Why (or why not) be Christian? Part 2

[Mustardseed86]

Continuing from this thread:

https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/philosophy_religion_spirituality/5018897-why-or-why-not-be-christian

Anyone welcome to join. 🙂

He does, but also says that he came to fulfill the Law. So we believe that by being the fulfillment of the Law he gave us a new covenant. And again, the majotity of these were only for the Jewish people, so you can be non-Jewish and just follow the universal moral laws and that's fine. St Paul, who was an observant Jew, also wrote quite a lot in Romans about how the Law is righteous but makes a person more aware of their faults because it's so exacting and because Sin turned the Law into an opportunity for increasing temptation. I think if you read Romans it makes more sense, what I've said is only part of it as he wrote quite a lot on this subject.

@Pluralis the scripture you're looking for is this:

17 Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil.
"18 For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.
19 Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven." (Matthew 5:17-19)

This website is useful you can read lots of different translations and there are study resources.

https://www.biblegateway.com/

I can never quite work out whether he's upholding Jewish tradition or creating something new from the old prophecies.

I would say something new (but interpretations of this vary). By believing in Christ, what He has done for us, we receive His grace to do His will.

"10 By the which will we are sanctified through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ once for all.
11 And every priest standeth daily ministering and offering oftentimes the same sacrifices, which can never take away sins:12 But this man, after he had offered one sacrifice for sins for ever, sat down on the right hand of God;13 From henceforth expecting till his enemies be made his footstool.14 For by one offering he hath perfected for ever them that are sanctified.15 Whereof the Holy Ghost also is a witness to us: for after that he had said before,16 This is the covenant that I will make with them after those days, saith the Lord, I will put my laws into their hearts, and in their minds will I write them;17 And their sins and iniquities will I remember no more.18 Now where remission of these is, there is no more offering for sin." (Hebrews 10: 10-15)

Surely you 'should' be a. Christian if you believe in God and view The Bible as the word of God. My perception is that most of the big world religions have similar core tenets that align in part with the 10 commandments. I'm not religious but I try to make choices that don't hurt others, are not overly greedy and try to be compassionate. Not part of the #bekind brigade as that feels sanctimonious and judge but just try to be understanding and speak up when I feel there is injustice or inequality.

I have read some of the posts over there. Too many out of topics random opinions on all sorts. (@TheFancyPoet)

I find that a little disrespectful as many posters have put a lot of effort into expressing their views.

Personally I prefer to see Christianity as an offshoot of Judaism. It’s not a popular view though😂.

I think this is true though! Christianity's roots are Jewish. Jesus was/is Jewish. I think you and I just differ in where we go from there, theologically...

Sorry my last post @Pluralism. Don't know why the 'm' got cut off.🤦‍♀️

😁

or better:😎

Christianity started as a Jewish movement. If Jesus did exist, he would been Jewish all his life, up to and including his death. It was only with St Paul - the person who never met Jesus, that Christianity began to truly evolve in its own right, or Paul’s vision of it.

Can I have links to your other posts? I do not know where to find christian posts from believers.

I don't have a problem with any of that. Jesus was definitely Jewish! Obviously Jesus existed, I think we established on the previous thread that there is no longer a serious scholarly position stating otherwise.

Paul's writings are the earliest Christian texts we have and he was fully accepted by the Apostles after his conversion, he spent time with Peter and James and I think Barnabus (?).

Can I have links to your other posts? I do not know where to find christian posts from believers.
@TheFancyPoet, you can search my user name on 'advanced search' if you want.🙂

@TheFancyPoet
And just ask posters on here, they will usually tell you if they are Christian or whatever their beliefs or one might be. 🙂

None!

Hi @TheFancyPoet If you search my user name, you can find my posts. 🙂

Yes I you are right. We cart quite a bit on the interpretation of the new (and old) testament. But I often think people forget Christianity is essentially Judaism with bells on it) as is to some extent Islam but maybe if more people remembered that then there might be a little more harmony

Well exactly- Paul was a Jewish mystic and I think his work needs to be very much read in that way.

i think there are so many variables on why he was accepted by the actual apostles - it’s very difficult to conclude on this

@Kdtym10, @Mustardseed86 & @Pluralism
Regarding the Christian church and Jewish there's also this piece of scripture.

"7 “To the angel of the church in Philadelphia write:
These are the words of him who is holy and true, who holds the key of David. What he opens no one can shut, and what he shuts no one can open. 8 I know your deeds. See, I have placed before you an open door that no one can shut. I know that you have little strength, yet you have kept my word and have not denied my name. 9 I will make those who are of the synagogue of Satan, who claim to be Jews though they are not, but are liars—I will make them come and fall down at your feet and acknowledge that I have loved you. 10 Since you have kept my command to endure patiently, I will also keep you from the hour of trial that is going to come on the whole world to test the inhabitants of the earth.
11 I am coming soon. Hold on to what you have, so that no one will take your crown. 12 The one who is victorious I will make a pillar in the temple of my God. Never again will they leave it. I will write on them the name of my God and the name of the city of my God, the new Jerusalem, which is coming down out of heaven from my God; and I will also write on them my new name. 13 Whoever has ears, let them hear what the Spirit says to the churches. (Revelation 3: 7-13)

Jewish law

Exactly! We are animals. Horses don't worship gods, nor (as far as I am aware) do any other species. They just do their best to survive in their environment. We're no different.

Except that roughly 70% of the world population believes in a god. So we are different in that respect. Maybe you're saying we don't need to be or we shouldn't be, but clearly we are.

@Mustardseed86 Belief doesn't equal reality. Religion was a very useful idea to keep the masses fearful and subservient whilst the people espousing the ideas remained wealthy and powerful. It's really not rocket science.

@Eyesopenwideawake

Belief doesn't equal reality.

No, but it can cause a new reality to come into effect. Belief affects us mentally and physically as habitually thought patterns affect physiology and behaviour. In turn behaviours can affect the environment which can in turn affect us at a genetic level as gene expression is affected epigenetically by the environment and 'natural' selection changes the course of evolution.

Religion might be used by some for this, but you haven't really explained why religions and faith exist in the first place across time and all different cultures. I agree it's far from rocket science, sounds like a very simplistic comment to me.