Page 22 | Please do all you can to object to the genocide of Palestinians

Finallyloggedin · 2023-11-21T13:11:16+00:00

It’s just heartbreaking. I’ve seen videos on twitter that are beyond anything I can even begin to describe. Palestinians are being murdered in their thousands and the western media is largely pretending it’s not happening. The average age of the people who have been killed in Gaza is FIVE years old. The UK media are not showing how the Israeli government is openly talking about, and cheerleading genocide now. Israeli government speaks about Palestinians as if they are not humans. They are saying women are targets as they can have babies. I’ve just read how, since October 7th they have taken over 5,000 Palestinians from the West Bank and tortured them. They were already routinely arresting Palestinians and taking them away from their family with no reason and no but this is not being adequately reported. Please, please visit sites such as 972 magazine and declassified uk. The BBC, etc, unfortunately aren’t reporting the extent to what is going on. [[https://www.declassifieduk.org/israel-and-its-allies-are-repurposing-the-goals-and-lies-of-1948-in-gaza-in-2023/ https://www.declassifieduk.org/israel-and-its-allies-are-repurposing-the-goals-and-lies-of-1948-in-gaza-in-2023/]]

untitledmum · 04/12/2023 21:19

@Toothyfruity

Israel have told Gazans civilians to evacuate those buildings that you mentioned proving there is no genocidal intent. Israel's intention is to uproot Hamas and destroy their infrastructure. They have no genocidal intent against Palestinians.

So once again I request you change your misleading thread title to "Objecting the genocide of Hamas" (A very apt title for this thread)

Chaitales · 04/12/2023 21:28

untitledmum · 04/12/2023 21:19

@Toothyfruity

Israel have told Gazans civilians to evacuate those buildings that you mentioned proving there is no genocidal intent. Israel's intention is to uproot Hamas and destroy their infrastructure. They have no genocidal intent against Palestinians.

So once again I request you change your misleading thread title to "Objecting the genocide of Hamas" (A very apt title for this thread)

Edited

To where? Have you seen a map of Gaza? Sea on one side, Israel and a fence on the rest, and a tiny border with Egypt which is being bombed too

EasterIssland · 04/12/2023 21:28

untitledmum · 04/12/2023 21:01

The title of this thread is "Please do all you can to object to the genocide of Palestinians" so you have no right to accuse people of derailing the thread when they are objecting to this very claim.

Hence I object the very motive of this thread, it is erroneous. Accusing anyone with an opposing view as hateful is just a cowardly way of saying that you don't really have an educated opinion to argue.

The Israeli government does not have a racist, genocidal agenda towards Palestinians. The Israeli government has a genocidal intent towards HAMAS and Hamas alone.

Once again my intention is not to derail this thread, rather its to prove how warped this entire thread is.

If the government doesn’t have a racist genicidal agenda against Palestine then can you explain to me where is Palestine in the map presented my the government in Sept 2023. Did he forget to put it there ?
https://www.wionews.com/world/israeli-prime-minister-benjamin-netanyahu-under-fire-for-holding-up-map-erasing-palestine-during-un-speech-639024/amp

Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu under fire for holding up map without Palestine during UN speech - World News

In his speech, Netanyahu underlined the significance of bolstering ties with Arab countries, with a special emphasis on Saudi Arabia.

https://www.wionews.com/world/israeli-prime-minister-benjamin-netanyahu-under-fire-for-holding-up-map-erasing-palestine-during-un-speech-639024/amp

untitledmum · 04/12/2023 21:39

@EasterIssland
Once again Israel has no genocidal intent against Palestinians. I haven't mentioned the land of Palestine in this. We're discussing Gaza here.

I'm not denying that Palestinians in Gaza are suffering terribly right now. But Israel's intentions is not to eradicate every living Palestinian, as is implied in this thread's title. My stance that this thread title is wholly inaccurate and misleading.

Toothyfruity · 04/12/2023 21:41

untitledmum · 04/12/2023 21:39

@EasterIssland
Once again Israel has no genocidal intent against Palestinians. I haven't mentioned the land of Palestine in this. We're discussing Gaza here.

I'm not denying that Palestinians in Gaza are suffering terribly right now. But Israel's intentions is not to eradicate every living Palestinian, as is implied in this thread's title. My stance that this thread title is wholly inaccurate and misleading.

You need to read a definition of genocide. It doesn't mean killing every living person in a group.

Israel is meeting the threshold unfortunately.

EasterIssland · 04/12/2023 21:45

untitledmum · 04/12/2023 21:39

@EasterIssland
Once again Israel has no genocidal intent against Palestinians. I haven't mentioned the land of Palestine in this. We're discussing Gaza here.

I'm not denying that Palestinians in Gaza are suffering terribly right now. But Israel's intentions is not to eradicate every living Palestinian, as is implied in this thread's title. My stance that this thread title is wholly inaccurate and misleading.

Gaza is part of Palestine.

Where do the people that live currently in Gaza go In the governments plan as per that presentation they did in Sept 2023!

Kick them out ?
Kill them ?
Covert them to Israel citizens ?

this is what google says about the meaning of genocide

genocide
/ˈdʒɛnəsʌɪd/

noun

the deliberate killing of a large number of people from a particular nation or ethnic group with the aim of destroying that nation or group.

I ask you again the same question, if the government is not keen on destroying Palestine / Gaza … then why are they presenting a map without Palestine in it

stomachameleon · 04/12/2023 22:02

@Toothyfruity they must be doing something right. twitter.com/visegrad24/status/1731760451300516125

stomachameleon · 04/12/2023 22:03

And again twitter.com/gaza_report/status/1731745846872395799

untitledmum · 04/12/2023 22:04

@EasterIssland
The Israeli government has proposed multiple offerings of a split Palestinian-Israeli state, since 1948. These have continuously been rejected by the Palestinians because the Palestinians do not want Israel to exist at all. Once again Israel has no genocidal intent to get rid of Palestinians, Israel is willing to live peacefully amongst/ aside them. So the blame for no Palestine on the map at this stage is because Palestinians are not yet willing to allow Israel to exist at all.

The issue is that when the Palestinians they are living next door to choose to use violence and terror, Israel must react and ensure its own security. At this point in time it means ensuring Hamas and its infrastructure is destroyed.

Toothyfruity · 04/12/2023 22:05

stomachameleon · 04/12/2023 22:02

@Toothyfruity they must be doing something right. twitter.com/visegrad24/status/1731760451300516125

What point are you making? Israel actually managed to kill someone in Hamas? Congratulations. It only took killing a few thousand civilians.

Toothyfruity · 04/12/2023 22:06

Is there an independently verified number of Hamas killed by Israel actually? Or captured? Though I assume Israel takes no prisoners (other than civilians and kids).

untitledmum · 04/12/2023 22:17

@Toothyfruity
Exceedingly hard to keep an accurate count of the number of Hamas killed when they dress like civilians and shoot RPG anti-tanks and rockets from kids bedrooms and hospital basements. However Israel is going according to where its intelligence shows the fighting is coming from and warning civilians to evacuate first.
So to keep from "derailing the thread" perhaps this thread title should be The genocide lead by Hamas.

EasterIssland · 04/12/2023 22:17

untitledmum · 04/12/2023 22:04

@EasterIssland
The Israeli government has proposed multiple offerings of a split Palestinian-Israeli state, since 1948. These have continuously been rejected by the Palestinians because the Palestinians do not want Israel to exist at all. Once again Israel has no genocidal intent to get rid of Palestinians, Israel is willing to live peacefully amongst/ aside them. So the blame for no Palestine on the map at this stage is because Palestinians are not yet willing to allow Israel to exist at all.

The issue is that when the Palestinians they are living next door to choose to use violence and terror, Israel must react and ensure its own security. At this point in time it means ensuring Hamas and its infrastructure is destroyed.

As you don’t want us as your neighbour let’s get rid of you off the map. 🤔

This news are from 2015

”Netanyahu says no Palestinian state as long as he's prime minister”

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-israel-election/netanyahu-says-no-palestinian-state-as-long-as-hes-prime-minister-idUSKBN0MC1I820150316/

june 2023

He reportedly told a closed-door meeting of the Knesset’s Foreign Affairs and Defense Committee that Israel must block Palestinians’ aspirations for an independent state and that “we are preparing for post-Palestinian President Mahmoud Abbas.”

https://www.arabnews.com/node/2328446/amp

a month ago

I am the only one who will prevent a Palestinian state in Gaza and [the West Bank] after the war.

https://www.middleeastmonitor.com/20231128-netanyahu-only-i-can-block-a-palestinian-state/amp/

So I ask you again. Are you sure the government doesn’t have an agenda to get rid of Palestine? And to take control of the land and whoever survives to this war ?
isnt nentanyahu rejecting the 2 state solution as well?

untitledmum · 04/12/2023 22:29

@EasterIssland
If Israel can ensure Gaza will not be run by violent extremists, or by those who allow terror organisations to thrive, they have no qualms about leaving Gaza under their own rule. However the chances of this are virtually nill. October 7th on point.

Remember. there was no Israeli presence in Gaza at all since 2005 -for the past 18 years. Israel has pumped millions of humanitarian funds into Gaza since. But instead of using the metal pipes provided by Israel to build their own water system and sewage works, Gaza/Hamas chose to build rockets and tunnels.

So as long as their entire mantra is to get rid of Israel and Jews completely there is very little faith in a peaceful independent Palestinian neighbour.
However the agreements about who will lead Gaza after Hamas are eradicated are still in the talks so realistically I have no idea what the plans are.

stomachameleon · 04/12/2023 22:36

@EasterIssland I mean this in a completely respectful way but if you put something on the table that is rejected continuously and your enemies whole reason for being is to destroy somewhere(you)......and then complete a massacre..... which they promise to do again..... what else apart that already discounted solution can they put and why should they expect a different response?

I don't agree with it but I can understand why some people want to go another way. We all sit and judge here but how many of us live in real fear? The families on the kibbutz felt they had nothing to fear. They were no threat. And Hamas haven't said 'enough Now' they have vowed to keep going.

Those people on here that have family in Israel, live in Israel, see their reality. Yes before 7/10 peace was fractured but people did have it. Some sort of existence. Neither side does now.

stomachameleon · 04/12/2023 22:38

@EasterIssland 'as you don't want us as your neighbour let's get rid of you off the map'
Could go either way....

EasterIssland · 04/12/2023 22:40

stomachameleon · 04/12/2023 22:36

@EasterIssland I mean this in a completely respectful way but if you put something on the table that is rejected continuously and your enemies whole reason for being is to destroy somewhere(you)......and then complete a massacre..... which they promise to do again..... what else apart that already discounted solution can they put and why should they expect a different response?

I don't agree with it but I can understand why some people want to go another way. We all sit and judge here but how many of us live in real fear? The families on the kibbutz felt they had nothing to fear. They were no threat. And Hamas haven't said 'enough Now' they have vowed to keep going.

Those people on here that have family in Israel, live in Israel, see their reality. Yes before 7/10 peace was fractured but people did have it. Some sort of existence. Neither side does now.

I do think (or hope) that if Israel got rid of the current president , things hopefully would change a bit with the help of international help. With the current president (and who he’s governing with) I find it impossible.

right now I fear that the current war is creating new Hamas members, and this way Israel citizens will always be under threat. And no solution will be found

EasterIssland · 04/12/2023 22:40

stomachameleon · 04/12/2023 22:38

@EasterIssland 'as you don't want us as your neighbour let's get rid of you off the map'
Could go either way....

In that sentence I was talking about the presentation the president did a few months ago

EasterIssland · 05/12/2023 07:24

NEW: Satellite imagery reviewed by HRW shows that orchards, greenhouses and farmland in northern Gaza have been razed since the beginning of Israel’s ground invasion, compounding concerns of dire food insecurity and loss of livelihood

https://twitter.com/hrw/status/1731689458695655770

i guess they don’t want those that survive this to have a way to be able to feed and they’re willing to provide their food

stomachameleon · 05/12/2023 11:01

@EasterIssland I don't disagree with that.

stomachameleon · 05/12/2023 11:02

Sorry that was in reply to 22.40 post.

feralunderclass · 05/12/2023 11:41

untitledmum · 04/12/2023 21:39

@EasterIssland
Once again Israel has no genocidal intent against Palestinians. I haven't mentioned the land of Palestine in this. We're discussing Gaza here.

I'm not denying that Palestinians in Gaza are suffering terribly right now. But Israel's intentions is not to eradicate every living Palestinian, as is implied in this thread's title. My stance that this thread title is wholly inaccurate and misleading.

Are you speaking on a governmental capacity? Have you not seen what they have said regarding wiping the Palestinians out and leaving no memory of them behind? A good Arab is a dead Arab? The government rhetoric appears to very much be genocidal.

Chaitales · 05/12/2023 15:07

stomachameleon · 05/12/2023 11:02

Sorry that was in reply to 22.40 post.

Hi,

I saw late last night you replied to my post and got busy with work today so didn't get a chance to respond. I can't for the life of me find the response or which thread it was on to reply to it - so sorry, I think it's got lost somewhere in the notifications. But thank you for responding, I read through it and appreciate the time you took in working through the options

Chaitales · 05/12/2023 15:08

feralunderclass · 05/12/2023 11:41

Are you speaking on a governmental capacity? Have you not seen what they have said regarding wiping the Palestinians out and leaving no memory of them behind? A good Arab is a dead Arab? The government rhetoric appears to very much be genocidal.

Show quote history

They are actually saying it loud and clear how they view Palestinians, how they will wipe them out, how they hate and will kill them, how they intend to flatten Gaza, they are singing it, their children are singing it.

How can anyone deny their intent when they are telling us themselves?

stomachameleon · 05/12/2023 17:04

@Chaitales undoubtedly elements of the far right need to go and quickly for a peaceful end to be agreed. They aren't super popular with normal Israelis neither is Netanyahu.

I think dehumanising anyone is wrong and continues that 'them versus us' rhetoric. Peace will never be achieved.