Have the events of the last couple of days changed your mind on the Israel/Gaza crisis?

[BaMamma]

Not only, but including, the macabre theatre with the coffins of the Bibas babies, Oded Lifshitz, and, as we now know, a currently anonymous Palestinian woman.

The locked coffins with no keys.

The antisemitic poster of Netanyahu as a blood sucking vampire.

The celebrations in Gaza, happy, joyful people surrounding those coffins., children dancing, parents smiling.

The 'mix-up' over Shiri Bibas body.

The discovery that the babies were murdered, not killed in an airstrike.

Does any of that change your mind about the rightness of your position on Israel and Palestine/Gaza?

So what if Jewish people have been historically oppressed

Well the oppression of the Jews happened only a few years before the beginning of the creation of Israel; so by that token, the Palestinian displacement is also historic and therefore no longer relevant?

That's not stopping the Israelis settling in the West Bank, also not 'their land' but yet they claim it is

www.theguardian.com/world/ng-interactive/2025/feb/27/seized-settled-let-how-airbnb-and-bookingcom-help-israelis-make-money-from-stolen-palestinian-land

This will be completely acceptable to some on these boards.

And the only come back they will have is the fact it is from a newspaper they don't like...

I don’t believe it is inherently their land, no.

But I believe the appalling events of WW2 (the mass murder of 6 million Jews) justified the creation of a Jewish state, and that logically had to be around Jerusalem. The Palestinians were not treated any better or worse than anyone else at the time, many territories were redefined and millions of people were forced to resettle elsewhere to achieve the best chance at global peace.

The only difference here is that the Palestinians have held onto their grudge and see it as justification for appalling violence, whereas other countries have adapted to their new normal and accepted it as a price to pay for peace.

There is a lot of oversimplification and revisionism on this thread of a very complex history which has seen appalling acts and resistance to peaceful solutions by both sides over the years. Surely rather than picking over the bones of the past we need to look at how we can move forward. This will not be an easy or quick process and needs concerted support from neighbouring countries and the international community who have far too often put their own interests above those of both Palestinians and Israelis. Whatever the question, ethnic cleansing is never the answer, even if it is feasible. This is their home, and they have a right to live there. Israel needs to elect a Government committed to the peace process that acknowledges the rights of Palestinians to self-determination and who do not support settlers. The Palestinians need to be provided with a democratic process and a viable answer to Hamas (which, lets not forget, was actively supported by Israel for several decades in order to stop any real discussion of a two-state solution). No-one is saying this will be easy - the situation has festered for nearly 80 years so it is certainly not going to be solved overnight. But there is no "quick fix" and we have to gain some hope from intractable situations have been resolved.

This is quite shocking

It’s not acceptable to me. If the farmer was minding his own business, and there is not more to the story than the Guardian prints, then that absolutely should not have happened and I condemn it unequivocally. I’m not here to say I stand by everything the IDF do, I don’t. In the same was presumably you don’t stand by the Palestinians spitting on the bodies of murdered Israeli citizens, yet you still support them. And I support Israelis, as I believe that in the broader picture here they are not the aggressors.

Completely agree @Sleepinggreyhounds
This thread is descending into some very weird takes.

Not as shocking as Palestinians spitting on the paraded naked body of a murdered Israeli girl. But you won’t admit that.

Why would you say that? That is also shocking but we're not discussing that at the minute are we

Whatever the question, ethnic cleansing is never the answer, even if it is feasible. This is their home, and they have a right to live there. Israel needs to elect a Government committed to the peace process that acknowledges the rights of Palestinians to self-determination and who do not support settlers. The Palestinians need to be provided with a democratic process and a viable answer to Hamas

Palestinians don’t want a democratic process resulting in a liberal, peace seeking government. How many more times? They actively do not want this.

When have the Israelis ever left the West Bank and Gaza alone? To live with their cousins? Never. They ‘mow the lawn’ every year. Take more land by force and refer to Palestinians as animals.

Are you going to mention the ongoing threat of violence and terrorist attacks that Israel faces, or just pretend they do what they do from sheer badness?

This is not acceptable language and assumptions to make. I think most people will find actions taken by both sides as shocking.

Because it’s the truth.

I do, but @Liv999 only jumps on whatever is posted in support of her views and says ‘how shocked’ he/she is; while ignoring or even denying far worse against Israelis.

Neither do the Russians by this metric. Shall we move them? Stop being ridiculous.

I would imagine the people of the West Bank would hold a pretty big grudge for being aggressively thrown off their land and homes they have lived in for generations yes wouldn't you? Or maybe you might just agree that it wasn't really your land anyway so its all OK and go off and start all over again somewhere else?

Of course I will agree with what supports my views, you do exactly the same

We have no idea what the Palestinian people are prepared to accept in return for peace because they have never been offered it in recent times. We never got the chance to find out if they would accept the peace process as outlined by the Oslo accords as Netanyahu derailed it comprehensively (and the right wing Israelis objected so violently Rabin was murdered for supporting it).

Well said

@Wildflowers99 if you genuinely believe the Israelis are not the aggressors, then you must live in la la land. You must ignore the news coverage of Gaza and believe it's all made up nonsense. I actually pity you.

I would imagine the people of the West Bank would hold a pretty big grudge for being aggressively thrown off their land and homes they have lived in for generations yes wouldn't you?

How's the grudge-holding working out for them?

They are the aggressors.

They triggered the war.

Picking a fight and losing is not the same as being attacked.

Don't you think both sides have acted aggressively?