To not pay towards her rent?

[BugOnARugDrinkingTeaFromAMug]

My sister has struggled with addiction for many years, she's lost her kids (they live with their dad's) and been in trouble with the police.

She got into a rehab and got kicked out for taking drugs in there so we have kind of gave up on her getting clean. She bounced around from homeless place to another bit eventually got herself a flat.

She has now been sent to prison and because her sentence is over a particular threshold she can't get housing benefit and so is looking at losing her flat.

She has asked me to chip in towards paying her rent, she is planning to ask me, her boyfriend, best friend and her daughter to all club together.

I can afford it, I have a child I am supporting through uni and two children at home so it's not like I won't miss it but I could afford it if I want to.

The reason I am tempted to say no is - it is asking a lot of 4 separate people, if any of them miss a month or change their mind, then the whole lot has been a waste. She can only keep the flat if everyone pays (or someone else picks up the slack). So I can see a situation where everyone feels sorry for her in month one and two, then Christmas comes up and her best friend who has four children can't afford it, so I then pick up that payment too, she has an argument with her boyfriend and he decides he's not paying and before I know it I either pay the lot or. She loses the flat anyway and it's all been a waste of money.

So YANBU - don't pay
YABU - this is your sister, she will be off drugs when she gets out and this is a real chance to change her life. You can afford it so pay.

How much is the rent?

Don't pay. You'll definitely take the whole lot on.

An ex once asked me to be his guarantor on one of those dodgy payday loans. I said no, and he didn't get the loan. Lo and behold he then went off sick, which I totally suspected, and that would have made me 100% liable for the loan. I'd never have been able to afford it and I probably would have lost my house or something.

This echoes my thoughts too.
I have had a similar experience with a close family member and admit to paying large monthly sums (that I struggled to afford) to clear backdated rent arrears and prevent eviction.
That helped me to sleep better and have continued hope.
There is nothing greater than addiction and people who have no experience of it have limited understanding of the roller coaster of emotions and the impact on others.
It's very important not to give up hope and I appreciate that there is a fine line between supporting and enabling.
OP, it is very important to look after yourself. I haven't voted as I don't know if I am able to objectively do so.

Addicts often have to hit rock bottom before they can start to help themselves. The longer you keep her from hitting rock bottom, the longer it will take her to start helping herself.

It's a tough situation but I agree that you can't take this on Op, I know you want to believe this time your DSis will get better but that's the triumph of optimism over experience. I wonder if because you both had bad childhoods but you managed to make yourself a better life that you feel you owe her some how? It's not your fault Op, sadly there are some people you can't help no matter how much you feel you should

It seems a bit nuts that she can keep a property she doesn't need while she goes to prison, but that the same housing people wouldn't house her when she comes out of prison again - not saying thats not the case, but its a bit mad...🤔

how much will 8 months of rent be , split 3 or 4 ways?

With good behaviour will she be out sooner?

This makes no sense - she’ll be relying on you and whoever else she can persuade to pay her rent!

She could be in breach of her tenancy anyway by being away from her home and the housing association could go for possession. I wouldn't see paying rent as a failsafe against this

Certainly not, and you've made a particularly good point about what happens if somebody opts out down the line, and the money paid out will just have been wasted. You and your children need it first, so it would be a definite no from me,

I don't like to judge and stereotype, but you do need to use your judgement in these situations. You can't rely on the boyfriend and friends of a drug user who's in prison. It would be stupid to do so. Unless you can and will cover the full rent cost, you're at risk of just wasting your money paying your contribution.

How long is the sentence - i dont think its fair to deny someone else access to the flat.
If you pay - its teaching that you will pick up the slack
She needs motivators.... you picking up her slack, isnt a motivator.
I hope she finds it within her to avoid drugs in prison. That will be the first hurdle.
All the best to you all.

The 8 months is the minimum sentence if she behaves, her full sentence is 2 years.

I am presuming the rent is about £500 although she hasn't actually confirmed that. So a grand each from us. More like 4 grand for me if the others drop out which I can see happening.

What is she in prison for? You have to do something really bad to go so prison nowadays as there are no places.

I think I would be influenced by when the offence occurred that she has been jailed for. Was it before she got the flat and was actively trying to sort her life out (assuming she was) or after? If it was before I would understand why you might feel guilty about a no, but if it was after then really there is no hope and you would be wasting money and only postponing the inevitable.

Don’t do it - it will be a waste. Having children removed didn’t stop her drug habit, so nothing will.

How long is she in for? If she wants drugs enough she will get them in prison too.just seen it’s eight months.

I don't want to sway you because this is an awful predicament to be in. However, I have had a very close family member in nearly the same position as your sister, pass away this year in awful traumatic circumstances. We are all still realing from the death and I think mainly from the guilt if not doing more or trying harder. Leaving her to "hit rock bottom" or "sort herself out". I know it will be a lot of money, likely wasted but you never know if it would have been the right decision and when the inevitable happens you will feel even worse wondering if your decision has affected the outcome. Even though you tell yourself deep down that her life is her choice and this is true but it doesn't stop the horrible feeling in the pit of your stomach that I've lived with the last few months wondering if I could have helped changed the outcome.

What about if you save money now and when she gets out, perhaps pay for a room for her for a few months? A month to month room where if she screws up, she's out?

Is there any way she'd agree to further in-patient rehab services when she is released?

As much as you would love to save your sister, it sounds like she doesn't wish to be saved, just enabled at times.

Please don't feel guilty, you cannot rescue someone who keeps taking off their life jacket after the boat capsizes.

Minimum £4k is a big ask for someone with her history.

Think the answer is no, she has had enough chances

And yet, when dealing with addiction, it is often extremely unlikely that the actions of others can change the outcome. Having dealt with addiction and MH crises in my own family I know only too well that, and was indeed taught in support groups, you can offer understanding and emotional support but if you continually 'prop up' you still will not change the decisions made if the person is on a path you can't influence.

Conspiracy to commit burglary. She didn't go into the house but she can up with the idea, knew the person, got him out of the house whilst someone else went in and took the things.

This is another reason why I am reluctant to help. I may be a hypocrite but to me, some crimes are worse than others and I see burglary of someone's home as right up there with rape and child abuse. It's a violation of someone's home.

Sadly, it doesn't seem feasible if relying on that many people to pay for the duration. And like you say: would be such a waste. Can she sublet?

I do agree she needs to see consequences (to an extent). But perhaps you could reassure her you will help her find a place when she comes out and maybe cover her deposit / help with first month's rent.

You're not a hypocrite. Burglary is a hateful, violating crime and it seems she was able to plan quite meticulously for it to be successful, despite addiction being obviously part of the motive, she was thinking clearly enough to lure someone out of their home so she could steal from them. That nails it for me, really, beyond what I've already posted- you should not feel obligated to help.