Kerry Katona and surrogacy. Thoughts?

[ChocChipOwl]

I'm just watching Kerry on tv ad I eat my lunch. She has 5 children and, because her partner doesn't have any kids, they're going to go down the surrogacy route as her last pregnancy and birth was difficult

She said - and I quote - 'yeah we are going to get a surrogate because that's safer.'

Safer for who, I wonder?

Anyway, it got me thinking. I always used to be ambivalent about surrogacy but now I'm opposed to it, although I do recognise that on some occasions it may have a place.

But does it have a place for a 42 year old woman who already had 5 children and is so blasé about it all?

Wow, that is really interesting @Fannycann. I had never considered that before, but having experienced miscarriages I do recognise that desperation to be pregnant again. I wonder if that is how women can become almost addicted to pregnancy/surrogacy?

I couldn't find the reference Shed but I have definitely seen it discussed before that surrogate mothers do one or two surrogacies and then want their own baby for keeps. I think it may have been in something Jennifer Lahl posted, it's an American thing where surrogacy is commercial and they see it as making some money for the family and then rewarding themselves with a baby of their own (which will further deplete family finances 🙄).

I wonder if the UK has more multiple repeat surrogate mothers/surrogacy addiction than other jurisdictions thanks to the NHS which is tasked with keeping them safe despite the obstetric risks. In the USA the commercial imperative rules out some of the extremes we see here - people paying $100K minimum want a healthy baby, not least because of the costs of healthcare over there. Surrogacy agencies screen out women who have had too many babies or who are out of a fairly strict age range etc. Even in less regulated poor countries eg Ukraine which was described as having "plentiful" poor women available then agencies and buyers can pick and choose.
Yet in the U.K. we have seen some extreme multiple surrogacies, and some of those women do talk about it being an addiction. I think for some they love being the centre of attention and love from the commissioning parents. Once they've handed the baby over, even if they do keep loosely in touch, that pretty much dries up. So they have to do it over again.

Jill Hawkins springs to mind, a woman who never had any children of her own, who clearly had mental health issues as well as having attempted suicide, and whose obstetric history became increasingly dodgy as she headed towards her final, 10th surrogacy of twins which nearly ended in her death as she had an APH alone at home, and needed an emergency LSCS of premature twins.

Why someone seeking to obtain a baby through surrogacy would choose to risk the health of the babies they claim to desire so much by being oblivious to the health of the SM they use is a mystery to me.

More about Jill Hawkins

www.theargus.co.uk/news/9792919.brighton-surrogate-mum-retires-after-near-death-experience/

How can anyone saying altrustic surrogacy is fine and doesn't have an impact with this in mind?

It would be very interesting to do research into surrogacy in terms of number of pregnancy and birth order of the baby trafficked.

If there is an unusual pattern, I think there is something to be said for further follow up.

Just some agency adverts, but you can see their initial screening means women like Jill Hawkins wouldn't ever be considered. In fact I've seen an article with American fertility experts discussing her case and holding it up as an example of bad practice!

And another case of multiple surrogacy - 7 babies in 8 years.
The WHO recommends at least two years between births to allow a woman to recover. Obviously lots of women have a baby and then unintentionally get pregnant again within a very short period of time but having two close together isn't the same as treating your body like a breeding machine doing it time after again in this way.

She nearly died after the fifth, having a life threatening haemorrhage and a stay in ICU. I spoke to the consultant in charge of our hospital blood transfusion service who started our conversation with "Of course I'm fine with surrogacy and all that" and one minute later as she heard the story was spluttering with outrage at the cost to the NHS, blood transfusions, the risks, the ICU and ended saying "but she's doing it for a business isn't she?"

‘I love giving birth. This is my seventh surrogate baby’.

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/a5a8dbd8-4ac5-11eb-81f9-1b786036a268?shareToken=10d3465368ae4167b2a011124229beecc_

I was so outraged by the case I wrote to the HFEA saying there needed to be more oversight of clinics to ensure women were properly screened and ended up having a long conversation with their chief inspector. Who is of the view that because women who can conceive naturally can have 7 babies in 8 years then she didn't want to live in a country that limits women's reproductive choices and prevent women from having as many surrogate babies as they want.

Of course this is a completely false equivalence and totally spurious argument.

These aren't women choosing a big family, these are women choosing a career as a hired breeder and the cash strapped NHS has to step in to save them from the dangerous consequences of their choices.

Another surrogacy nightmare

I’ll just leave this here

Hasn't there been a huge increase in cancer among women who donate eggs?

I’m glad that some posters on here have had positive experiences with being a SM.
In the case of Yorkshire, it sounds as though she must have a very solid relationship with her family for there to not have been any emotional issues.

Surrogacy in the UK has had a lot of focus in recent years and the industry seems to be getting larger with celeb influence. A little bit like how young women are signing themselves up to OnlyFans...

Vile people in this post ! 99% of surrogacy goes amazingly well in the U.K. . Stop focusing on the few lunatics that give it a bad name !!

Every single surrogacy removes a baby from the only security they have ever known; the mother they grew in. Every single surrogacy risks the health of the surrogate mother, because pregnancy and giving birth is not a neutral process.

But it’s talking about that that’s vile. Uhuh. Ok.

Completely agree @RadicalFern

so does every time of donation as blood or organs . I’m assuming you are against those too ? Because I’m speaking as someone quite active in the U.K. surrogacy world who has been a surrogate twice .you are speaking bout if reading a few articles

so does every time of donation as blood or organs

Donated blood and organs saves existing lives, not creating new ones. The risks of donating blood are a bit of bruising and feeling dizzy. Cancer treatment also carries risk. No one is comparing that to surrogacy. Hardly the same as a 40 week pregnancy and birth is it? Goodness me. A kidney isn't a baby.

Blood can develop attachment issues? Who knew? Is there a difference between arterial and veinus? How do we know? Can blood show emotions?

So how come people can’t sell organs, but can sell babies? That’s quite scary if you think about it. Why is it never rich people being kept in baby farms or being coerced into surrogacy? If KK needs a baby, why doesn’t one of her celebrity friends step up, instead of her having to go abroad and buy a baby from a poor woman?

People do not sell babies sim the U.K. , surrogacy is altruistic and not commercial. I helped a friend have 2 babies , those babies , those embryos were always hers and her husbands , never mine . There is a very big difference between surrogacy and selling a baby . Maybe you need to look at the legislation for both

Actually donating a kidney is considerably more dangerous than carrying a baby .

Actually donating a kidney is considerably more dangerous than carrying a baby

Exactly, yes. It can kill you, but we don't buy and sell kidneys, at least not in developed countries and even when organs are sold it is not always consensual.

Please tell me what human rights a kidney has.

@Wiluli how much were you paid in expenses each time you had a baby for someone else? No need for itemised details, a total sum will do.

50% of women will suffer prolapse with pregnancy being the biggest risk factor. 10% of women will need an operation to repair a prolapse.

wait a few years...

How many babies in total have you had @Wiluli your own plus two surrogate you mention? Over what time period?

5 babies over 20 years , 3 of my own .
And off course there is a risk with any pregnancy but at the end of the day a sling as people are well aware of this then for sure it’s up to them to decide if the risk is worthy ? I also donated blood marrow a few years ago , it actuality comes with a big list of risks to myself but once more it’s up to me to decide if I find it worthy of taking them .
mim 100% against commercial surrogacy , specially in poor countries where the risk of exploring women is huge but not all surrogacy is bad .

I’m well aware of the dangers or side effects of pregnancy , I dealt with clinical neglect neglect professionally before , mostly pregnancy and birth related .

In my case around £8000 for lost wages , I did nit request all the money I actually spend as we are like family some have around £15000 and if you go on the detail is actually justified . You do realise it’s actually checked by a court right ?