Kerry Katona and surrogacy. Thoughts?

[ChocChipOwl]

I'm just watching Kerry on tv ad I eat my lunch. She has 5 children and, because her partner doesn't have any kids, they're going to go down the surrogacy route as her last pregnancy and birth was difficult

She said - and I quote - 'yeah we are going to get a surrogate because that's safer.'

Safer for who, I wonder?

Anyway, it got me thinking. I always used to be ambivalent about surrogacy but now I'm opposed to it, although I do recognise that on some occasions it may have a place.

But does it have a place for a 42 year old woman who already had 5 children and is so blasé about it all?

But I’m not talking about the Ukraine or any other countries. I’ve said this so many times.

You have said in this thread that all surrogacy is baby trafficking and exploitation of women. It’s not. That’s a fact.

She comes across as one on this thread to me.

Funny how everyone opposed to surrogacy is labelled a crank on this thread isn't it?

Something else we'll have to agree to disagree on @yorkshirepudgf

It's those pesky women who don't roll over and do what they're told @RedToothBrush - I'm happy to be a crank too in these circumstances actually.

Surrogacy is abhorrent and should be outlawed. It really is as simple as that. Treating a baby as a commodity should never be allowed.

No just you and the Asda sausage woman. Read back what you have said. In not so many words you have both called me a baby trafficker which I am not and I’m calling you out on it.

I can understand lots of opinions on here and also agree with lots of them too.

Yes, it is. You may not see that, but it is. Poor women are being exploited and babies are being bought and sold. Surrogacy does not begin and end in your experience. It’s not all about you. If Kerry Katona does get a surrogate, odds are it won’t be one of her rich celebrity friends will it? It’ll be a poor woman, probably from Eastern Europe or the USA, coerced into renting out her womb so KK can parade another cute baby round, then being left to cope with little or no support. And if the baby is born with a birth defect, or KK changes her mind, she’s stuck with a baby she can’t support. If she has life changing injuries from the birth so can’t work, who do you think will support her? That’s what you’re supporting.

This is the issue. Kerry seems like a nice person but you can see something isn't right with her and it's been a down hill slope since Brian.... from taxi drivers to Tom dick and Harry!

🤣🤣 trust me I am not a woman who will roll over! I have very strong feminist views on many things. I have used my body to birth a child for my sister because I wanted to.

If surrogacy was made illegal in this country it would be the worst thing that happen. This would send it “underground” and I dread to think what would happen then. Thus would be when you would need to worry.

@yorkshirepudgf As a previous poster pointed out, I have no clue who or what you are. I do know that you seem completely deluded if you can't see that surrogacy is abhorrent and leads to the exploitation of women and not putting the baby front and centre.

Whilst it worked out in your particular circumstance, that absolutely doesn't mean it's right and should be supported. I'm flabbergasted that anyone who considers themselves an educated, critical thinking individual can't see that?! Maybe it's you who is the crank?

I’d rather be called a crank than support baby trafficking.

If you read my previous input to this I am not saying that all surrogacy is ok. Just like I’m saying all surrogacy is not ok.

Therefore not ALL surrogacy is abhorrent. It can’t be because our experience is proof of this.

Me too @Asdavaluesausage

@XanaduKira you have an extremist binary view and that prevents you from considering any reasoned arguments or experiences from others which is a shame.

@yorkshirepudgf is not a trafficker and was not exploited - that's fact. What you think doesn't change the facts.

It is possible to think positively of surrogacy in one circumstance, and negatively of it in another. Not all surrogacy is the same.

For what it's worth I do think @Asdavaluesausage is a crank, she called me a human trafficker for being supportive of @yorkshirepudgf's experience. It's beyond belief really.

I don’t support baby trafficking that is something completely different to my experience. That is fact whether you like it or not. Disagreeing with this makes you sound like a crank.

So surrogacy’s bad except when it’s not bad? Ok. That’s clear as mud. Either all surrogacy is good and you support it, even when it means women are exploited, or you don’t as you know it’s abhorrent. Surrogacy is not a spectrum.

Again, you don't know that @yorkshirepudgf - all you know is how the adults feel. What happens when your baby grows up and finds out that actually her auntie is her mum? Come back then and tell us she's a completely fine and well adjusted individual who isn't messed up (even in the slightest) by this situation.

I'm actually not trying to get personal to you & your situation & honestly do hope the baby is ok. However you constantly going on about how it's all great when actually the longer term repercussions are as yet unknown, as well as people using examples such as yours to justify surrogacy is IMHO completely wrong. Surrogacy is abhorrent and no amount of you saying that it's not as your situation is great, will convince me otherwise - especially as the impacts on your innocent baby are still unknown.

I agree with this. What is ethical about creating a baby to remove it from the familiarity of its birth mother? They know her smell, heartbeat, voice. Altruistic or not (a whole other issue) how is this ever fair to the child? I believe that in years to come there we will know more about the damaging effects of surrogacy for the babies removed from mothers at birth.

@NalaNana calling me an extremist is a bit harsh. Disagree all you like with reasoned argument, but saying I'm an extremist is really off the wall. You do you.

Who would give the fruit of their womb to kerry 🙈

Some parents are good and some parents are shit.

Some surrogacy arrangements will no good and some will be shit.

It will all depend on the situation just like with anything else in life.

I know I’m not going to change your mind in this subject, which is fine, but it won’t stop me from me calling you out on being wrong.

My neice is pulling off being traumatised very well.

Come back and tell us that when she's an adult @yorkshirepudgf and has no attachment issues.

@Asdavaluesausage for me it is not binary. Surrogacy exists in many forms in many countries with various layers of regulation.

It's perfectly reasonable to say that I'm supportive of experiences like @yorkshirepudgf, but not supportive of a woman being coerced in Africa. If you can't see that those are separate circumstances, I'm not sure what to tell you.

There clearly is a spectrum. The fact that you find it unacceptable regardless of where it falls on that spectrum is fine, but there is a spectrum nonetheless.

It's perfectly fine for you to view the issue as binary as there are no circumstances where you are supportive of it - but that is not my view, and you can't tell me what my opinion is, that is for me to form.