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Conflict in the Middle East
Original poster

Have the events of the last couple of days changed your mind on the Israel/Gaza crisis?

1000 replies

BaMamma · 21/02/2025 19:47

Not only, but including, the macabre theatre with the coffins of the Bibas babies, Oded Lifshitz, and, as we now know, a currently anonymous Palestinian woman.

The locked coffins with no keys.

The antisemitic poster of Netanyahu as a blood sucking vampire.

The celebrations in Gaza, happy, joyful people surrounding those coffins., children dancing, parents smiling.

The 'mix-up' over Shiri Bibas body.

The discovery that the babies were murdered, not killed in an airstrike.

Does any of that change your mind about the rightness of your position on Israel and Palestine/Gaza?

OP posts:
ploppydoppy · 22/02/2025 00:21

What’s the answer then, if even babies are seen as ‘tormentors’? How can there ever be peace?

Quite

BambooBambou · 22/02/2025 00:22

ploppydoppy · 22/02/2025 00:20

Although of course in other contexts one person's terrorist is another person's freedom fighter.

If you are killing civilian babies & children for political reasons you a terrorist, at least that's what we call those who do it here

Then Netanyahu is the biggest terrorist of them all.

inamarina · 22/02/2025 00:22

BidoofBlue · 22/02/2025 00:20

If people see murdered children as their tormentors and dance around their coffins, those people are monsters.

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Agree.

inamarina · 22/02/2025 00:24

BambooBambou · 22/02/2025 00:16

I didn't see anyone on here saying they are justified. Understandable, yes. Although of course in other contexts one person's terrorist is another person's freedom fighter.

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Such brave freedom fighters, attacking teenagers at a festival, families and peace activists.

ploppydoppy · 22/02/2025 00:25

Then Netanyahu is the biggest terrorist of them all.

So that makes it ok to target civilians?

BambooBambou · 22/02/2025 00:26

ploppydoppy · 22/02/2025 00:21

What’s the answer then, if even babies are seen as ‘tormentors’? How can there ever be peace?

Quite

Try not to kill 17,000 children and another 44,000 adults? Don't decimate all their houses, block all their supplies and cause an entire population to live in fear for their lives for two winters? Don't punish an entire civilian population for the actions of a terrorist group (who are also responsible for control of and torture among that population)?

ploppydoppy · 22/02/2025 00:27

Such brave freedom fighters, attacking teenagers at a festival, families and peace activists.

Could you imagine a similar attack at Glastonbury & people justifying it because of the UK foreign policy.

ploppydoppy · 22/02/2025 00:30

@BambooBambou so the UK has it coming too then?
400,000 civilians died during the War on Terror. You ok with dying or your dc for the sake of balance?

BambooBambou · 22/02/2025 00:31

BambooBambou · 22/02/2025 00:26

Try not to kill 17,000 children and another 44,000 adults? Don't decimate all their houses, block all their supplies and cause an entire population to live in fear for their lives for two winters? Don't punish an entire civilian population for the actions of a terrorist group (who are also responsible for control of and torture among that population)?

Show quote history

Oh I forgot to add - don't actively try to support that terrorist group in the first place.

BambooBambou · 22/02/2025 00:33

ploppydoppy · 22/02/2025 00:30

@BambooBambou so the UK has it coming too then?
400,000 civilians died during the War on Terror. You ok with dying or your dc for the sake of balance?

How on earth did you manage to extrapolate that from what I said!

ploppydoppy · 22/02/2025 00:33

@BambooBambou is it not the same logic?

BambooBambou · 22/02/2025 00:34

ploppydoppy · 22/02/2025 00:25

Then Netanyahu is the biggest terrorist of them all.

So that makes it ok to target civilians?

Who has said that it is? Clearly the whole point is that civilians should not be targeted.

BambooBambou · 22/02/2025 00:36

ploppydoppy · 22/02/2025 00:33

@BambooBambou is it not the same logic?

You need to be more specific - I don't know which supposed bit of logic you are trying to extract and compare! Thanks!

Enough4me · 22/02/2025 00:36

Including civilians in Isreal?
Or is ok to attack them if someone is angry as they're just Jews, they should accept it.

BambooBambou · 22/02/2025 00:37

Enough4me · 22/02/2025 00:36

Including civilians in Isreal?
Or is ok to attack them if someone is angry as they're just Jews, they should accept it.

Obviously it is not ok to kill civilians on any side!

ploppydoppy · 22/02/2025 00:38

You are the one arguing why babies are seen as tormentors...

Clearly the whole point is that civilians should not be targeted.

But you said it was understandable so again do you think it's understandable when the UK civilians are targeted?

ploppydoppy · 22/02/2025 00:39

Understandable, yes.

These are your words...

ploppydoppy · 22/02/2025 00:40

You need to be more specific - I don't know which supposed bit of logic you are trying to extract and compare! Thanks!

I think the question is pretty simple. I'm not surprised you are having such difficulty with it though.

inamarina · 22/02/2025 00:42

ploppydoppy · 22/02/2025 00:38

You are the one arguing why babies are seen as tormentors...

Clearly the whole point is that civilians should not be targeted.

But you said it was understandable so again do you think it's understandable when the UK civilians are targeted?

Babies seen as tormentors is one of the most batshit things I’ve seen on this board.

ploppydoppy · 22/02/2025 00:43

Or is ok to attack them if someone is angry as they're just Jews, they should accept it.

@Enough4me it seems to be the case doesn't it?

ploppydoppy · 22/02/2025 00:45

@inamarina its depressing

inamarina · 22/02/2025 00:47

ploppydoppy · 22/02/2025 00:45

@inamarina its depressing

It is. I actually had to read that initial comment twice, I couldn’t quite believe who was being described as tormentor.

BambooBambou · 22/02/2025 00:50

ploppydoppy · 22/02/2025 00:38

You are the one arguing why babies are seen as tormentors...

Clearly the whole point is that civilians should not be targeted.

But you said it was understandable so again do you think it's understandable when the UK civilians are targeted?

Understandable does not mean it is ok/morally acceptable/lawful etc. By understandable I mean that this is what you should probably expect from human nature. If members of your family/tribe/nation hurt/kill/oppress members of my family/tribe/nation, it is likely that I will feel feelings of hatred towards your family/tribe/nation. I am certainly not saying that it is ok to act on that. Merely that if a country oppresses a population to the level that Israel has done to the Palestinians, then they are unlikely to find the Palestinians having warm thoughts regarding them, and with a basic understanding of psychology it should not be surprising to expect to find a few of them celebrating Israeli deaths, just as some Israelis have celebrated Palestinian deaths.

Original poster
BaMamma · 22/02/2025 00:52

BambooBambou · 22/02/2025 00:50

Understandable does not mean it is ok/morally acceptable/lawful etc. By understandable I mean that this is what you should probably expect from human nature. If members of your family/tribe/nation hurt/kill/oppress members of my family/tribe/nation, it is likely that I will feel feelings of hatred towards your family/tribe/nation. I am certainly not saying that it is ok to act on that. Merely that if a country oppresses a population to the level that Israel has done to the Palestinians, then they are unlikely to find the Palestinians having warm thoughts regarding them, and with a basic understanding of psychology it should not be surprising to expect to find a few of them celebrating Israeli deaths, just as some Israelis have celebrated Palestinian deaths.

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I hope you didn't strain anything with that pretzelling of logic.

OP posts:
maggiesleapp · 22/02/2025 00:55

@Broug
Sinn Fein were elected by the majority of nationalists
IRA financed by americans and libyans
The IRA launched plenty of rockets and planted bombs on the mainland.
IRA members have been accused of rape and they definitely kidnapoed for ransom.

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