To think I should be able to take my daughter on holiday

[jj3457]

Hi everyone. I know some people may not like this, but I am a dad posting, just looking for some advice.

I told my ex I would like to take our daughter (3) on holiday to spain for 5 days with me and my mum.

Now this is where I messed up, and I will hold my hands up. I was dishonest when I told her I would be going with my mum. We will actually be going with my partner who my ex hasn’t met. I know this was a stupid lie but I was just worried my ex wouldn’t give consent for the holiday if she knew who was actually going.

To make matter worse, my ex has now found out that my mum is actually going to Florida for 2 weeks at the time I said she was coming to Spain with us.

My ex has messaged to say that she will not be handing over the passport until I give explicit details about the travel. I know that once I tell her I’m going with my partner she will refuse to consent. The holiday is booked and paid for.

I know I’m in the wrong for being dishonest but I am on the birth certificate and have as much right as she does to take her on the holiday. My ex has taken her abroad several times before and this is my first time.

what can I do if my ex refuses to give consent?

thanks

It’s not because she’s being controlling or using the kids as a weapon, it’s because he’s lied and deceived her. HTH.

Legally, everyone with PR must consent for a child being taken abroad, unless a court order is in place allowing x number of days abroad each year. As you now only need one room rather than two you could see if anyone wants to buy that second room.

I don’t know about legally but morally I think she has no right to know who you go on holiday with but she does have a right to know who her DD is going on holiday with.
I don’t agree with an ex stopping the DC going on holiday with the other parent (except in abuse cases) but I also don’t agree with ex’s lying.

Well of course it’s an option. She just doesn’t go. You either want a holiday with your girlfriend or a holiday with your daughter. At this stage in your life, you don’t have the option to take both. Your ex knows you lie so understandably doesn’t want to send her three year old abroad with her father and a complete stranger.

Completely understandable.

Are you stupid enough to think you’d get away with the ‘I’m going with my Mum’ lie? And you would have genuinely been happy to maintain that lie for the duration of the holiday? That speaks volumes. What if your Mum posts pictures of her Florida holiday on social media? What about when your DD comes home and tells her Mother ‘Granny wasn’t there but Gemma was! Fuck me, I’d hit the roof.

You sound annoyed she caught you out but I would have grave concerns about a man’s morality who honestly thinks it ok to take a child to a foreign country with a stranger when the child’s mother thinks she’ll be going with someone else.

You sound a very slippery character and I hope she has that passport under lock and key.

Why haven't you answered any of the many questions PP have asked?

I bet the mother doesn't even know this new GF has met her daughter. And you've probably only been with her 5 minutes.

You need to come clean and hope for the best.

Gov.uk advice is to have a letter from parent when taking child out of UK if not both travelling. My DC have never been asked

I'm surprised your ex agreed to allow a 3 year old to be away for 5 nts out of the country with a dad that has only has two individual nights a month. This isn't an active or engaged parent.

I'm not sure how your new DP can have a relationship already with such short contact time.

Alternatives are you go with DP and no DC or you go with DC and not DP (assuming ex agrees).

Good luck

I know. That’s why I said ‘it may not be the same scenario’…

Don't you need a signed permission letter from the non-travelling parent to take a child into Spain? Even if passport control don't always demand to see it

If your ex has withdrawn permission because of your deception -you would need a court order and it's too late.

No. But she’d be a really shit mother if she didn’t.

This
A lesson learnt OP

Surely if you’ve fucked up to the extend where your ex won’t give you DC’s passport, you’ll stay home and still care for DC for the week?

Your ex is presumably working/has plans for that week assuming that you and your mum were looking after DC, so you are still going to keep your commitment to your child aren’t you?

Seeing her for a mere 6 days a month is pretty pitiful, especially if you choose to spend a week of annual leave with your GF and not her.

It's got naff all to do with you, she has a right to know who HER DAUGHTER is going on holiday with.

You've fucked about and found out. You won't have time to take her to court to get permission. You don't lie to a child's mother so you can take them out of the country, why on earth would she trust you now.

@jj3457 Why on earth did you lie? I’ve been in your ex’s position but have also been the gf on the other side of this.
So, for what it’s worth … have you built up the time with your daughter so that she will be happy spending 4 nights with you? She’s not too young to do that, so ignore the posters saying she should be with mum at 3, but has she spent that amount of time with you? This was something my ex’s ex asked for before we took my SD away and was a reasonable request.
Have you given your ex the chance to meet your new partner? If she’s refused (your ex) then that was her choice, but if you haven’t offered her that chance then you can’t argue with her not being sure about your daughter being away in Spain with someone she’s never met. I assume that your ex is aware of the new partner?
You've really shot your self in the foot by lying about your mum being there - you must have known you’d get caught out, so my concern would be why you’ve done this - unless there’s a back story that you’re not telling us.
Yea, unless there’s a court order saying otherwise, you have the right to take your daughter on holiday, but heck you’ve gone about the wrong way and it’ll be your daughter that loses out 😔.

Your thread title is misleading. Just forget about taking your daughter on holiday. It's obvious your priorities lie elsewhere. You are an idiot for lying.

The only way I see the child going on holiday with you is if you offer to fly out mum and pay for her accommodation in a nearby hotel. That way you both share some time with your Dd, and mum gets to feel like dd is safe.
Otherwise, wait until dd’s older and ensure you are truthful and gain mums trust.

No. But you lied, and that's fucked up the trust. If you thought she would refuse consent you should have asked with plenty of notice and applied to court for a specific issue order if she refused. Instead you were sneaky and underhand and now she doesn't trust you. Stupid thing to do and now you've screwed up your own plans.

The parent with a lives with order can take the child out of the country for up to 28 days per year without the other parents permission, the non resident parent needs permission or a crt order

She has a right to know who her 3 year old daughter is going on holidays with! Seriously, how do you think a court would look upon how you’ve managed this so far? It sounds like you’re trying to blame your ex for having your daughter’s best interests at heart.

I can understand how your ex felt much happier at the idea of a 3yo going away with her Dad and Gma for 5 days.

Going away with a gf she hasn't met? Not so happy. What happens if you and the gf are all loved up and not paying much attention to the 3yo who isn't used to a week away from her Mum?

I think you need to just spend this holiday with your gf and accept that it's a romantic break, and not a suitable thing to take your 3 yo on..

You're not trustworthy.
So no.

No idea about legally but quite frankly I am sure you would like to know who your daughter goes on holiday at this age?

clearly you have an acrimonious split, but your daughter is very young and you are travelling to a foreign country for a period of time - I think it’s reasonable to know the details. Problem is you’ve fucked it up by lying in the first place. How can your ex ever trust you to tell the truth now?

I imagine she will say no and you’ll end up going to court to get this sorted - but not in time for this holiday

Yes, your ex legally has a right to know who will be travelling and staying with their child in the context of a holiday abroad. It's a basic safeguarding right and a court would insist on transparency.

I would sit down with your ex and hold you hands up - at least to a certain extent. You could say that the intention was always to bring your mum and your girlfriend, and you should have been upfront about that from the start. And you could say that your Mum then decided to go to Florida, and you should absolutely should have told your ex about that at that point, but you didn't because of your worry that your ex would withdraw consent. Ask that, before your ex completely decides to withdraw her consent (which you would understand), you would like her to meet your girlfriend and at least make her decision then.

It sounds like you don't have the best of relationships with your ex, which is fairly common. And probably the last thing you want to do is admit you f**ked up in some way, but unfortunately you're going to have to suck this one up if you want to go on the holiday. Make sure that you say that - whatever your ex decides - you will always be truthful with her in the future, that you have very much learned your lesson.

You lied. You are untrustworthy

Well you clearly shouldn’t have lied!

YABVU to have done that. As others have said, you’ve put your dd in a difficult position, or tried to. Of course a 3 yo would always repeat it, if your ex hadn’t found out.

Why can’t you just give your ex what she’s asking for? All the details of the holiday and who is going?

Of course she is concerned - you lied which makes you seem untrustworthy. And surely any parent would want to know this. And a location etc in case of emergency. Would you have liked it if she said she was going away with her Mum but it turned out to be a bloke you’d never met?

The way to get permission to go on holiday without the other parent’s consent, I believe, is to go to Court. But that takes time and money and is a very aggressive approach if not necessary.

Edit 1- a court would also want details and therefore your ex would also get them that way

Much better to hold your hands up, apologise for your misjudgment, and give her the details. Set her mind at rest about her 3 yo child!!

DD6 hasn't been on holiday with her Dad without me. If he wanted to take her we'd have to plan carefully. I would be hacked off if he lied.
When you have her for the weekend, how does she get home? Hair/teeth brushed? Clothes trashed? Full of mcdonalds & ice cream? For a night, fine. 5 days, less fine.