The Goose and Carrot Pub Thread

[roaringdragon]

Everyone is welcome, and the thread disappears after 90 days.

Thank you for the last thread @lougle. I hope the doctor was helpful and DD2 isn’t feeling too rubbish this morning.

DS1 has used the last of his EOTAS hours today. There will be at least a few weeks before the EHCP is finalised and funding restarts. He will hopefully have his operation during that time, but it is still going to feel like a long time without that provision.

We navigated this already and feel we are making good progress, @Fififizz.
I think once we have got the aggression out of the way we are now trying to be very honest, if your mum won't say it nobody will.
We brought in a ban on rudeness over our holiday. We have to be very concrete, and we deduct screen time for rudeness, for us it has to be immediate or same day. Both DCs are rude to each other, me and DH and we've openly asked each person what they prefer, if it's ok as a nickname or they don't like it.
For things like invading personal space sometimes we just ignore (if he's being silly e.g. he just came in to ask me about a t-shirt and then put it on my face so I ignored that) and sometimes we are blunt "stop leaning on me, I'm trying to knit".

@drspouse

Thanks for this. I suppose the advice is make a start now to call this behaviour out as unacceptable. I think you’re right. What’s actually happening is bullying of me, of differing degrees, probably to alleviate difficult feelings or struggles. We don’t have the siblings issue so it’s all at me. Not sure which is worse taking it all myself or for you policing the dynamic.

It helps to know it can be tackled and improved and to have more empathetic advice than ‘this just wouldn’t happen or be tolerated in our house’ line of advice. We’ve arrived at this state of affairs and dynamic after many years of just trying to survive into the next day and keep going.

I’ll monitor closely to see if there’s still the aggression in there and driving these interactions. Anger and aggression was something the ADHD assessment picked up and RSD. The meds are supposed to help the anger and annoyance caused by people but as they’re stimulating not exactly how sure that works. Maybe they balance something out.

I’ve become so used to all over the years I’m partially desensitised to it. There used a be a lot of aggression and very heightened anxiety driving it but recently I think it’s more grumpy, teen stroppy, tiredness sort of stuff.

I go with "I'm not talking about this now. I'll talk about it when you can be polite." You can't change his behaviour, only your reaction.

I think it's fairly normal for teenagers to take parents for granted and minimise their efforts. I find that particularly with DD3, as her coping strategies are used up for daily life, her ability to modify her behaviour wanes.

I'm thinking that now, with new college to navigate, probably isn't a time for setting fresh boundaries - the pressure is already huge on you both and you probably just need to weather the storm, then set boundaries when things have calmed.

@Lougle

Thanks, boundaries have been pretty basic tbh. Go to school, with lots of scaffolding from me around getting into the morning transport and try your best, eat something, sleep at some point through the night. That’s it. I have let the rest slide whilst keeping the show on the road. I’m definitely not going to implement currently and see your wisdom but for my mental health I need to know I have a plan and will start to create boundaries in the future for my own sake and well being.

@JumpersFluffy it’s lovely to hear that you have seen changes in how DD2 is coping.

@Fififizz have you ever been on a non-violent resistance course? Like @Lougle, I would also pick your time wisely. I think the same applies here as it does to being grateful for you providing transport, so I will reiterate what I posted on your thread about transport - “Right now isn’t the time to be challenging DS over being grateful for transport IMO. Transition to post 16 with new environment, new people, new routines, more demands, etc. brings a lot of pressure on its own. Adding to that isn’t wise, IMO.” I think the same applies to wider issues and you can substitute transport for the other things too.

@PurringTiger I’m glad you are enjoying work.

I know the hospital tries very hard not to cancel DS because so many other people tag procedures onto when he is already under GA for something else which can be difficult to arrange, but I understand it is sometimes unavoidable when there isn’t a suitable bed. Hopefully, we won’t be waiting too long for another date, so hopefully it won't affect plans too much. I was hoping it would be done during the gap between EOTAS provision. That might not be the case now, but it isn’t that big a deal if it isn’t.

DS1 is back asleep after spending the morning so far rolling around the floor growling and shouting.

@roaringdragon thats what I was thinking the gap in provision would have been a slot for a procedure. Good that it’s not a big deal.

@Fififizz i am making a big assumption that you will have a bit more time to yourself while DS is at college. Can you start by setting boundaries around doing things in that time to make yourself healthier and more fulfilled. Everything is easier for me if I’m not 100% doing/focused on others. My reactions are calmer when my own needs are being met. I got stuck for years either sleeping or scrolling every chance I got, even though it’s tiring exercising/reading/socialising/meditating etc has been very good for me.

@Fififizz I think stimulants are supposed to filter out all the extra stuff that make it hard to focus on one thing - possibly removing things that are annoying in the background like turning off the pneumatic drill going in the background while you are trying to do hard sums!

Yes @roaringdragon we are heavily into NVR though as I said on another thread we think the "announcement" would be a waste of time.
The book I like best (I really should look into getting commission) about reducing accommodations is this

https://www.spacetreatment.net/manual-and-books

Work through it slowly, there's a temptation to dive in to chapter 6 or something (random number). It's NVR based. Also ADHD Dude who is also NVR based. But everyone has heard me bore on about him.

Thanks everyone.

@roaringdragon
I absolutely agree and take on board your sage advice about timing but for my own sanity I need to have a plan to tackle some of this behaviour either that or run for the hills. It’s not doing anyone any good not addressing it, especially not me. I’ve heard of NVR in passing. I’ll do more of a deep dive. Thanks. I appreciate your wisdom.

@PurringTiger

Yes, once we’ve resolved travelling I should have more time for myself and I need to boundary this and prioritise myself. I believe ND people can be poor at boundaries. I know I am. It’s also part of the jigsaw/dynamic. Happy mum, happy home.

@drspouse

Thanks for that info. I’ll do a deep dive.

Sorry things are difficult with your DS @Fififizz

I think this age is challenging - I read on here somewhere that teenagers become super annoying around this age so you don't miss them when they leave home. 😂Though with asd a big risk is them not leaving home, withdrawing from life and shutting down so need to tread very carefully.

I find I need to have other things in my life / take time for myself and when I have looked after myself doing sport or whatever, mainly gardening at the moment, I am stronger. I would not engage with a child being rude, I would say I'm happy to help you with that when you talk to me later politely. Also pointing out positive things your DS is doing may help.

Have been thinking through laundry room and realised its just on hold as DH is being stubborn about the boiler and really there's very little point paying £1,500 or whatever to move it to the other side of the wall DS sits by, he will still turn it off. The only difference is it will be in a non lockable room but could save himself £1,500 and a month of disruption by just removing the lock. DH won't agree to that but I am putting my foot down with the boiler as that way we can do the laundry room and the plumber has told him best solution is to keep it where it is with maybe a box around for condensation. We don't need to solve that until add a bath. DH seems to have backed down and was looking at laundry room sinks with me. Though sink is another issue as DH wants it in a position plumber has said very difficult to make work so I think it'll be either we have one in a better plumbing position if it can fit which may or may not be possible or we don't have one. But we can start work again and can work round both those, there are two other sinks close by but one is in the bathroom which DS can shut and other is kitchen one which DH leaves things to "soak" in for. But we can work round that.

@Fififizz i know it’s an over used phrase but be kind to yourself too. You are where you are because you have had to make decisions along the way with little support. My DD was a lot more challenging 2yrs ago and I had many a time ended up in tears in the garden as I was the person she kicked out against mentally the most. I mostly held my temper by walking away and grey rocking & when she was calmer we would talk it through either in the car or walking the dog without trying to lay blame but acknowledging that her behaviour was really horrid to be on the end of and how “we” could handle it differently & then model that behaviour as much as possible. You do need to make yourself unavailable too for your own sanity. I used running a lot or walking to be out the house for an hour every day as head space and phone on mute. DH or my older DD would be “on call” if needed. Now we are in much better place and still get flare ups but they reduce really fast & DD2 will come to me soon after to apologise if she realises she was out of line. Good luck it takes time, consistency and firm boundaries to build better communication skills plus your DC needs to be in a happier place too to have the energy to learn how to communicate their needs better too.

@Fififizz also they do need to learn to “fail” & process those feelings in a more constructive way, which is really really hard with any teen but a ND teen is on a much deeper level. We’ve worked a lot on this over the last few years, as DD2 was avoiding anything that may risk failing at which feeds her anxiety cycle and actually she needed to experience failure and work through it. From simple stuff like losing at a card game, not getting 100% on a quiz etc. it’s taken a lot of reassurance over and over that it’s ok to not get everything right and it’s ok, this is still a massive work in progress though and I think RSD feeds this a lot.

We have boundaries with DD1 about what would otherwise be repetitive conversations for the next three months:

1. I will only talk with her for half an hour on whatever is number one in her mind (such as when will the next Harry Potter film be out; or when are we going to have an Indian takeaway)
2. we don’t talk about Christmas until after Bonfire night
3. we only talk about her birthday after Christmas

I tell her:

1. not to be rude (especially to the care staff, who all tend to be “fucking idiots” in her view).
2. not to call people smoking “fucking idiots, who are giving themselves cancer”
3. not to go on about obese members of the public
4. not to hit me, DH or the care staff
5. not to treat the care staff as maids (which she does, because “Merlin” is one of her favourite programs and she sees the royalty bossing the servants around)
6. not to swear in public, near children (her attitude is they have to learn one day, and it might as well be today from her)

Really, it’s pointless telling her these things, but I feel I have to try especially in front of the care staff, who otherwise think we let her get away with it.

At home, she gets up at 9.30 am and has three meals a day at regular times, and goes to bed when we do. Otherwise, she’d lie in bed all morning and be eating at weird times. I tell her, I’m not running a restaurant. It’s better for her epilepsy anyway, when hunger and tiredness are two big triggers. Treat days are Wednesday and Saturday, as her weight is an ongoing problem - she’d eat every junk food in sight, if we let her, although equally she likes top class food like lobster, scallops, octopus, etc. Basically, she likes all food, and will eat until she vomits with overflow, with a few exceptions like red onions and ice cream. Stealing food is an ongoing problem! All treats and alcohol have to be hidden in cupboards.

Only one cuddly toy a week, as otherwise she’d buy every one in sight!

Before she had epilepsy, most people thought she was “normal” - she had a high emotional IQ, was fairly bright, very sociable but rule bound. She wouldn’t say boo to a goose. Nobody recognised the profound language disorder, dyslexia, dyspraxia and memory problems. She still has isolated skills, but the idea of “I’ll do what I want, because nobody is going to send me to jail” tends to prevail.

One good thing about DD1 is, if anyone tries to ask her leading questions about us, they are likely to get:

”Mummy and Daddy are the best parents in the world! Don’t you be nasty about them! You fucking idiot! I never want to see you again!”

@LathkillDale

The final post made me lol. I needed that. Thank you.

DC has some very rigid opinions and certain views which he’s happy to voice at inappropriate times and not at all discreetly. They’re not from us but SM and certain TV shows. I do worry. He also thinks lots of people are ‘idiots’ or ‘melons’. I find the latter more acceptable.

I have much work to do with him on many different areas.

I’m mulling it all over, especially when and where to start.

@Fififizz my floaty post about meditation time for yourself etc has shot me in the foot. Having the most volatile day today since I don’t know when!! Sigh, honk honk on we all go.

Have ordered worktop and things to fit tiled floor though DH did measurements again for worktop and its not at right angles and narrower at the front which may well make a sink impossible but we will get as far as we can with things. DH slightly huffy now mainly as he seemed to want to sleep all day but he has gone off to collect things. DS is in loud door shutting mode, seems happy but sometimes he does this as he's not patient with doors but the noise is grating and every 5 minutes. The cat is the only none slightly annoying male at the moment.

Sorry DD is stressed @PurringTiger

That's great she says that @LathkillDale

Sorry to hear @PurringTiger hopefully this too shall pass with rest & low demand.

I picked up DD2 from her longest day out the house in the week - she does 3hrs at the tutor hub - and she’s so shut down & exhausted. I just can’t see how she could do this and more 4d a week at college in a years time.

Just had electrics quote in and DH also is back with my meds, his meds, and stuff for tiling the floor. He's now on a piano meeting. Quote seems reasonable, its quite a lot but there's a lot to do.

One thing that was amusing was the electrician who looked about 19 himself has put as having bath to move current double plug into cupboard rather than just take it out like DH requested so that cupboard will have 3 plugs. DS will be happy with that, can charge 3 ipads at once. 19 year old boy solutions.

@Violasilkie all the sockets! He will love that.

@JumpersFluffy it’s return to study wobbles. Does DD absolutely have to attend in person for 4 days?

@PurringTiger do you think today is a consequence of all the amazing achievements DD has made recently? Progress isn’t linear, she has done so well. Two steps forward and one step back sometimes feeling like one step forward and two back. I hope tonight is steadier than the day.

@JumpersFluffy sorry today has been tricky. Do you have a plan B?

@roaringdragon that is a sage observation. After all none of us can constantly do more every single day and sometimes I think that expectation weighs heavy on goslings in the pursuit of ‘bringing them on’

A timely reminder to stop leaning in.

honks to those that need it. Meds finally here. Reeling with tiredness as every day seems to be too much but I think ds is managing and hopefully the new medicine will work and this is the end of a harder bit.

Right back at you with honks. DS managing is good news.

@PurringTiger without the valleys you don't get the views from the mountain tops. DD has done so well but it must be overwhelming at times.

@Zzzzzs I hope the meds start well.

DD1 is micromanaging me to within an inch of my life. I've added everything into the calendar precisely, but she's adding buffer zones to timings that are already buffered. So at 12pm she's saying "Don't we need to leave in a minute to get DD2" because the calendar says "Collect DD2 1.30pm" but the time is set from 1pm to account for the journey. She wants to leave at 12.30 'so we're not late'. Then she's talking about food all day long. I know it's the meds but she's literally asking about the next meal when she's part way through the one we're eating.

Finally, she is giving a running commentary of everything she's doing and thinking. "Right, I filled my cup with water and drank it. Now I've finished, so I shall leave it in the kitchen..."

It's all very suffocating and I feel like I'm being tortured.

Perhaps we would have won WW2 a bit quicker if she had been there to interrogate captured spies. She could have talked them to death in between interrogation sessions, and kept all the soldiers on schedule.