MARCH 2026 - Well we took you to Stately Homes

[AttilaTheMeerkat]

have now set up a new thread as the previous one is now full.
This long runnning thread has become a safe haven for Adult children of abusive families.
The title refers to an original poster's family who claimed they could not have been abusive as they had taken her to plenty of Stately Homes during her childhood!
One thing you will never hear on this thread is that your abuse or experience was not that bad. You will never have your feelings minimised the way they were when you were a child, or now that you are an adult. To coin the phrase of a much respected past poster Ally90;
'Nobody can judge how sad your childhood made you, even if you wrote a novel on it, only you know that. I can well imagine any of us saying some of the seemingly trivial things our parents/ siblings did to us to many of our real life acquaintances and them not understanding why we were upset/ angry/ hurt etc. And that is why this thread is here. It's a safe place to vent our true feelings, validate our childhood/ lifetime experiences of being hurt/ angry etc by our parents behaviour and to get support for dealing with family in the here and now.'
Most new posters generally start off their posts by saying; but it wasn't that bad for me or my experience wasn't as awful as x,y or z's.
Some on here have been emotionally abused and/ or physically abused. Some are not sure what category (there doesn't have to be any) they fall into.
NONE of that matters. What matters is how 'YOU' felt growing up, how 'YOU' feel now and a chance to talk about how and why those childhood experiences and/ or current parental contact, has left you feeling damaged, falling apart from the inside out and stumbling around trying to find your sense of self-worth.
You might also find the following links and information useful, if you have come this far and are still not sure whether you belong here or not.
'Toxic Parents' by Susan Forward.
I started with this book and found it really useful.
Here are some excerpts:
"Once you get going, most toxic parents will counterattack. After all, if they had the capacity to listen, to hear, to be reasonable, to respect your feelings, and to promote your independence, they wouldn't be toxic parents. They will probably perceive your words as treacherous personal assaults. They will tend to fall back on the same tactics and defences that they have always used, only more so.
Remember, the important thing is not their reaction but your response. If you can stand fast in the face of your parents' fury, accusations, threats and guilt-peddling, you will experience your finest hour.
Here are some typical parental reactions to confrontation:
"It never happened". Parents who have used denial to avoid their own feelings of inadequacy or anxiety, will undoubtedly use it during confrontation, to promote their version of reality. They'll insist that your allegations never happened, or that you're exaggerating. They won't remember, or they will accuse you of lying.
YOUR RESPONSE: Just because you don't remember, doesn't mean it didn't happen".
"It was your fault." Toxic parents are almost never willing to accept responsibility for their destructive behaviour. Instead, they will blame you. They will say that you were bad, or that you were difficult. They will claim that they did the best that they could but that you always created problems for them. They will say that you drove them crazy. They will offer as proof, the fact that everybody in the family knew what a problem you were. They will offer up a laundry list of your alleged offences against them.
YOUR RESPONSE: "You can keep trying to make this my fault, but I'm not going to accept the responsibility for what you did to me, when I was a child".
"I said I was sorry what more do you want?" Some parents may acknowledge a few of the things that you say but be unwilling to do anything about it.
YOUR RESPONSE: "I appreciate your apology, but that is just a beginning. If you're truly sorry, you'll work through this with me, to make a better relationship."
"We did the best we could." Some parents will remind you of how tough they had it while you were growing up and how hard they struggled. They will say such things as "You'll never understand what I was going through," or "I did the best I could". This particular style of response will often stir up a lot of sympathy and compassion for your parents. This is understandable, but it makes it difficult for you to remain focused on what you need to say in your confrontation. The temptation is for you once again to put their needs ahead of your own. It is important that you be able to acknowledge their difficulties, without invalidating your own.
YOUR RESPONSE: "I understand that you had a hard time, and I'm sure that you didn't hurt me on purpose, but I need you to understand that the way you dealt with your problems really did hurt me"
"Look what we did for you." Many parents will attempt to counter your assertions by recalling the wonderful times you had as a child and the loving moments you and they shared. By focusing on the good things, they can avoid looking at the darker side of their behaviour. Parents will typically remind you of gifts they gave you, places they took you, sacrifices they made for you, and thoughtful things they did. They will say things like, "this is the thanks we get" or "nothing was ever enough for you."
YOUR RESPONSE: "I appreciate those things very much, but they didn't make up for ...."
"How can you do this to me?" Some parents act like martyrs. They'll collapse into tears, wring their hands, and express shock and disbelief at your "cruelty". They will act as if your confrontation has victimized them. They will accuse you of hurting them, or disappointing them. They will complain that they don't need this, they have enough problems. They will tell you that they are not strong enough or healthy enough to take this, that the heartache will kill them. Some of their sadness will, of course, be genuine. It is sad for parents to face their own shortcomings, to realise that they have caused their children significant pain. But their sadness can also be manipulative and controlling. It is their way of using guilt to try to make you back down from the confrontation.
YOUR RESPONSE: "I'm sorry you're upset. I'm sorry you're hurt. But I'm not willing to give up on this. I've been hurting for a long time, too."
Helpful Websites
Alice Miller
Personality Disorders definition
Daughters of narcissistic mothers
Out of the FOG
You carry the cure in your own heart
Help for adult children of child abuse
Pete Walker
The Echo Society
There are also one or two less public offshoots of Stately Homes, PM AttilaTheMeerkat for details.
Some books:
Toxic Parents by Susan Forward
Homecoming by John Bradshaw
Will I ever be good enough? by Karyl McBride
If you had controlling parents by Dan Neuharth
When you and your mother can't be friends by Victoria Segunda
Children of the self-absorbed by Nina Brown - check reviews on this, I didn't find it useful myself.
Recovery of your inner child by Lucia Capacchione
Childhood Disrupted by Donna Jackson Nazakawa
This final quote is from smithfield posting as therealsmithfield:
"I'm sure the other posters will be along shortly to add anything they feel I have left out. I personally don't claim to be sorted but I will say my head has become a helluva lot straighter since I started posting here. You will receive a lot of wisdom but above all else the insights and advice given will 'always' be delivered with warmth and support."
6

It was so hateful, I’ve never seen a human with such hate. All I’ve ever read is that they have low self esteem but that is not true in this case. This man has not got low self esteem, hes a bully, shouting at two females, one extremely vulnerable.

I thinks narcs argue for totally different reasons. I think they argue to hurt and so that means they go LOW, as low as they can go, they seek to cause maximum impact which is probably why they wreck all relationships as there is no going back.

@MustIgo You asked upthread whether it was OK to shout when you did. I think this is where normal people and those with narcissistic tendencies really differ. The narcissist would never for a second consider whether his behaviour was right or wrong.
My experiences of so called arguments with narcissists is that they use them as a tool to make people do as they want- either by directly bulling them there and then in to doing something to make it stop (even if that is just agreeing with them) or by letting them know the consequences of not doing as they wish (ie further nastiness). Some also really enjoy belittling and upsetting others. They are often very good at picking their victim and audience.
I don't think you were in the wrong at all for standing up to this bully, but when I am forced to encounter by GB2 who is like this I try very hard to keep my own anger inside. I've realised that he gets a kick out of pushing me to shout, knowing that if he can make me shout he has really got to me and also that he can tell people that I shouted and make it sound like it was all my fault, or at least we were equally to blame. Having said that, the arsehole will also claim I am unreasonable if I just walk away.
The vitriol from these people really does have to be seen to be believed. GB2 is always very careful not to become angry when there are people he wants to impress, or men bigger than him, around. So although my DH completely supports and believes me I don't think he completely understood how quickly GB2 can go from a standard chat to a nasty rant, or exactly how unpleasant he is, until recently. GB2 called me when DH happened to be sitting with me to ask me something mundane and just to make small talk I asked after his partner and child (usual 'how is everyone at your end' sort of thing). This triggered a barrage of abuse and nastiness including accusations of being cruel and uncaring, personal insults against me and my family, nasty sarcastic comments and very thinly veiled threats. All delivered at intense volume and with lots of swearing. DH (who is not easily shocked and frequently has to de-escalate difficult situations at work) was absolutely horrified and told me that up until then he'd not fully realised exactly how horrible and frightening he really was.

@formalwellies I have no intentions of seeing this person again. There will be no reason to be triggered again. Perhaps it’s normal to sometimes shout at people. My body does not feel good today. I do not feel bad about telling this man to shut his mouth, he needed to be told. I am not looking at resolution, that’s a relationship that’s easy to snip off. I actually am beginning to dislike a lot of my relationships. They are relationships that are performative and have no positive benefit to my little family. I can’t decide if I matured and learnt it’s ok to tell people to fuck off or I’m being immature.

I think it's powerful that you have learned that you can cut contact with people who add nothing to your life. Is this person someone that has regular contact with the vulnerable relative that you mentioned? If they are, I'd suggest deciding in advance on a strategy for dealing with the situation if you are visiting that person etc and the person you wish to be NC with turns up. When my GB1 realised that I didn't want any contact he went out of his way to try to engineer situations where I would see/hear him. I'm sure it was an attempt to show that he still had power and he definitely enjoyed knowing that he was going against my wishes/making me feel uncomfortable. It's very hard when there is a vulnerable person involved as well.

This was a situation that can be avoided. The vulnerable person does not need to see them again either. This particular family member has always been known to be a bully but you give the benefit of the doubt. Perhaps they are just a bit abrupt etc but I have no doubt anymore.

I have always lived my life in truth. I find this type of behaviour hard to understand. Perhaps it’s just me but why say something that isn’t true, it just makes you look stupid and makes no logical sense. I am quite logical in my outlook. This is just plain bizarre behaviour and more so because they have lost a lot more than I have. They’ve lost access to a whole side of a family whereas there is just 2 of them and no real loss to me. You’d think they would think that before acting like that. Why blow it apart so violently?

I have been teaching my eldest about thoughts and how these thoughts are like seeds and if we feed them they grow. I’ve been trying to teach her about good thoughts and not so good and simply how thoughts can sometimes be untrue. I think these narcs started off with thoughts and they just let them grow wild and they often untrue. They are obviously childish thoughts about situations but they stick.

@MustIgo I do agree with you and feel this too, it is so sad. I have been thinking this same thing a lot over the last few years. When someone dies it can be very sad - depending who it is and our relationship to them of course - but it is final, which allows us to somehow work through the grief. But losing a last connection, or the attempt at a connection, to a narcissist abuser feels so painful and doesn’t seem to get better over time, because they are out there somewhere living their life. I feel like this about my mum. I still have that little girl in me who loved her with my whole heart because she was my first carer and the first relationship I had in the world. At the same time I realise that she’s not able to love me at all, isn’t capable of it, and that for my own health and sanity I have to give up on my attempts to maintain connection with her. It’s a horrible kind of grief that just goes on for ever, it hasn’t seemed to get better at all over recent years. Other people think that I will have so much more freedom now not having her in my life, but I just seem to be always grieving.

I struggle with understanding how someone can have such a different perception of you and truly believe it. Being in the world thinking these awful things about you, telling other people, they then believing it. I don’t know how to get this feeling away that I hate to be perceived so wrong. I want to put stories straight but people’s mind are set. The truth is important to me but to others just a story with no evidence is enough. I find it hard to understand the hate in people’s minds. I’ve always sort therapy or help for my thoughts because having hate inside is an awful feeling. I think there is a grief to being totally gaslight this way and having your reputation smeared when you are a good decent person who’s always lived with kindness and respect.

@MustIgo I have lived with it unknowingly all my life. It is very unfair because like you I am a truth sayer and have always maintained telling the truth is the easier policy but my mother and actually thinking back my brother have made me out to be a liar. It is unfair but when I look back they also put me down as argumentative when all I was doing was defending myself but I was never going to be right. These people don't want answers they just want to bait you and smear you enough so when you try to defend yourself you go around in circles doing it and the more you talk the more they call you crazy and unstable etc so now I think let them. If you are easily enough manipulated to believe blindly anything you are told then why on earth would I respect you enough to give a shit what your perceptions are of me? I know now it was jealously on my mothers part and every single 'win' in my life she tried to bring me down and break me and now I see this I can never unsee it.

Shes been in touch recently to add. Shes trying her best to gaslight me and be all caring and nurturing but I know shes lying when she says 'oh I told everyone all of this was totally down to me it was all my fault' but she hasnt. Shes twisted things to make it sound like shes partly wrong while still making me out to be the villian. As I said to her when my brother, sister in law and all cousins etc come to me and apologise for even listening to your lies then we can be one big happy family again but I know it will never happen so instead of revenge, instead of explaining myself I am just here in the beautiful house I bought ALONE, raising the most amazing child ALONE, with my lovely friendship circle, the job that pays me well because of the qualifications I achieved ALONE and loving my little circle of love, happiness and serenity while they are still talking about me and degrading my name but people do see. They see the life I have built outside of my family and in spite of all the abuse and accusations and they can slander me all they like, I am far too strong now to ever be broken. I am now the healed person they really should be worried about as I know all their secrets just unlike then I don't gossip I just go about my wonderful life and that is enough for me.

@Genuineweddingone I think there must be something called a moral wound or something. Because this behaviour hurts. Is it intentional out of just being nasty and jealous? Are they lying on purpose or do they really believe you are what their tiny brain has decided? There is no evidence and often it’s the behaviour they are guilty of doing. There is intense jealousy in my family of origin (what’s left of it). I kept myself away as I’ve lost those who I cared for but when we meet for something it’s just unpleasant. Something happened long ago, before me but I am now involved in old beef. Well I’m not because I told them to fuck off the other day. This isn’t my fight, happened before my time.

Something happened in my 'family' 20 years BEFORE i was born and my name was put into the pot of blame some years ago and the only question one cousin asked was 'Did you have a conversation with auntie'?. Thats it - did you have a conversation, no context of did you converse about the weather or did you converse about a family home just did I have a conversation with my aunt which of course over the months she came back to our home country for a visit yes many but not about your mothers house cos I dont know anything about it but my name has been used in lies over the years so logic doesnt enter it. I cant have been in a discussion group before I was born but they just want a scapegoat to go on about their delusions and think they are oh so wonderful that everything will be my fault. I have nothing to do with any of them so I cannot wait for one day someone to hear something recent is my fault and go um, hey how could that happen when nobody sees her? The mandela affect is real but you have to be of lower intelligence to believe blindly these things.

The scapegoat just goes down the family then? Don’t they stop to think of the root of this. My grandparents fucked up there relationship was awful, but then my grandmother lost her mum at birth and I lost mine early from autoimmune problems. The shit this caused. I don’t pick sides, it’s nothing to do with me. Don’t they all see that it’s just trauma fuelling this. My extended family are all arseholes, both sides. Me and my siblings are all fine with each other, no conflict, cousins all love each other. Now my H’s family also has issues between siblings. I think a jealous family member is more damaging than a hateful enemy. I feel like this side picking just goes down family, no one seems to have a brain to challenge it.

They side with the abuser because they know if not they are the next target. It is sickening when a whole family bullies one person but they are protecting themselves. Selfish reasons.

I’d rather be a target than a liar with half a brain. Facts and knowledge are too important to me. I’ve always been the kind of person who wants to know as much as I can about something before I make a decision. Now I’m very interested in studying human behaviour 😂

I did a diploma in it all only last year but honestly with the amount of lived experience with these people there was very minimal study required for me to pass!

Haha! Nothing like learning on the job. Technically you’ve been doing an apprenticeship for decades!

This came up on my social feed earlier:

A smear campaign ends when it loses utility, not when it loses malice.
The Real Ending
A smear campaign doesn’t end because the narcissist suddenly grows a conscience.
It ends because the narcissist loses leverage.
Smear campaigns are tools used to control the narrative, isolate you, and protect their image.
Once the tactic stops working, they drop it.
Three Moments When It Ends:
Loss of Audience - When people stop believing their stories, the narcissist stops telling them.
A lie without applause is useless.
Loss of Access - When you go no‑contact or stop reacting, the narcissist loses the fuel that keeps the smear alive.
Loss of Control - When the truth surfaces, even quietly, their narrative cracks. Narcissists abandon sinking ships fast.
The Non‑Obvious Part
A smear campaign doesn’t end with a dramatic finale.
It ends with a fade‑out - a slow, pathetic silence when the narcissist realizes:You’re no longer afraid.
Their flying monkeys are bored.
And the story they wrote about you has stopped selling.
Smear campaigns die from irrelevance, not remorse.
The Survivor’s Perspective
The real victory isn’t when they stop talking.
It’s when you stop caring.
Because the moment you reclaim your voice, their lies lose oxygen.

@Genuineweddingone I find the thing with gossip and smear campaigns is once it’s said then you are going to tell your side of the truth. It draws you in because it’s like you are guilty until proven innocent. It’s never actually innocent until proven guilty, everyone knows that. In my family it’s incredibly small so there is little left to form any sides. Me and my siblings thanks to my parents never really knew about this stupid beef and so we’ve not carried this nonsense on. No aunties/uncles have not had kids so it’s fizzled out. If they did have kids then it would absolutely have been an issue. Those oldies that are left are fucking ridiculous. Telling lies to any carers or bystanders they can. It’s absolutely pathetic, life is too short. Imagine getting to 60/70/80 playing these records, well many of you can. A whole bloody lifetime on the same track….Ive lived several lives so far and changed and developed, but they remain exactly the same.

This is the most galling thing about my situation. I know they’ll be sitting there saying how dreadful I am, waiting for an apology! Whereas the truth is it’s been incident after incident - worse and worse behaviour - until it became absolutely impossible to ignore. I look like the crazy one because I shouted. I didn’t say thank you for posting dd’s birthday present. I didn’t acknowledge Father’s Day. Aren’t I awful? I’m clearly quite mad - what on earth are they supposed to have done wrong?

A 3 hour round trip to see them with my children - prearranged. Rang to say we’re setting out. Great - see you then. Get there and my dad’s gone out with their cousin. This is the latest in a pattern of him continually being centred and mine treated as an afterthought.

No phonecall. No apology. A month on now. - no acknowledgement whatsoever. Zero concern for me and my children - I’m just everything that’s wrong for turning around and leaving.

Where does it end? Get there and they’ve both gone out?!

I’m starting to wonder whether I have gone mad. Or perhaps I’m finally sane.

I’m sure mine are doing the same, though I’m LC rather than NC. Lots of “I wonder what her problem is”, and probably zero reflection on their own behaviour. Well, you’ve done the best thing for yourself and your children imo, and I think distancing myself is the best thing for mine too. It doesn’t matter what they say or whether they understand (I’m sure deep down they do understand and they’d be the first to complain if someone treated them the same way!)

I’m not sure they have any awareness of anything, they can’t do. I think they have a fixed version of us in their heads and it is irrelevant what we do. We are not worthy and never will be. I can’t imagine having a version of my children in my head that would make them ever be unworthy of this world.

Thank you. I’m absolutely convinced they’ll take absolutely no responsibility for what happened though. They’re actively choosing the route where they get to avoid all culpability for crappy behaviour and shift responsibility, because I’ve accepted it so many times before. I can’t believe I’m here - never thought I would be. But it’s just got gotten worse and worse.

I think a lot of people who arrive here just come to a point where it’s so detrimental they just can’t take anymore. I was pretty much having an anxiety attack when I was there - I physically couldn’t stand to be in that environment for one second more. There was no way I could just sit there and eat cake.

It’s fucking scary how hard these people can pull your chords though. It reminds me of that Scientology documentary with John Sweeney where he just goes nuts but you don’t see the prelude where they’re messing with his head.

That’s exactly how I see it too.

If one of my children suffered then I would suffer. We are connected forever. If they fail then I have failed and if they failed because of me then I would probably leave this life.