Trump vs Clinton Round 2. Bigger debate than the last one.

[claig]

Round 2, Monday morning 2 am UK time.

Will "the real Trump" show up?

Donald trump attacks:

Woman passenger on plane and a receptionist
http://www.nytimes.com/2016/10/13/us/politics/donald-trump-women.htmll_

Journalist
http://people.com/politics/donald-trump-attacked-people-writerr_//_

How he abuses power when he has it:
When he ran Miss USA pageant - deliberately walking in when they're changing into bikinis :

http://losangeles.cbslocal.com/2016/10/11/former-beauty-queen-she-other-contestants-were-forced-to-greet-trump-even-when-not-fully-dressedd_//_

Trump: “I’ll go backstage before a show and everyone’s getting dressed and ready and everything else. And you know, no men are anywhere. And I’m allowed to go in because I’m the owner of the pageant. And therefore, I’m inspecting it. You know I’m inspecting it. I want to make sure everything is good.”

Stern: “You’re like a doctor.”

Trump: “Is everyone OK? You know they’re standing there with no clothes. Is everybody OK? And you see these incredible looking women.
And so I sort of get away with things like that.”

The rabid Trump supporters also have a problem with Obama. Is that because he's married to Michelle? (There must be some dirt on Michelle, it stands to reason.)

If you only care about keepong out immigrants, you can ignore all that.
If you care about womens' rights ....

Practical things: Clinton will appoint pro-choice judges to the Supreme Court.
Trump doesn't care about abortion, but he doesn't care about women either; so he's pandering to the far-right Evangelist voters by saying he'll appoint anti-choice judges.
He probably won't keep many promises, but that's not one that costs rich people any money

nauticant

Well that would blow my short theory out of the water wouldnt it

I don't think you have to be a rabid Trump supporter to distrust Hillary. If it was only "rabid Trump supporters", then given the level of distrust around her, Trump would be on course to win.

Maybe its not about Trump at all, but about the person who is HC?

Sorry to be pissing all over your theory RufusTheSpartacusReindeer. Maybe Obama is actually rather short and there's a huge mainstream media misinformation campaign to make him look much taller than the disliked short people.

Have you ever wondered why Obama was forever being photographed with Nicolas Sarkozy:

www.google.co.uk/search?q=obama+sarkozy&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&client=firefox-b&gfe_rd=cr&ei=Lq4AWOC6LpL38AfExK_IBQ (then click on images)

Obama is hated b/c he
is a black man in power
a Democrat
wants universal health care access
wants the govt to tax people and provide social services out of taxation
supports gay marriage
think the govt can do good things
made friends with Cuba & Iran
is pro-choice on abortion
said things in public positive about Black Lives Matter
doesn't believe that everything America does is always good

... and also, because he is short

I think he is on a box or stilts

Has anyone actually seen his legs?

People who've seen them have missed the fact that they're a computer generated image. Look closely sheeple!

Yes to your list LLjkk

and
because he has talked of gun control.

[http://fusion.net/story/313013/obama-gun-control-perfect-response/ here]]

I can't even go there with Trump and guns. Dread to think

Try again.

here

It has to be the height nauticant

There is no other explanation for every other presidential candidate in recent history being virtually flawless apart from HC

Wake up people, Honest Abe wasn't always honest, Washington was busted by his mum and i bet even Obama has told Michelle that dress looks beautiful on you dear (i may have taken slight liberties with history there)

I absolutely believe that all human beings are flawed, they make mistakes, they lie and woman can be just as bad as men

But how the fuck has HC ended up worse than everyone,

Even my very non political non american friends when asked about clinton/trump say that from what they have heard she is worse

Its the height i am telling you....

I'd say it's the pussy, actually. (Is that what you meant?)

Only men can be flawed. Women must be saints.

That's the thing ... they (nearly?) all turned out to be significantly flawed but not one of them was held in such low esteem before their presidency even began. So what makes HC different?

Is it because she's been at the forefront of US politics for 24 years, and was widely suspected of trying to control and direct her husband's presidency even though she was unelected? Or was it her behaviour towards the women her husband used and abused? Or the crime of staying with a man who everyone knows cheated?? Or is it to do with her private server and general contempt for the law when applied to herself?
Maybe it is all those things in different measures, but the real problem is that she's been around so long that people know her too well to allow themselves to pretend that she's something a bit more honourable?

On a side note, where's Melania staring that he's been nothing but a with her?

A gentleman!

lewji

I think pussy is a bit of a stretch

Only joking

Sorry for the earlier typos.

I was just about to enter a classroom and didn't have time to check the message.

Also, stating, not staring, of course.

Clinton has always been hated, originally as collateral damage because the Republicans wanted to destroy her DH - he committed the truly horrendous crime of keeping them out of the White House for 2 terms.
The Republicans used to be very good at winning the Presidency - back when they had a much wider appeal - and they still consider it is their right to govern the country.

After Clinton was elected Senator of NY in 2001 and was obviously hoping to be Prez herself one day, she became a hate figure in her own right.

Clinton and Obama have both been demonised and hated by the Republicans, as a woman and a black man, i.e. people who simply should never be President.

Republicans didn't used to hate - that built up over decades, as the rightwing & evangelist wingnuts took over a once respectable conservative secular party.

I just shocked myself by realising that I look back nostalgically to the Republicans at the time of President Richard Nixon !
Well, many honest Republicans denounced him and put their ethical principles before their party loyalty.
However, he started the GOP on the path of destruction, with his "Southern Strategy" and dirty tricks.

GOP demographics are against it ever regaining power - unless it changes its policies:

"Republican Senator Lindsey Graham of South Carolina, one of the party’s leading evangelists for immigration reform, warned on Sunday that the GOP faced certain doom in 2016–and beyond–unless they dealt with the issue now.

“[If]f we don’t pass immigration reform, if we don’t get it off the table in a reasonable, practical way, it doesn’t matter who you run in 2016,” Graham said on NBC’s Meet The Press. “We’re in a demographic death spiral as a party and the only way we can get back in good graces with the Hispanic community in my view is pass comprehensive immigration reform. If you don’t do that, it really doesn’t matter who we run in my view.”

What Republicans' 'Demographic Death Spiral' Looks Like

Breadandwine: are you saying the Democrats are doing what Labour did (or tried to do) under Tony Blair? It did backfire for Labour. And it does make assumptions about entire groups' voting preferences, which also don't and haven't played out.

Can I just say (I can't join the conversation much today) that as a rough overview of the thread, one side keeps saying 'you hate HIllary because X' and other people say 'no it's because ABC'. But even when the other side says 'we don't like her because ABC' you still say, no, we know you better, you don't know what you're thinking, we know what's going on inside your head better than you do'.

So if this mini conversation is played out big across the US, I can see how the people who don't want Hillary in office are not being persuaded at all by others who behave and talk in this lofty way. You're saying to people 'I know you better than you know yourself even though I've never met you or talked to you and I know your reasons are bad and therefore you are a bad person'. A Vote Hillary slogan on the end of that is just being met with

What some people are saying is that Hillary is being held to much greater standards than Trump.

If you reversed them, Trump would have been ahead by miles and Hillary would have been discounted as a hateful little pretentious figure.

And there's really one explanation for that.
And it's the pussy, really.