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Brexit

Westminstenders: Promises, promises

962 replies

RedToothBrush · 05/08/2019 23:26

Today polling showed that there was a majority in Scotland who support Independence. The 'Boris Bounce' really isn't universal. And this is a firm sign all is not well.

There is talk tonight that Johnson is planning to stay on as PM even if he loses a vote of no confidence in order to force No Deal through and prevent a government of national unity. Instead he would call a 'people v politicians' general election to be held shortly after we'd left the EU.

Johnson's willingness to defy parliament should not be discounted and should be taken seriously. Its highly likely in one way or another. No deal is technically illegal, but its also the default. This does not seem to be fully recognised by remainers. But this is a man who lied and continued to lie. And there is every sign that he would be willing to cause some sort of constitutional crisis. Especially if he really is like Trump. This is what authoritarians do - defy convention and rip up the rule book - because the powers that are suppose to hold them to account are too weak to hold them to account. Something that Johnson has already proved time and again. He has no respect for others.

All the signs are Johnson is in fully into campaigning for a GE already. He's touring the country and ignoring Europe. He's offering money for the NHS - its open to debate whether this is new money - the optics on this are all down to what you want to believe. Those who want Johnson will believe the promise; those who don't won't.

The penny hasn't fully dropped in parliament. There is talk of a vote of no confidence being called by Labour 'at the earliest opportunity' in September. The reality is its too little too late and is unlikely to work to have the desired effect and inside will play right into Johnson's plan. The failure of the Opposition to spot what he was likely to do, has been the story of the last 3 years, where Remainers have been reactionary and unable to anticipate what would happen next. Their lack of imagination and inability to look beyond their own rhetoric has been their undoing and may cost us all in the long run.

Meanwhile in Brussels, the EU unlike our Parliament have recognised the inevitability of no deal and if Johnson wants no deal there is no way to stop it. And that he has no inclination whatsoever to negotiate.

The expectation is still that the EU will have the backstop and the Brexit Bill of £39 billion as the requirement for the opening of trade talks if we no deal.

Which leaves up shit creek.

At the same time the new trade minister Liz Truss is full on libertarian and talking to the US with this in mind.

That would mean a bonfire of rights and standards which will horrify many. That means goodbye to workers rights, food standards and data protection.

The tech giants have the ears of Washington so British ideas of a tax on them are being seen as a block on a US trade deal.

It comes as the UK has joined a US coalition to protect ships in the Gulf - something we were originally given a snub against, and led to Jeremy Hunt saying we would join a European led force. Its not clear what, who or how the US uturn has come about...

Meanwhile our summer holidays are all getting more expensive... and this is just the start of it.

This is real. This isn't a bluff.

OP posts:
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howabout · 11/08/2019 09:58

Latest OpiniumResearch poll (26 July):

CON: 31% (+1)
LAB: 28% (-)
BREX: 16% (+1)
LDEM: 13% (-3)
GRN: 5% (-)

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DGRossetti · 11/08/2019 10:06

The Brexiteer response to the Queens irritation is simply going to be

Well if she isn't going to respect THE WILL OF THE PEOPLE then she can fuck back off to Germany, can't she ?

I think the Queen/Palace underestimate the forces that have been awoken in England. That's what you get for playing by the rules.

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HeatedRollers · 11/08/2019 10:15

Post Brexit, all that land and buildings along with their income, the RF manage would help a struggling nation.

Prince Andrew has a dreadful reputation how can he represent the nation?

The RF are defenders of the faith, that seems over, CoE has gone woke, they believe men are women and have skelters now.

Charles was friends with Savile, he struggles with boundaries between crown and state. Charles cheated on his wife, how can he defend the faith?

William doesn't seem to want the job - part time - just wants the benefits. William doesn't go to church often, how can he defend the faith?

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TheElementsSong · 11/08/2019 10:19

I think the Queen/Palace underestimate the forces that have been awoken in England.

Yup, it's all Blut Und Boden hereabouts now.

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Cailleach1 · 11/08/2019 10:24

I think they are going to force a disorderly Brexit. That will force Ireland to put up checks and lead to an essential repartitioning of the Ireland. Then when they go for a trade deal, the backstop as it is will be gone. Maybe when Frost went over last week he said it won't be frictionless.

In those circumstances, I'd imagine Ireland having being fcked again by lovely neighbours, would have to veto any future trade deal. I think Ireland probably knew they would be fcked, but at least not let the f*ckee benefit from their harm.

Johnson getting a let off intro on BBC World. Said how he was going to increase spending on police, etc. Should always be a caveat how he promised police and then some as Mayor. Then did the opposite.

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Cailleach1 · 11/08/2019 10:26

Fcker, not fckee. Getting my f*cks wrong.

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Cailleach1 · 11/08/2019 10:29

When Theresa May lost the election, the cowards like Johnson didn't try to remove her. They left her as a lightning rod. That would save their careers. Just narcissist, cowardly f*ckers.

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ThereWillBeAdequateFood · 11/08/2019 10:34

howabout

That opinion poll is depressing. How anyone can look at the current political mess and think Bozo is the solution is beyond me.

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ThereWillBeAdequateFood · 11/08/2019 10:43

Just seen the announcement about more prison places. I think it’s meant to cost billions.
Where the fuck has Bozo found all this money from? If Labour planned this spending spree huge questions would be asked about where the funding is coming from.

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HeatedRollers · 11/08/2019 10:47

Who will catch the prisoners?

Twitter is full of police dressed in rainbow party gear, walking past men in dog masks, getting upset over pronouns and lesbians whilst cracking out disco moves!

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ThereWillBeAdequateFood · 11/08/2019 10:50

The prisons will probably be full of people committing thought crime against Brexit.

We’re all doomed.

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HeatedRollers · 11/08/2019 10:54

Indeed though crime, the police can search the internet listening to Kylie rather than walk the streets - whilst schools and employers can report!

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woman19 · 11/08/2019 10:57

Labour rules out alliance with SNP in event of hung parliament amid election speculation

www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/labour-snp-coalition-general-election-no-deal-brexit-a9050741.html

Quite right grandpa. Leaves the path ready for an agreement with the
DickHead party.

www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2019/aug/11/boris-johnson-has-a-problem-with-women-its-not-the-one-you-think

Marina Wheeler tells of cervical cancer diagnosis

Boris Johnson’s estranged wife says she is free of cancer and urges women to take test

www.theguardian.com/society/2019/aug/11/marina-wheeler-tells-of-cervical-cancer-diagnosis-boris-johnson

Wheeler was ill while he was with Symonds?

They know how appallingly that fat little man with dyed hair polls with women.

I suspect that might have been behind mercer's tweet to Hyde.

Is 'Worcester Woman' still a thing?

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Cailleach1 · 11/08/2019 10:58

Johnson always good at promising the earth. Or making sure money is wasted. I'd imagine private firms will make a good profit. With great inefficiency.

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woman19 · 11/08/2019 11:11

Nationalism is a daft answer to the right questions.

www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2019/aug/10/very-idea-of-a-united-kingdom-being-torn-apart-by-toxic-nationalism

When I grew up with the generally turgid pop music of the 80s I looked back jealously at the pop music of the 60s and 70s.

I feel the same about our politicians and journalists now.

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BigChocFrenzy · 11/08/2019 12:19

Remainers want to maximise LDem, Green, SNP and Plaid support because those are the Remain parties

Remainers like me don't give a fuck which of the Brexit-supporting parties gets in, so long as it isn't Farage's

Lexiters have a cheek, pissing all over Remainers and then whingeing at those Remainers who refuse to vote for Labour ever again

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Peregrina · 11/08/2019 12:24

Who would have thought that Cummings is a hypocrite who claims EU subsidies?

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BigChocFrenzy · 11/08/2019 12:35

Ireland is holding firm on the backstop,
because they don't want to be in a position where a trade deal has been negotiated and they have to veto it.
Easier to keep their line in the sand now.

However, the EU have said that the backstop will be a precondition for post-Brexit negotiations, even on minideals
Since most EU countries are actually small countries, like Ireland, they have plenty of support to keep this up.

BJ refusing to talk until the EU drops the backstop has hardened EU attitudes
So, it all depends on whether Ireland changes its mind - the EU won't force them

Anyway, if the backstop is dropped, BJ could put up goods check 5 minutes later, so Ireland could gain nothing even in he short term by giving in

  • BJ should be thinking of what he could offer them


The UK has the problem that if they don't put up checks against Irish goods, then under WTO rules they can't against any other WTO member, without risking punitive tariffs etc

Current UK plans seem to be zero tariffs on many goods
However, that means other countries may not need to negotiate a trade deal with the UK,

e.g. Canada said that zero UK tariffs on their goods while still having their own WTO tariffs against Uk goods would probably be better than any trade deal

Then of course there is the US Congress and their infulential Ways & Means Committee who have vowed to block any trade deal that endangers the GFA
- basically that would mean Ireland again being able to demand a backstop
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placemats · 11/08/2019 12:47

Marina Hyde on Mercer.

twitter.com/marinahyde/status/1126410799319326720?lang=en

Quite frankly he is as attractive as George Warleggan.

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BigChocFrenzy · 11/08/2019 12:51

All those billions in promises

..... and Tories only up one point compared to the corresponding poll on the day BJ became leader

Just for fun, I put the Opinium poll figures in the seat calculator
and it gave a hung Paliament - where the DUP MPs were NOT sufficient to give a majority

Quite apart from the predictor, I suspect we will get a hung Parliament, maybe a succession of them

Qn:
if the Tories+DUP in a new Parliament only needed a few more MPs for a majority, would the Lexiter MPs give Confidence & Support to a Tory post-Brexit govt ? Hmm

Westminstenders: Promises, promises
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BigChocFrenzy · 11/08/2019 12:54

He was the soldier in that Dove TV ad, shortly before becoming an MP Grin

He looked fine then, but in the pics I've seen since - like many MPs -
he seems to have been taking too much advantage of the subsidised restaurants & bars

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BigChocFrenzy · 11/08/2019 13:10

Nice to know how much Brexiters care about the Union
Shows the objection to the backstop is just an excuse to force No Deal

We can expect the Scots to be demonised again in the GE campaign,
with Corbyn too cowardly / cynical to stand up for Scotland's right to self-determination

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2019/aug/10/very-idea-of-a-united-kingdom-being-torn-apart-by-toxic-nationalism

Recent polling shows a majority of Scots support Scottish independence.

In a new Hope Not Hate poll, many more – 60% – agree a no-deal Brexit will accelerate the demand for independence.
Only 15% disagree.

What is most worrying is not just that so many think the union will end but how at least for now so few appear to care.

Only 30% of British Conservatives (and only 14% of Brexit party voters) would oppose Brexit if it meant the break-up of the union:

56% of Tories (and 78% of Brexitt^ party voters) – in total 70% of Leavers – would go ahead regardless, even if the union collapsed.
....
the Tories will likely embrace Lynton Crosby’s well-honed election strategy:
to whip up English nationalism^ by demonising immigrants as well as perfidious Europeans and playing the Scottish card he so successfully deployed in 2015^

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prettybird · 11/08/2019 13:11

It might be mean but I'm looking forward to watching BlowJob visibly age and get greyer (both skin and hair) the longer he is prime minister as they all do Grin

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BigChocFrenzy · 11/08/2019 13:17

Probably won't happen, pretty because he is unlike any other PM I can think of:

He leaves all the work to others, as in London - so he won't be knackered

He doesn't give a shit what happens to party or country, so he won't worry, no matter how bad things get

  • he just wants to play at being PM and boost his later earnings as a media personality
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BigChocFrenzy · 11/08/2019 13:18

He has no sense of shame, only a massive sense of entitlement

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