Why (or why not) be Christian? Part 2

[Mustardseed86]

Continuing from this thread:

https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/philosophy_religion_spirituality/5018897-why-or-why-not-be-christian

Anyone welcome to join. 🙂

The Bible is an account of myths and legends written by numerous people over a huge period of time and in many cases, a significant period of time after the event. We don’t know how much is true - some may be but other accounts are widely impossible.

How is the information incorrect when even these say the same as some posts previously written on this thread ?

https://www.britannica.com/biography/Giordano-Bruno/Final-years

https://www.historytoday.com/archive/giordano-bruno-executed

Because they’re brief overviews. Sadly most history is simplified and also written by people who don’t understand the Western esoteric tradition

Yep.

@Kdtym10 "Although historians do use it as a source as there is a lot valuable historical information to be gleaned from the bible."

No they don't!

@Kdtym10 "As rude as I want to be, but certainly this is no ruder than many of the comments made about Christianity!"

As far as I can see, you're the only person who has been rude at all on this thread. Probably because it's easier than actually addressing the points that have been made to you.

Yes they do, it’s a great source for many things in the first century. I think you are mistakenly thinking I’m claiming they are taking the story bad historical fact, which I’m not!

Oh I doubt that, you probably don’t seen the rudeness in many of the posts as they concur with your perspective.

Now regarding points made to me, I believe I have answered all the points aimed at me. Now, if I have inadvertently missed any, as you seem to think, if you can kindly set these out and I will gladly respond. Thank you

Because they’re brief overviews. Sadly most history is simplified and also written by people who don’t understand the Western esoteric tradition

So that makes the sad events at the end of Bruno Giordano's untrue?

Nope. But the reasons that led up to them are far more complex than are being painted here.

to me it still seems its basically religion chasing him for his beliefs with regard's to science the same with Galileo :

Source Google:

"The popularity of his ideas led to the Roman Inquisition trying Galileo for heresy in 1633. He was forbidden to speak of his beliefs and found "vehemently suspect of heresy"etc

And what were the heretical beliefs - these included pantheism, anti trinitarianism, belief and possible practice of magic. He was a non conformist mystic. Science as we know it, didn’t really exist. The intellectual landscape of the beginning of to mid early modern period was typically marked by the interwoven nature of many of the things we now see as very separate. John Dee, for example was an eminent mathematician, astrologer, invented navigational systems which helped England conquer much of the world. He also spoke with angels and gave us the Enochian Language.

This article gives a much better view of the position of Bruno than the “nasty Christians killing the clever innocent scientist” that seems to be the mantra of some on this thread

https://mysteriouswritings.com/the-mysterious-work-of-giordano-bruno/

I don't have an issue with some of the key teachings of Jesus eg Love your neighbour. I have an issue with the organised religion part. Just look at some of the shady evangelical churches out there that ask for money and almost become like cults around a pastor who claims a special connection with the Lord.

BIL and SIL are part of an evangelical church and are teaching their DC that people who support abortion or are way 'have the devil inside'. That is not Love your neighbour.

Most religions start off good but gradually become corrupted and used as an excuse to commit evil acts. So much has been done in the name of Christianity over the years

In the Old Testament there were the prophets who were called by God and given a particular message to share with his people, that centred on Israel which tracked back to Abraham (formerly Abram) and was due to his faith with whom God made a special covenant. God promised that through Abraham would be born a nation (this itself was an incredible miracle as Abraham and Sarah were both very very old - 100 years old - and had never been able to have children) with which God would forever be bound and faithful to, it was an everlasting covenant - ‘You will be my people, and I will be your God’. God promised his faithfulness, love and provision for a people, called by his name and that nothing in heaven or earth could ever break this eternal covenant, even when Israel rebelled and rejected him. God is unfailing and unchanging, He is still reaching out to his people with His unfailing love, faithfulness and compassion, I think Hosea 11:8 is an excellent illustration of this:

”Oh, how can I give you up, Israel?

How can I let you go?

How can I destroy you like Admah
or demolish you like Zeboiim?

My heart is torn within me,
and my compassion overflows.”

It was always God’s plan that through his covenant people Israel would come Mashiach (Saviour) who would be the one to bring eternal salvation to the world - not just for Israel, but the whole world. Isaiah 49: “I will also make you a light for the Gentiles, that my salvation may reach to the ends of the earth.”

Fast forward to the New Testament, Christians and Jewish believers in Christ believe that Jesus fulfilled the law and prophets. We believe he was and is, the spotless lamb of God who takes away the sins of the world. Jesus when he chose to suffer and give his life on the cross took our sins upon himself that we could be forgiven and saved. His is a free invitation of salvation and all who believe in his name will be saved. We are now partakers of the promise (OT when we put our faith in Christ which includes the eternal covenant and blessings.

God is still speaking to his people today. I have walked and been in communication with Jesus through His Holy Spirit my whole life since childhood, I am a totally unremarkable average person in every way and fail all the time, I get sick and tired and am totally undeserving of God’s Grace but I receive it and through the Holy Spirit we can hear God and speak with him like a friend. This may not convince anyone, but some of the things God has spoken to me about and shown me, particularly in the last year, have rocked me to my core. And there are precious things that are too beautiful to share here, heavenly things he has shown me that give me a deep unshakeable hope and joy everyday.

I haven’t been on MN and posted for a long time but the title of this thread caught my eye. If anyone can read this with an open heart, please hear me that one of the reasons to be Christian is that we don’t have much time left. I wish I could share this and even have one person be moved to open their heart to God, the God who has always been there, who knows them and loves them more deeply than they could ever imagine. Please don’t delay to open your heart to seek the Lord, when we die it is too late, we have to make our choice about Jesus while we are still alive. Accept him or reject him, but please please look at the evidence FOR Jesus before rejecting (read the accounts of his life, death and resurrection in the New Testament) The Chosen series is also an excellent (and easily digestible) illustration of the gospels. Also the Alpha Course (online or in person)

Please don’t delay to open your heart to seek the Lord, when we die it is too late

Too late for what exactly?

You would have thought God would have given Moses better directions as he was leading God’s chosen people. I would set too much store in taking things literally

@Jellyfishnchips

People may have kind and loving hearts that mean they are heartbroken by what's happening in Palestine, for example, and completely unable to rectify that with the concept of a god who doesn't intervene despite being apparently capable of intervening when he does want to.

People attribute 'miracle' recoveries from illnesses to god, but many people pray and pray to god and still their child will die of cancer.

If god was good, he wouldn't be so selective about when he intervenes. Choosing to save some children from cancer and not others, no matter how hard both parents beg him for help. If he was real, what a cruel way to treat those who ask for your support.

@Jellyfishnchips please hear me that one of the reasons to be Christian is that we don’t have much time left.

why don’t we have much time left?

the narrative of the everlasting covenant, spanning from the Old Testament prophets to the fulfillment in Jesus Christ, underscores God's enduring faithfulness and love for humanity. Through faith in Christ, believers inherit the promises of salvation and eternal life, while the presence of the Holy Spirit facilitates ongoing communion with God. Personal testimonies serve as powerful reminders of the profound impact of divine encounters in shaping faith and providing hope in the midst of life's challenges.

Basically i apricate your points and writings but bottom line humanity just needs to be kind to each other and help each other and try to make peace when possible.

@Kdtym10 "Oh I doubt that, you probably don’t seen the rudeness in many of the posts as they concur with your perspective."

I'd love to see what you consider rude. Disagreeing is not rude.

Me too.

Do you think God minds? He knows who He is, and those who know Him, know who He is.

The many posts insinuating Christian’s are somehow less intelligent- go and have a look, there’s plenty to choose from.

Oh I’m sure he doesn’t mind at all. I mean, the language of his chosen people doesn’t have upper or lower case.

Yet, up thread you were frustrated with the fact that you were ”debating with people struggling with basic primary school English”. Just because someone disagrees with you, or sees things differently, you find the need to put them down?