AIBU to think parents should lose benefits /homes for persistently antisocial children?

[Soddingcat]

This has been suggested, im not sure if it will happen , but i think this is a great idea, if the parents think they will lose their council house and benefits , they may attempt to to control their feral offspring .

My friend is in a local harriers group that starts at a local sports centre in the rough part of town, they are now having to stop their favourite route because of gangs of young teens who intimidate them , run along side them and are abusive, one delightful boy said “ lift your legs higher you c**t ,

How have we come to this ?
Do you think it will make any difference ?

I would remove child benefit from them too , maybe this will force them to parent if they risk losing money or their home

Obviously not all the parents are bad, but virtually all the awful kids round here riding motor bikes with hoods, abusing people are from the council estates near by

Im absolutely sick of it, and sick of decent people being targeted by them

What rules /sanctions would wise mumsnetters suggest ?

Because putting people further into poverty will definitely improve the situation.

Like the reform schools or industrial schools of old or the residential SEMH special schools of new?

You know it's not that simple right? Housing all these kids together, with seriously challenging behaviours, expecting (relatively low paid) staff to deal with it without becoming cruel, developing certain institutional cultures or ever snapping?

This.

Rendering an entire family homeless, or unable to afford food, is your solution to antisocial behaviour by a child? Really? Wow.

Why do you assume the families of these children are always on benefits? Most low income households have both parents working, and it’s likely this, the amount of time the parents are out at work instead of being able to spend time actively raising their children, that contributes to antisocial behaviour. It’s well documented that investment and support into ‘rough’ areas reduces antisocial behaviour, not sanctions.

And, why are you such a bunch of wilting lilies that you are allowing a few loudmouth kids to stop you running a route? Let them run along side you, ignore them or suggest they run the whole route and see how well they manage, you never know, they may discover they like running and take it up and get a new hobby, and then won’t spend their days lurking and shouting abuse at random strangers.

But yeah, let’s just take away their homes, or force them deeper into poverty. That’ll work….

Yes-because strict boarding school has worked so well for the children of the very rich…….

sounds like the siblings will be punished and I would think lack of money will just make the problem worse

So your solution to a family struggling with a child/ teenager with behavioural problems is that they should be made homeless?

I fail to see how that going to help that child become a better member of society.

If parents were fined for their children's antisocial behaviour then all would be treated equally - £100 for first offence, £200, then £300 etc. It would have the same effect and could be used to pay towards policing the bad behaviour.

No im just sick and tired of the false narrative that only bame kids are underprivileged when in reality every metric tells us that the most vulnerable and underprivileged are white working class boys.
Also no child or young person should be denied a scholarship or internship nor should they be required to have higher grades than anyone else just because of the colour of their skin. Which btw happens every single day whilst these poor white kids are repeatedly told how privileged they are for being white. That is anti white racism in action

How did you determine he was from social housing with parents on benefits exactly?

Firstly, those examples are both crimes that should be reported to the police. There are already laws in place to reduce/stop/punish anti-social behaviour, so why would you want more? Surely the answer is to enforce the laws we already have. But to do that, we'd have to provide further funding to police and encourage more of the old fashioned 'bobbies on the beat'. You could also have police in local schools (not patrolling the corridors, but there for children to go to if they need to or to report something).

Secondly, why do people always jump to removing benefits as a solution to all of society's ills? Benefits aren't even enough to scrape by on, let alone live on. What will happen if they are removed? People will live on the street, starve, turn to drugs and crime will increase. Get off your Daily Mail high horse and recognise that we need funding for health and education, including places for young people to go and hang out.

Third, how do you know the parents of these teens are irresponsible/ignoring or encouraging their behaviour? What if the teens are simply doing what they want because they don't fear the type of consequences open to parents nowadays? What if the teens are also terrorising their parents? We know from the numerous threads on here that social services will do nothing to help in that circumstance. How will removing benefits from these parents help?

You are good kid who breaks a trend of antisocial behaviour. But your siblings don't and are little dickheads.

So you become homeless because of their behaviour.

How do you think that helps?

And what about the dickheads from well off middle class families who own houses and don't claim benefits? They exist too.

What are you going to do to them and their families?

How about addressing why they are behaving like that in the first place?

Oh look, yet another thread from an apparently concerned citizen, lashing out at people in social housing.

And are you advocating for a compulsory purchase order for any homeowners / people with mortgages whose kids behave in an anti social way?

Completely ridiculous idea anyway. Solve antisocial behaviour by... making families homeless?

It's not about the parents, it's about the children. Parents in bad situations are supported for the children's sake.

Kids deserve a roof over their head and food in their bellies even if their parents are doing a shit job of raising them.

You'd just encourage abuse if children, learning aggressive behaviours from their parents, caused their parents to lose money.

This isn't treating equally.

Itd be have to be linked to income otherwise it disproportionately hurts poorer families whilst the rich ones who have parents who don't give a shit just pay it.

If you are a social housing tenant you can lose your home for anti social behaviour by you or any member if your household.

However the likley consequence of making parents liable for their childrens behaviour is that they will end up being abandoned and in care.

I suggest however that we should treat being at risk of offending should be treated as a serious child protection issue with practical action being taken to minimise that risk. However this costs money which doesnt seem to be available despite som eof us at least being very very rich.

Do you know what is missing for these kids @Soddingcat ? Consequences. They do not give a shit. There are no consequences for any of it.
Do you think the threat of their parents benefits getting stopped would work? They don't see that money, get kicked out of the house regularly anyway, it makes no difference to them. The vast majority will be from 'chaotic' households.
Where has the Police presence gone? Where are they?
We used to love our local Bobby back in the day, he was a good man who changed the course of a fair few lives. He used to come to the youth club and do talks, give advice etc.
The community centres have gone, the Sure Starts have gone. It's a mess and no-one cares, not really. Not until it starts bleeding out of the estates, like it is now.
No idea how to even begin tackling it.

This makes no sense. Parents of feral children never consider that the fault might be with them. It's either down to a medical condition, ADHD or autism, and the assumption is that this justified why kids can't be parented, or it's the fault of society, teachers, doctors etc...

You read it even here. A parent will describe their uncontrolled child and it's never ever because of lazy parenting.

How will putting these families in an even precarious situation help in any way? It will just give them even more reason to blame everyone else.

What we need to do is teach parents of children with ADHD and autism that their children still need strict discipline, boundaries, and attention.

Some children are much much harder to parents. It's just how it is. You have to respond accordingly however hard it is. You have to be consistent. You have to be a good responsible parent. Sadly, it's very hard to teach good parenting skills as ideally, this should be observed and if parents themselves were not parented well, what chance do they have to raise their kids any differently.

What would be the logic behind this?

Do you want children living on the streets in 2026?

Also how would that reduce antisocial behaviour? it would just push them further into crime and create more issues on our streets.

Plus, in a family you can have one child who is involved in anti-social behaviour while their siblings are decent kids so it makes no sense for the entire family to be punished.

Or you can have decent parents of all walks of life who do everything they can to raise good kids and still end up with a criminal in the family...

This is just another right-wing nonsense.

@Jayinthetub sums it up well.
I think you need to delve behind the headlines to see what makes children feral, and the reasons their parents are disengaged from parenting. Our societal problems are vast and complex and we'd need to implement a range of solutions to turn things around.
Depriving parents of money would simply be one extra punishment on a family that's likely already been dealt a difficult hand.

First, confiscate all the bikes, phones and designer gear they've robbed from 12 year olds at knifepoint.

Then haul them off to bootcamp and learn discipline the hard way. Forced marches and men bigger than them. For a year. Then community service jobs on minimum wage, with back to boot camp at the next transgression.

None of this will happen. I think the next few years are going to be really bad.

I have absolutely no idea what we can do to reverse all the anti social ' dont give a shit' attitude from some young and not so young people.
Im sick of seeing young lads riding round on electric bikes, all in black with balaclavas doing wheelies on busy roads, or gangs just weaving in and out of traffic in away that is meant to intimidated, eg bamging on windows of cars as they past and then giving the finger.

It feels like we need a big reset and go back to basic values and manners but I feel we are to far gone to get that back from the yob mentality we have in many places.

While there are some bad kids from good homes morals and values start within the home and are continuously reinforced.

Equally but not equitably. £300 fine for a family on the breadline is a bit different to £300 for a family who could regularly spend that just on picking up a treat for themselves.

It would solve nothing.

Can you explain how being forced into homelessness and hunger is going to make a damaged, angry and unsupported child start behaving better? And how being homeless and with reduced income will give a parent the time, knowledge and skills they need (plus the overcoming of their own survived traumas) to magically give their child all the support and help they need to become indistinguishable from a nice middle-class kid who has never experienced any kind of deprivation?

I’d be pro some more fines, and if deductions from benefits were part of how people paid for it I would be supportive. There is too much nox/abysmal driving/aggy youths around, always in the same areas. There has to be stronger consequences for actions.

Re the rate of fines, some country (I forget which) has driving fines were proportionate to wealth/income, so a footballer who couldn’t care less at a £200 parking fine would actually feel some sting…