To think that "difficult" people are life's winners?

[MargoLivebetter]

I realise that "difficult" is a bit vague, so what I mean here is people who are demanding, domineering, strongly opinionated, lack self-awareness, self-serving, uncompromising, combabitive, say it as it is etc ......

To think that all those qualities stand you in better stead than being considerate, kind, self-aware, able to compromise, polite, reflective, tolerant etc.

I just can't see how unless I move to a Buddhist community the later serves me well!

I don’t want to think this is true but I have been watching it play out in DHs family. He has always been the peace keeper, the reasonable one, the let it go one and his brother has always got dramatically upset. Now there is an issue where (obviously I think so) DH is 100% in the right but his parents are expecting him to roll over like he always has…except this time he isn’t because it affects me and our DC too and it’s causing problems.

Depends. In my profession a colleague alienated all the clients just by doing and being what you described in your question. Definitely not a winner. I think that you can definitely lose clients this way - at a certain level all professionals are the same, competence-wise, so the only thing that is remaining is really people skills, no?

Depends on the role surely? If it’s a cut and trust deal making / sales job these characters will venture into fast into maybe unethical territory to close ahead of anyone else. They might then well be feted and rewarded by their company. Agree if it’s client relationship it’s different - however many narcs are charismatic manipulative groomers so can switch it on when it’s self serving.

Depends on the context. Also, what is seen as normal assertive behaviour in a man is often perceived (usually by men) as "difficult" from a woman. Persistence and assertiveness, especially in situations like healthcare, can be lifesavers. That said, we all know people (dickheads) we try to avoid.......

this is a very thoughtful and intelligent post. i have many of the qualities you've listed but think i may be one of those people missing those boundaries. are you? you dont sound like it - so i wondered if you had any advice for me on how to retain those boundaries?

@mangoestoday you have to be very clear what you believe in first off and what is behaviour that you will or will not tolerate from others. Then you have to ask yourself, what are the consequences when someone oversteps a boundary that you have let them know about? So, if you say to a DP/DH "I really don't like it when you raise your voice and speak over me or shout at me. If you keep doing that, then I'm going to leave the discussion until you can speak to me calmly." Then your DP/DH shouts at you in an argument again - what are you going to do? You have to enforce the boundary.

Generally speaking assertive people will have set those boundaries early in relationships - with friends, family, co-workers and partners. They will have a clear sense of what is acceptable to them and what isn't and they will know what there consequences are for people who behave in ways that they don't appreciate. It is harder to start boundary setting when you have been allowing people to take the piss for years, but it can be done.

Yes. I know people like that who are also quite charming and entertaining when they want to be and people flock to them. They rarely back down about anything. They seem to have lots of friends and a cracking social life.

I think there’s a difference between being unpleasant which doesn’t pay off in the long run, and self absorbed, single-minded, opinionated but also fun which I think pays off massively.

I don’t think so, because these types of people often have difficulty with family relationships, friendships and staying married! They also do less well at work in many cases, because leadership roles require you to get along well with people across your company/industry in order to exercise influence.

Yes absolutely. Not always.. but far too often.

Long marriages can often just be business arrangements, or codependency. Wouldn’t take that as a win tbh. And I am happily married long term. Also, you simply have no idea what people feel internally, everything else can literally just be the facade. I think, having worked in mental health services, we get to see all walks of life, rich and poor. Some of us have worked in personality disorder clinics and whatnot. You get to peep behind the wall. It’s not all that pretty, even if the external Image, success, wealth says otherwise.

And sometimes, a person can be propped up and protected for life. Sometimes, life just isn’t fair. It’s a hard pill to swallow.

I think everyone should aim to be kind and i try my best to be a kind person...... however I think some situations you do need to be a bit more 'assertive ' and 'pushy'.

I am naturally a people pleaser and pretty passive, until I had a SEN child and realised that to get her support you have to fight. And I have thrown some 'professionals' under the bus in getting my daughters needs heard....... I feel bad as like I said not naturally like that. But I would do it all over again 🤷‍♀️.

So basically I think there needs to be a balance, but I would partly agree that I order to get things like support you gotta be a bit of a knob

Gone seem to be the days promoting "the best things in life are free". Perhaps because that doesn't further the consumerist agenda. I also remember when boasting and gloating were deemed unsavoury.