Teacher carrying 9yo into school.

[ChitterChatter1987]

My eldest daughter (Year 5) is becoming really tricky to get into school some days, particularly Mondays.
She has a male teacher for the first time this year, who she seems to get on well with and speaks positively about.She had specifically asked to have him despite often generally being abit more fearful of males than females.He is popular with kids and parents and is fairly young and laid back, quite playful and enthusiastic in his approach.

A couple of times he has come out when we have had issues getting her in recently and has verbally managed to persuade DD to go in by giving an incentive etc which has worked well, but today despite him trying this and offering good solutions to her worries, she just would not go in, and went outside the office reception and sat down refusing to move.
He suggested out of earshot for me to go as maybe me being there was making her more reluctant, which i agree was probably true as maybe then she thinks she might be able to come home.

I walked off up the path and left him negotiating with her outside as he had advised, however then looked back and saw him fireman carrying her into the building.
Now I totally get it's a hard sitiation knowing how to get her in,and appreciate he has a class to teach, so can't stand outside negotiating with her for ages, and there is a possibility she was okay with him lifting her in and it was a fun game (although I would be surprised as she isn't really a tactile child with anyone other than me and sometimes her dad and sister) If someone had done that with my 5yo, unless she was kicking and screaming in upset, I probably wouldn't think much of it tbh, but with her being older on the cusp of puberty, him being male, and also her having ASD and not liking physical touch, it just feels like it might be quite humiliating for her and abit forceful and inappropriate, despite it being meant as a playful gesture to get her to go in.
We always try to teach her body autonomy, that nobody should touch her including hugs etc without her wanting them to, so i just worry that this is going against that, especially with him being an adult male.
She is quite a young 9.5, and fairly small for her age, so not sure he would have done it otherwise, but despite that she is still the age she is.

My plan is I will speak to her later and see if she was okay with it or not, and if not ask for a meeting with school, asking them to not do it again and discussing alternative methods to get her into school.

What are others thoughts on this practice? If anyone else has experienced something similar, or has any ideas of alternative ways to get her into school i would be grateful for your input!

What would you recommend instead? Employ someone to stand on the doorstep with her until she’s ready to come in?

It shouldn't be the teacher's job. You need to ensure she goes in.
Teacher's have enough to do.

The vote thankfully says it all

Team teacher ! Unfortunately you reporting him will probably stop him from trying to help your kid. Crazy world.

Well you're not educated around send, autism and ebsa are you.

This.

Having had to manoeuvre children into schools in the past, it is not easy and it's most definitely not 'fun'.

You're fortunate that the school is on board which this; some now refuse to have anything to do with the child until they are on the premises.

An increase in the number of children identified with SEND is not evidence that parents have stopped disciplining their children. That's an assumption you're making, not a conclusion supported by the figures.

There are legitimate discussions to be had about the rising demand for SEND support and how public money is spent. But none of that provides any basis whatsoever for describing this particular child as spoilt or entitled, or her mother as a bad parent.

I find it particularly depressing that a discussion about a disabled child struggling to access education has so quickly become an argument about whether supporting children like her is an indulgence we can afford. It happens all the time on here.

Children with disabilities are not responsible for the country's financial difficulties, and providing them with support doesn't make them weak or unresilient.

You can have concerns about the SEND system without directing those frustrations at individual disabled children and their parents.

EHCP's aren't handed out like sweets, they are difficult to get and often take a long time to get. Parents, SENCOS, Educational Psychologists etc certainly aren't doing it for fun.

Its not allowed. As stated by many people who work in/with schools. There's just lots of OPs that want it to be acceptable and their opinion is obviously far more important than any actual legislation.

Teacher is making a very bad choice here and leaving himself wide open to all sorts of safeguarding allegations.

The teacher would have had lots of training as they all do and would know what is appropriate and what isn’t, hence the fireman’s lift which firemen use so they don’t get accused of touching women inappropriately when they rescue them from burning buildings or a car crash.
Your daughter sounds hard work, I applaud the school for persevering to accommodate her challenging behaviour.

He absolutely cannot do this. Please don't listen to parents on here with zero experience of sen. He may well have thought he was helping - as a mother of two autistic girls, some of our most upsetting experiences were at the hands of male teachers who thought they knew best.

Definitely ask for a meeting with school.

School refusing can become entrenched - see if you can call an emergency review of the ehc.

I really appreciate your kind and understanding reply, thankyou so much for getting it.

Finding it difficult to attend school isn’t shitty behaviour.
Ableism is though

Parents these days expect a teacher to give their child 1:1 tuition and pander to their every whim on the excuse of neurodivergence. I am autistic, so I don’t see it as an excuse. By allowing her to follow this routine of will she go in or won’t she, you are allowing her to dictate whether she feels it appropriate to go to school. It’s madness.

Cool, and your point is?

@ChitterChatter1987 She doesn’t go along with going into school though does she. Which proves she’s quite capable of standing her ground if she doesn’t want to do something.

My theory for her denying the teacher carried her is because she knows she was acting like a baby for that to even have had to happen and was embarrassed to first tell you.

Wow! Some of these comments 'team teacher' etc I am astounded at!

I work in a school as a TA and i KNOW that that would NOT be acceptable. For 3 years I was with a child who would not come into school. First off mum ... ur doing a great job, for those saying ur not doing ur job by allowing her to kick off etc .... have no idea what it is like when the child refuses or kicks off.

I have had to physically hold the child in question as mum leaves and the child is screaming, kicking while mum is crying walking out the door ... IT IS NOT EASY!

But NEVER would i have lifted the child and physically taken her to class. I would have sat with her, chatted until she calmed down, and she always did calm. It might have taken up to an hour at times, but that was my job, to be there for her.

As for the 'young' MALE teacher lifting a young girl who is near on puberty age, up and over his shoulder is NOT ok ...i am not saying that he should be fired or repremanded, but i would, if i was her mother be having a chat with him and say, i would prefer you didnt physically lift her, i totally understand he has 29 other kids to teach, and that he has to get to class ... then get someone else to sit with her. There are plenty of TA's that could deal with it. He should NOT for his own benefit as well as hers, be lifting her up like that. End of!

Can you imagine in secondery/high school a 15 year old girl refusing to go into class so a young make teacher lifts her up over his shoulder and carried her in ...would most of you be saying team teacher then? He would be in front of the Ed Board before he even got to class.

Mum ... do they have a wee sensory room that a TA can take her to, for some time out before class. Maybe have a chat with the head to see how they can help to get her into school. Its their job to help her feel comfortable and safe.

The child I worked with for 3 years went on to high school and only managed 3 mths before she refused to go back and has not been in school for the past year and half. You are not doing anything wrong, but I would say, drop her off and then leave, the longer u stay the more chance she will refuse hoping you will give in etc ... just be sure no teacher is going to lift her ... im uncomfortable reading it, cant imagine how she felt ...

I suggest you try the not fine at school or define fine Facebook groups OP. People who actually understand the issues you and your daughter are facing and can offer the right support and guidance. Some of the comments on here are beyond ignorant and frankly downright nasty.

Yes you make a valid point

I’m amazed, frankly, to learn that there are apparently many examples of children being ‘persuaded’ to go into the school by the very people employed by the school.

This is not the job of a teacher, a TA or whatever.

It is the job of a teacher or TA to teach those who turn up.

Absolutely, and it’s probably contagious too.

Others see it and think, ‘hmm I don’t much fancy school today. I haven’t had much attention recently either. I think I’ll do a Susie’

I haven't read the whole thread as some early replies annoyed me. Unless you've dealt with an ND child struggling to get into school you have no idea what it's like, and that's fine, but ignorant responses are not helpful.

I wouldn't waste your time arguing with people who simply have no understanding of this issue and can't imagine the distress it causes.

My dd was older when this kicked in so ways to tackle it were somewhat easier in secondary school. As you know, it's about anxiety. People who are commenting without insight can't understand the struggle the child feels in that moment, it's very difficult

Carrying her in is not a good idea in my opinion and you are right to raise it. If she recently had half term break it's often an issuing returning after a break in routine

I found joining a FB group about school anxiety really useful. If nothing else, it's reassuring to know this is a common issue, you are not alone. There can also be useful practical advice and tips on advocating for your child.

Ideally, you need to find a key person in school who really understands ND children, especially one that appears to manage fine, but underneath is burnt out and so very anxious and needs a different approach.

Are there options for other activities at break/yard time? Can children choose to stay in to draw/play games? Can she be let sit where she is most comfortable in the classroom & beside people she is comfortable with? Does her teacher know not to put her on the spot in class etc., Taking away preemptive worries and removing unnecessary demands, and her knowing this is in place, can really help.

I'd also look at her general health, gastro issues are more likely, we found a good probiotic helped. She may need a boost with a good multivitamin too.

I wish you and your dd well.