I should always be welcome in DP's home, regardless of who's there - AIBU?

[SecretsAndLies77]

I will try to not make this too long, but also not drip feed. Please help me distinguish reasonable actions from my own emotions because, to put it simply, everything's at stake.

Been with DP for 4 years and, on the whole, it's a very loving relationship. He's good to me and my kids, fun to be around, reliable and helpful, contributes financially to my household. We don't live together but spend much (most) of the week at each other's homes (although more mine than his), as well as every weekend and holidays.

At the same time, it's been a turbulent relationship (I know that sounds odd after what I've just said, but it can be both good and turbulent, as it's about very defined areas of problems, i.e. one problem = his adult daughters). I have a good relationship with his youngest DD (early 20s) who lives with him, but his eldest (30) who lives away doesn't want to have anything to do with me. At times she's been really rude to me and various members of my family. Most recent example is a message she sent where she was incredibly rude and disrespectful (before blocking me, so I couldn't even respond - a coward's move, IMO). My DP did reprimand her, sort of, via text and heavily prompted by me, which I hate as I don't think it's my job to stand up for this relationship and my dignity, but his. I think left to his own devices he would just always avoid all conflict. He is very scared she will cut him out of his life.

I feel I've come to the end with being able to accept that he doesn't stand up for me of his own free will, and that when he sees her he doesn't feel a shred of annoyance, resentment or anger about the awful ways she's behaved. I understand we all love our children, and I understand he's scared of losing her. I'm not even saying that he should necessarily show her that he's upset about her bad behaviour, but simply that he should feel something for me, the way she's treated me (in other words, show ME - show some kind of outrage, empathy, solidarity). If someone mistreated my DP, even if it was my kids, I'd be pretty livid. I know people are different, and I know men and women can be very different in their emotional processing. But still. How can it be true that he loves me, but that he doesn't feel anything when someone repeatedly hurts me?

The other thing is that, when she comes to stay at his, although at all other times I'm (more than) welcome in his house, there's an expectation that I won't come while she's there. Now, I get that it's her former home, she still has a room there. But, at all other times, I have complete access to his house, not just that but he's even repeatedly hosted friends of mine for long weekends (because the house is big and has spare rooms and bathrooms), but when his daughter is there, the quiet understanding is that I'm not welcome. But, just as an example, we're spending Xmas at mine this year and he of course invited her too. I knew she would say no, but that's not the point. So, she's meant to be always welcome in my house, but I'm not only not welcome at family events, but also my own partner's house when she's there? It strikes me as very unfair and unreasonable.

I've been living with this for a while, and this morning I woke up and thought, I don't know if I love him any more. This has seriously eroded my feelings for him. It's a huge shame, as four years is a lot of time together and he's amazing in many ways and I love(d) him possibly more than any other man before him, including my ex husband. But this continued unfairness and indignity has eaten away at the core of our connection.

YABU - this is a reasonable compromise in a complicated family dynamic because parents will always put their children first, even when they're nearly 30, and most women would find a way to live with this, even if it hurts them

YANBU - this is a major breach of love and loyalty towards me on his side, and if he's not prepared to let her know that his home is always open to me, I should walk away even after 4 years together.

Can I just say (if you're read this far), if you're not divorced and in a relationship with a man who's got adult kids, you won't have any kind of realistic perspective on a situation of this kind. I'm looking for some thoughtful and considered responses based in first hand experience of these kinds of dynamics - thank you (and I'll disregard any responses that are rude or unkind, as often I see "pile ons" when it comes to these kinds of questions)

In my opinion, it's not like you want to come storming in there and sit between them when she visits, but it's about ownership and territory. She absolutely will not 'share' her father with you.

Is marriage on the cards with your partner? Perhaps if you are planning a life together you could both sell up and buy a place together. This is what my now DH and I did.

If your DH is too scared of her to want more with you, then I guess you have to make a decision about is this enough for you and are you happy to carry on like this.

Whilst I understand the hurt this engenders, if you choose to keep separate homes/live apart, then you both have the right to limit access to the other. It goes both ways, though. It’s complicated in later life relationships, where people have families from earlier relationships, and I think it’s fine that DP is choosing to manage those dynamics and interactions.

Erm, it's Monday. Thank you for your input.

I’m also in my 30s and can’t imagine a world in which I’d be so heavily invested in my parent’s relationships. Does she have a career? Family of her own? Why is she spending so much time causing drama with you and her dad, I think her behaviour is rather infantile and frankly embarrassing. I’d understand this from a teenager but a woman in her 30s?!

The whole point of living separately as a couple is that you are keeping your home YOUR home and independence.

Having keys doesn't take that away. If your respective homes are each others home, why are you not living together? Especially if he helps you financially, it would be cheaper.

You need to accept age doesn't like you, end of. Maybe she doesn't like that you are financially dependent on him. That can be enough. He is entitled to have a separate relationship with her than with you.

You seem to want your cake and eat it. Not be a couple from the perspective of living separately but be a couple when it comes to him helping you financially, having access to his home when it suits you and making demands on his relationship with his daughter. And then if he doesn't do as you want, you just don't love any more.

As you've written your post, you come across as very controlling.

Blimey, op casting herself in a new light with the suggestion that if thry don't get on he ought to meet his daughter in a restaurant. Wow, not on.
OP, this is about your attitude to conflict, which is to seek a win rather than to seek understanding or compromise.
You're trying to exert territorial rights to your partner's home. It's a huge overstep.

Also, you're not listening.

You want your DP to refuse to allow the DD at his home, because she doesn’t want to you to be there when she is?

Have I understood that correctly?

I'm a first wife so you might like to stop reading at this point.

I think I would set some boundaries to redress the imbalance by saying she is not welcome in my home. So she wouldn't have been invited to Christmas.

I think the issue of you wanting him to meet his DD at a restaurant instead of his home because you want to feel you can pop over there unrestricted, is unreasonable. It is not your home, just as you can bar her from yours.

As you say, your love for him has diminished because of this issue. Maybe it is time to call it time. Would you be happier on your own?

No, his DD thinks she can call the shots for some reason and demand OP isn’t there whenever she is. It’s so bizarre. It’s not her home but also, she’s in her 30s!

OP, I think your DP is caught between a rock and a hard place - for whatever reason, his DD, whom he loves and obviously wants to see, has taken against you, so he finds it easiest and most expedient to keep you apart. I assume that so far, you have gone along with this. I do understand the difficulty of new partner - DC dynamics. I didn’t marry my DH until well after the DC had left home for precisely this reason, but it doesn’t sound as though things are going to improve with your DP. Have you asked him why his elder DD has taken against you? I know that my own DC tolerate DH, and I have been told in no uncertain terms that if I die first, they won’t ever come back to visit. From my POV, DH has never been anything other than tolerant, financially generous and accommodating of them, and their own DF causes them no end of worry by his kooky behaviour and unreliable ways. (I think he actually has MH issues that he simply won’t address.) All I can say is that you’ll never get your DP’s DD to do anything more than tolerate you - it depends on where you see this relationship going. Do you want to marry DP and move in with him? Or do you think this is what his DD is afraid of, and is so doing her best to ensure it can’t happen? DC do worry about things like inheritance, so try to find out what’s at the bottom of his DD’s dislike of you, and whether DP is prepared to change things, or whether he’s hoping things will carry on as they are indefinitely. It is unreasonable to expect a partner to alienate one of his DC, though, and ultimately, it depends on whether or not this is a deal-breaker for you as to whether you carry on with things as they are, or walk away.

I’m in my 30s, and I’m cringing thinking about still having a bedroom at my dad’s house, or thinking I had a say in who he has in his own home.

Unfortunately, some people are just incredibly controlling. It sounds like his DD is this type of personality, and there is really not much you can do. It is up to her father to deal with this.

Personally, I would happily stay away when his DD is visiting. I would mentally detach from the situation entirely, and not think about it, bring it up in conversation with your partner etc.

But I would make it very, very clear to him that his DD isn’t welcome in your home, and that he should not extend invites to her on your behalf again.

Utter BS. This ‘child’ is an adult and doesn’t live with her dad. She doesn’t get to dictate who he has to stay/visit.

kid gloves for too long is the reason for this mess. A difficult conversation dodged 4 years ago is what’s created this situation.

@SecretsAndLies77 ‘s DP should have sat his DD down and explained the relationship he has and that @SecretsAndLies77 will be a part of his life, as his DDs are too. Kindly put, deal with it.

she’s not a child. She’s being outrageously rude and enough is enough.

my now H wouldn’t have put up with this from his (all adult) DDs. Although I get on with all of them, so it’s a moot point. That said, I know that none of them would have ever been able to dictate who their dad spent time with/lived with.

his kids have a special place in his life, but I do too and given how I’ve supported and helped my DH over the years, he’d put me first and foremost on a day to day basis.

i hear all the time that kids come first, but it’s not as simple as that.

lets look at Love. We love our partners, we love our kids. We love our parents.

but each of those loves IS different. What love means in each of these situations is different. Conditional/unconditional, deferential/supportive. Affection/intimacy.

love isn’t black and white, @SecretsAndLies77 ‘s DP’s Dd is being ridiculous and actually does need pulling up.

Yeah seems that way, but we don't have the back story or daughter's side of things

I suppose I’d think through what my lines are. I agree with others that having a key isn’t the same as 24/7 access no matter what. I would tell him he may not invite her around to mine, whether or not she will come; knowing how she feels about me she is not welcome and not invited, and he needs to respect my home enough to not even make the gesture.
the other line I’m not sure about is the family events- what does that mean? Does that mean you don’t go to his family things? You aren’t invited? She isn’t? Depending on the answer that might be a line- I wouldn’t be with a man where I was only allowed at family events if another 30 year old woman had said she was not coming. But I think I’d be ok with not going to his house when she’s around assuming that’s a fairly limited number of times. It does remove the option of living together because I would not leave my primary home to facilitate this woman, so if that’s a deal breaker then I’d end it. I think, without being in this situation, that those are my lines.

You don't live together.

One daughter dislikes you.

She doesn't want to see you when she comes to see her dad.

There's an "expectation" that you stay away from his house when his daughter is there to avoid conflict.

That's perfectly reasonable. He doesn't want drama when his daughter is visiting, he wants a nice visit. It's his house, not your house, so stay away. You don't have rights to enter someone else's home 24/7.

His doesn't chastise his daughter for you when she sent you a mean message.

She's an adult. It's not really up to him to referee your interpersonal conflict. He doesn't want to fall out with his daughter. Could he ask her to be polite? Sure, but he's not going to. He wants a comfortable life.

That's his family. You're his girlfriend. He values his kids more than you and that bothers you. There's nothing you can do about that. I don't see this relationship progressing past where it is now if one of his daughters dislikes you so much and he wants to keep from rocking the boat. If you don't like the way things are, break up.

I'm a lone parent. My kids come first. If I were him, I'd tell you clearly to back off when my kids are visiting and stop the drama and no, you can't have unlimited access to my home. I don't plan on marrying or living with someone again so what I have goes to my kids.

Yes I think you have. Obviously OP and her children should be allowed to walk into this man’s house whenever they like. If the daughter doesn’t like that, she shouldn’t be allowed to spend time with her dad in her childhood home, and should be made go to a restaurant.

It depends, we don’t have loads of info but the fact he contributes financially to her household might be an issue. OP is seeming increasingly more controlling too. DD might be concerned about the set up.

Batshit. She says they spend most of their time at her house anyway!

I knew as I clicked 'YANBU' that the vote would be going the other way. Mumsnet has become so militant and cruel over the past few years about certain topics, and blended families and step mothers really get some posters' juices going.

It feels to me that your DH has been a rabbit in headlights since this became an issue and he has remained frozen in that state. His inertia and I'd say cowardice here have prevented the issue from a potential (albeit unlikely) resolution, or to at least reach a truce where everybody's feelings are valid.

I am divorced. My new partner lives with me and the children. They like him. They do not like my ex husband's new wife. The children are encouraged to be polite and respectful, and they are. My daughter is the type to have Big Feelings (gets that from me) and she has really big feelings about the new wife, but we talk about it and work through it together. She doesn't strop about and the children's dad doesn't make the new wife live in the shed or something. Slight exaggeration there but you know what I mean.

I feel your DH has really let you down here, Op. He's abandoned you in this situation. I do think he's a coward. He's let both of you down really because, yes, it's unlikely given what you've posted about the daughter, but maybe there could have been a cordial relationship there that could have softened over time. It was never allowed to get to that point. I'm really sorry Op, it sounds so sad.

She's not in her 30s.

I just think there isn’t much more you can do about this. I am not a first wife but looking at it just from an outsiders point of view, this has been 4 years, the situation is unlikely to change. It is how it is, either you are happy or want out.
My dad has a large family and quite a a few of them won’t set foot in each others houses and don’t speak and they are blood relatives, it just is how it is, at family events either one person goes or the other, or sometimes invite them all then let them decide or not to come. So I do think it’s entirely possible to manage this situation and continue with the relationship if you want and just leave things as they are.
but it’s unlikely to change.
have you ever had a conversation about it with her?

you said you woke up this morning and realised you are not in love with him, that there tells you everything you need to know. I’m very aware daughters can be very vindictive but honestly as a mum kids always come first, but saying that I’ve made sure my children are not disrespectful. If they don’t like someone they are still pleasant, just don’t need to be best buddies, they are 18 and 14 Obviously there’s 3 sides to every story, yours, hers and the truth. She’s 30 I think she can manage to keep her emotions in check enough for you to visit her dad.

This is why you have separate homes.
Just because someone has a key, they don’t just walk in knowing it is not convenient.

In my second marriage there were some very tricky times, when my husband felt he was piggy in the middle. When his daughter left for university she did not come home again, unless I was away for a few days. He saw her at university or they both stayed at her grandmother’s.
If we had kept our separate homes I would certainly not just have turned up at his when she was there. YABU. But probably so is she. We don’t know enough.

These are not young children these are adults so one would expect adult behaviour.
The 30 year old should be much more civilised and follow the polite social conventions partly out of respect for her Father's choice of partner.

No, she’s only just 30. So she was in her 20’s when OP and her dad got together.
Why does her dad contribute financially to your household and children?