t know whether to try and let her know it was ok to have misgivings. The other scenario is she is truly fine with it and would have been infuriated with me for casting doubt on her ‘son’s’ choices.
We’re all docilely sleep-walking into the future. I hope she finds mn.

Lancelottie · 13/12/2017 17:09

What falsehoods are being told, though, Perfectly? (Unless you mean on the part of the TRAs? I do quite like the idea of rechristening TRAs as TERFs. Pleasantly circular.)

BeyondAssignation · 13/12/2017 17:21

Blackdog, you could point her in the direction of mn for something unrelated? Give her chance to find our advice "organically"...?

blackdoggotmytongue · 13/12/2017 17:23

The new scripts are all-encompassing. I did a bit of social research into ‘trans-narratives’ years ago (essentially the formulaic ‘my transition story’ that used to provide an accidental blueprint for getting a GRC - from ‘I have always known’ right through to ‘and now post-surgery my life is complete’) No deviation from the script was evident and folk were super keen to add their story to the identikit mountain. People knew exactly how the story would pan out (lo, exactly how the GIC insisted it had to...)

I find it really interesting that now the script has been written for everyone else. This is the approved dogma, with no deviation allowed. They are so much happier since transitioning. So much more authentic. More relaxed. Found their true self.
I’m trying to find more details of the research studies into de-transitioning that were turned down at ethics review due to political incompatibility/ potential backlash. I haven’t been involved in ethics for a few years. There have always been issues with grant applications for ‘current’ trends, but I don’t think i’ve heard of ethics review stating political incorrectness before? It may be that the proposal was spectacularly badly written obv.

BatShite · 13/12/2017 17:25

Turning Everyone Rightwing Fascist

Hmm indeed. Its a bit of an odd phenomenon how the majority of 'terfs' are actually extremely left wing. I know its convenient to pretend that its only the extreme right and such, but it could not be further from the truth (so..a 'ridiculous falsehood'?)

Also interested in the falsehoods that are told by 'TERF's. The facts I was thinking of was the likes of 'male people are not female people' and 'biological sex is a real thing' but equally interested in the falsehoods. Very interested infact given the only 'resistance' to these nasty bigoted transphobes appears to be random insults. Rather than any actual argument. One would think that there was no rational arguments to be made from the other side and this is why insults are slung and posters flounce, or violence is threatened so as to shut those pesky women up. Surely that cannot be the case?

blackdoggotmytongue · 13/12/2017 17:26

Beyond, yeah. I don’t usually mention mn in public... Wink Year’s ago I registered with a (name/number) username and batwoman pm me asking if I lived in x. The site was much smaller but i’ve Had a healthy dose of paranoia since!!

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