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Brexit

The Brexit Arms. A friendly place for anyone wanting to chat about Brexit.

999 replies

surferjet · 14/01/2017 15:07

Pull up a chair and relax.....Smile

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Corcory · 29/01/2017 19:13

But Surfer DT is trying to keep the wrong people out.

surferjet · 29/01/2017 19:22

Possibly Corcory - but as I said earlier, I can't get worked up over it as he's acting on an election pledge, so it's not like people weren't expecting it. This whole Trump hysteria is getting a bit ridiculous tbh, every other thread on here is about trying to ban him from entering the UK - shame they can't laugh at the irony but there you are.

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Corcory · 29/01/2017 19:31

I'm not too keen on hysteria either or the idea that he should be banned from the UK. You are right he is acting on his election pledge but I disagree fundamentally with his ideas and think he is only going to make things worse. He seems to have little or no idea about diplomacy or how not to rub other people up the wrong way.

surferjet · 29/01/2017 19:35

Yeah, we just have to sit back & watch for a while. But comparing this temporary ban on entering the U.S to Hitler and the Jews is beyond hysterical - I just can't enter into a conversation with these people.

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fakenamefornow · 29/01/2017 19:37

Yes, I know it's the Cross of St Peter (him allegedly being crucified upside down) but it is also used in modern times as a symbol of anti-Christian, the occult and satanism

Is this Leaver logic? You believe people worship the devil and he has put them in positions of power? The world has truly gone nuts.

Inkanta · 29/01/2017 19:48

Surferjet - you are on good form today!

surferjet · 29/01/2017 19:58

Thank you Smile Wine

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SemiPermanent · 29/01/2017 20:05

howabout Shock

Just read that article - so: Trump's Muslim Ban = fake news then.

It's actually Obama's Muslim Ban - Trump just added Syria.

Where were the outraged in 2015 & 2016??

Quelle surprise.

fakenamefornow · 29/01/2017 20:28

Funny I don't remember Muslims being held at airports, denied boarding of planes, court cases and demonstrations at airports in the US and international condemnation of Obama's Muslim ban. Maybe the devil suppressed reporting.

RufusTheSpartacusReindeer · 29/01/2017 20:39

fake

Grin
SemiPermanent · 29/01/2017 20:40

So, for clarity, it's fine to introduce the measures and pass them into law but not ok to act on laws that are already there.
Cool.
At least I'm straight on the detail now:
The ideology is acceptable, but not the action.

RufusTheSpartacusReindeer · 29/01/2017 20:41

fake

The Brexit Arms. A friendly place for anyone wanting to chat about Brexit.
RufusTheSpartacusReindeer · 29/01/2017 20:41

Its a conspiracy

They are all devil worshipers

fakenamefornow · 29/01/2017 20:49

They are all devil worshipers

It would be hilarious if it wasn't so serious, people actually do believe this shit and if this is what you believe there is absolutely no reasoning with them.

Bearbehind · 29/01/2017 20:52

The twisted thought process of some on here and IRL is beyond words.

The lengths people are going to in order to justify what is going on both astound and horrify me.

I've always felt there was an element of brain washing amongst Leavers, today has confirmed that.

GhostofFrankGrimes · 29/01/2017 21:00

Completely agree Bear.

TheElementsSong · 29/01/2017 21:17

Well extra kudos to Corcory Wine

squishysquirmy · 29/01/2017 21:29

I read howabout's link. The text in that link does not support the allegation she was making. If the assertions in that link are true, then it seems like the legislation introduced by the Obama administration was (at best) sloppily written, and may have made this easier for Trump. If true, it appears to have been introduced to make it easier, and quicker to block certain individuals from certain countries.That's the problem with legislation like that - it's not just about how the current government uses it, it's how a future government might use it.
But what is happening now is not being done by Obama. Using legislation to target specific individuals, is not the same as using it to apply a blanket ban. The justifying, minimising and diversions are getting desperate now.

TheElementsSong · 29/01/2017 21:44

There's more honesty in the "can't give a fuck" posts than the minimising and whatabouttery posts.

DebbieDownersGiveItARest · 29/01/2017 21:49

Apathy while Rome burns Confused

Which Rome perhaps the US is the only Rome in your eyes?

I am struggling to digest this hysteria as well.
What do the outraged on here feel about Howabouts link there re Obama's Ban?

Perhaps for clarity you need to answer some questions on that?

Two men May went to see in Two days.

One is you could say, a revolting Misogynist evil torturing dictator, who has regressed women's rights - subjugated them, seen a mass increase in violence to women during his reign, has arrested and got rid of the media and opposition to him ( as in literally had them imprisoned/disappeared and tortured), has used and abused refugees as a tool to get what he wants, in general has appalling worrying human rights record, treats disabled people beyond anything imaginable - and the other.....is Trump.

But its Trump who is the right wing Hitler Fascist Confused Its Trump who has caused the outrage? Its Trump everyone on MN is railing about Confused. So Turkeys - Rome - Turkeys, women clearly are not relevant here. They are not worthy of great special compassion some of our regular posters here claim to have?
High praise for Laura from the Beeb, asking Trump awkward Questions, but where was she in the country that is torturing, and abusing and beating people?

There is an obsession on MN with Hitler and Fascists. I look at the world in a quick glance and I see - a group who wear black, have great uniform PR ( like the Nazi's) clear simple imagery ( like the Nazi's) who attack and kill people based on race and faith - they actually kill them, ( like the Nazi's) I see a group who slaughters Gay people, rapes and turns women into sex slaves, who have committed mass genocide, who repress people, chop their limbs off, encourage hate and killing of other minorities eg Jews force them to live under uber strict laws, maim and kill at will...( like the Nazis) and its ISIS who I am seeing.

I suppose this strange obsession shouldn't surprise me however because its never balanced with the socialists ( of course there is a strong argument that Hitlers - National Socialists - were of course socialists). Even the excerpt someone quoted - " first they came for the socialists" ........selective outrage...selective compassion.

The soviet socialists murdered 60 million people. The Chinese socialists murdered 50 million The nazis 20 million but as Stalin said - "A single death is a tragedy; a million deaths is a statistic. When one dies, it is a tragedy. When a million die, it is a statistic" So hey ho....

Perhaps the socialists among us feel the same about all the other atrocities happening right now?

Funny I don't remember Muslims being held at airports, denied boarding of planes, court cases and demonstrations at airports in the US and international condemnation of Obama's Muslim ban. Maybe the devil suppressed reporting

Well, for a start, if you cast your eye over a few threads on MN right now you will see posters claiming to be of ME origin who were denied entry to the US who have been discriminated against and questioned. They are saying this has always been there since Bush.
Even in my one short experience at JFK waiting for hours in line in 2012 I remember seeing them speaking harshly to a little old man who was wearing a hat that looked like Pakol, I think they were asking him to remove it - and he looked scared and maybe didn't understand...and he was hauled off in a very hard handed way.

Anyway as usual all of this will be water off ducks back. Sad

Corcory · 29/01/2017 21:50

Thanks Elements!!

DoNotBringLulu · 29/01/2017 21:52

I read Howabout's link also, the author says Trump expanded and acted upon legislation already there - I would like to know how was Obama intending to use it etc, as Squishy discusses. I don't know much about US politics and I wonder if it's allowable in their constitution to do what Trump is undertaking. I hope they can stop this madness. I read about a vet working in Glasgow, unable to change flight at New York on way home from holiday, and having to spend thousands on trying to find an alternative route home.

SemiPermanent · 29/01/2017 21:58

That's the problem with legislation like that - it's not just about how the current government uses it, it's how a future government might use it

That's my point really - the existing legislation (passed into law under Obama) is the problem - it allows this (what Trump is doing) to happen.

Calling trump out on what he is doing is right, but getting caught up in the hysteria is overlooking the glaring elephant - it was already a policy, he just decided to implement it to its fullest, literal extent.

Trump's actions have shone a massive spotlight on the issues that were already there, the conditions & issues that have been allowed to flourish.
Because Obama was liked, admired, trusted & respected it was 'ok' - when actually it really isn't & wasn't.

Personally, I liked Obama & think Trump is an arse - but the fact remains that Trump was democratically elected - he was chosen to be President; if Trump is really what the people want, then why?
That's the underlying issue in it all.

SemiPermanent · 29/01/2017 22:01

And YY to Debbie's post.

DebbieDownersGiveItARest · 29/01/2017 22:08

Obama was a discreet diplomatic politician he down played Isis in public, talking about them like a non entity - annoying fly...he said once something along the lines of - " if America took them on we could squash them in days", in my view a great tactic for helping to stop further recruitment. However its clear US is operating in ISIS held regions, assisting with training, arms etc, secret missions - hard wear etc. So Obama was doing something but just in a far more discreet way, and we also know his polices were getting people stopped at immigration.

Trump is a brash vocal egotistical business man with no concept of discretion, diplomacy or statesmanship, he seems to wear his heart on his twitter. I believe his actions have sadly played right into the wrong peoples hands and he would have been far more effective to do more behind the scenes in a discreet way like Obama as PP up thread said - no knowledge of people being stopped.