To say all pro-Palestinians should watch Fauda on Netflix?

[FuadaFan]

Now it is a drama about how the Israeli security services deal with the conflict but it is apparently pretty accurate and is amazingly well produced and acted.

Season 5, which covers Oct 7th has just come out after a long delay.

I've had to take a break after episode 7 because it's so distressing but it still doesn't even come close to what happened that day.

I think it's gives a clearer idea as to the truth of what has been going on and it does try to give a perspective from both sides.

I think every pro-Palestinian should watch it.

AIBU?

I’m sorry but you tell tanks to shell a home you know hostages are inside of because one Hamas member has come out surrendering with Yasmin Porat (hostage and human shield) and she has told you exactly how many hostages are in there, how many are children, and exactly where in the house they are being held and you then order the house shelled by tanks saying specifically “even at the cost of civilian casualties” then it’s pretty clear you know the tank shells will kill some hostages. As it was 13 of 14 hostages were killed- Hadan Dagas survived. For many, there was no body to recover as the shelling was that intense. The report alleges the tanks shelled already dead bodies but the eye witness accounts of the 2 surviving hostages don’t support that allegation.

And? Does that article say he deliberately killed the hostages?

No, that’s not what happened at all. I have not repeated any conspiracy theories whatsoever.

That still doesn’t mean he targeted the hostages.

Look at that! "Most died from gunshots". Also come on now. 1 guy is not going to be able to hold 14 people hostage. There would have been other Hamas guys in the building.

You're so determined to absolve Hamas of responsibility here its insane.

Omg, he deliberately ordered tank fire on a house he knew was full of hostages stating “even at the cost of civilian casualties” ..it’s pretty clear it was deliberate killing of civilian hostages as acceptable collateral damage to kill the 40 or so Hamas terrorists holding them hostage in the same house. He even went and apologised to the grieving Israeli families for killing their relatives. Stating he had failed them. I posted that link too. Some of the families accepted his apology, but some did not.

You said a moment ago there was only one Hamas terrorist there. You can't even be consistent in your accounts.

That’s alleged, and gosh darn there’s no forensic evidence to prove it.

But as I said, the other evidence from the 2 hostages who survived cast doubt on this. I’m not absolving Hamas in any way. The facts are 14 hostages in the house were alive until the tank fire started and then very quickly, only 1 was left alive.

Have you ever seen what one tank shell can do to a small house?

Omg indeed. Accepting collateral damage and actually purposefully targeting someone are two different things.
Apologising to grieving families doesn’t equal admitting killing their relatives on purpose.

"THE JOOOOS ARE PAYING THEM!". Really? Do remove your tinfoil hat and put down that copy of The Protocols of the Elders of Zion.

No, I did not. I said 1 Hamas terrorist surrendered using Yasmin Porat as a human shield. Then Yasmin told the police and army exactly who was in the house, how many Hamas, how many hostages, the rooms each where being held in. The tank commander Barak Hiram knew exactly where not to fire those tank shells but he fired on those rooms any way saying even at the cost of civilian casualties - because he knew the tanks were going to kill hostages.

Please read the sequence of events.

I did not say the hostages were targeted, I said they were deliberately killed. I stand by the assertion that if you pull the trigger on a tank shell aimed at a room you know hostages are in that you are deliberately killing both your target and the civilians who happen to be in the same place as the target.

@inamarina
”Shafroni’s relatives Ayala Hetzroni and her great niece and -nephew, 12-year-old twins Liel and Yannai Hetzroni, were all killed on October 7, along with the twins’ grandfather Aviya Hetzroni.
“It’s clear that Hiram wanted to listen, but he also shut down in the face of some of the harsh criticism that came up over the orders he gave,” Shafroni explained. “He backed off from things he had explicitly said in the media in the past and tried to quiet the anger toward him, as part of his desire to be appointed the next division commander despite the severe failures he admitted to during the meeting.”

Still at it with claiming people said things when they said nothing of the sort I see

You do know Forensic reports are confidential medical documents and aren't usually made public right?

As to the other: 40 Hamas to 13 Hostages. The average tank division has 5-6 people: 6 people can't take on 40 without serious firepower. On the balance of probability it was more likely Hamas terrorists would be killed.

And? Of course the relatives will be angry, ‘ harsh criticism’ from their side is more than understandable.

“Brig. Gen. Barak Hiram tells The New York Times about the complex hostage situation, in which Hamas gunmen were using the hostages as human shields while firing at Israeli troops from inside local resident Pesi Cohen’s home.
Hiram says that around 4 p.m., after a gunman surrendered, a SWAT commander argued that more might follow suit, while he, Hiram, said the hostage situation must be resolved by nightfall.

footage of the tank firing
https://www.mako.co.il/news-military/6361323ddea5a810/Article-5de7f6883ef7c81026.htm

Yes, but the families that are upset and called for BG Hiram’s resignation have given interviews about the lack of any remains to bury. Notably, the family of the 12yr old twins.

There were many other Israeli authorities there prior to the tank arriving.

Hostage and battle situations aren't static like that. They change. Terrorists may move hostages to another room for example. What he was told minutes earlier wasn't necessarily still the case when the decision to fire was made.

@Cheeks4970 Nobody is paying me- and you probably need to stop listening to Candace Owens.

> There were many other Israeli authorities there prior to the tank arriving.

Yes, but who and how many? Very few military leaders are going to try and take on 40 terrorists without serious firepower. It would be suicide.

'The extreme leftist rag with the lowest circulation in Israel and which no one had heard of before Oct 7th, '

• come, that's a silly comment, and you know it.

Haaretz is the oldest daily paper in Israel, I find it very unlikely that as few people know of it as you say.

Yes, a lot of Israeli Arabs disagree with current politics and Netanyahu (not to mention Smotrich and Ben-Gvir) but that doesn't mean they want Hamas.

I read an interview with a Druze man who said several Arabs he knew had enlisted (which traditionally few did) as they knew Hamas are terrorists who don't care about anyone, they use Arab civilians as human shields after all..