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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To think it's time to leave the ECHR?

798 replies

Sausagenbacon · 16/07/2026 20:05

www.thejc.com/news/uk/gazan-family-refugee-status-asylum-rejection-gwsq2c8b

OP posts:
Thread gallery
9
Lavender14 · 17/07/2026 09:52

EasternStandard · 17/07/2026 09:30

Why so angry at someone from India? It really is separate to how many Gazans we can take for asylum.

Can you not see the difficulty it creates when you've groups of people using different legal routes into a country to make a life for themselves (as we are all entitled to do). And then creating a list of who's the most deserving?

It creates a capitalist system where we essentially monetise immigrants depending on what we get from them. And it means the most vulnerable people and particularly BAME individuals are at the bottom of the food chain. It creates a sense of 'validation' that people have the right to judge who has 'earnt' their right to be here but as we know from all the recent violence this is very susceptible to being tangled up in blatant racism. Because while some people may feel that only people who pay their way should be here, there are other people who feel there are too many working migrants as well. It's no coincidence that the recent violence where I live saw working migrants who had paid their way to be here legally burnt out of their homes. And yet polish migrants, Ukrainian refugees were fine... why do you think that was? They have the ability to walk down the street and not be immediately distinguished by their skin colour. We have people of colour who have been born here feeling more wary going out and about now for the same reason.

You cannot create a hierarchy of 'deserving' immigrants without upholding racist social structures. And therein lies the rub.

Yes there are conversations to be had about resources, but those conversations are happening because of political leaders screwing over the average working person consistently for many years. Asylum seeking individuals are being used as scapegoats to stop the public properly scrutinising government public spending. Its a very intentional and coordinated drive through media.

RodneyKitten · 17/07/2026 09:55

BoredZelda · 17/07/2026 09:51

You know what their living arrangements will be? Jeez oh, the amount of inside information people have on this family is incredible.

This is what they will be entitled here as council housing.

Or did you want all of them to squeeze in a three bed semi? Naughty!

DrCoconut · 17/07/2026 09:55

XDownwiththissortofthingX · 16/07/2026 20:54

Killing myself laughing at the barefaced nonsense suggestion that politicians with a vested interest in extricating the UK from ECHR would just immediately set about replicating everything in UK Law anyway.

Anyone who believes this utter shite must have a zip up the back of their heads.

This. Do people seriously think the likes of reform would protect their maternity pay, sick pay, right to expect freedom from discrimination etc? If elected there would be nothing to stop them reintroducing Victorian style employment laws where the few get very rich while the majority slave for 16 hours a day for pennies. They could imprison and even kill you if your face doesn't fit. Take your property. Stop your healthcare and education. It sounds dramatic but that's why protection that goes beyond whoever forms the current government is so important. Sadly many of "the people" can't see it and will just vote in the latest populist single issue party that tells them what they want to hear.

ClairDeLaLune · 17/07/2026 09:55

Yeah. What has the ECHR ever done for us?

Marmalademorning · 17/07/2026 09:56

I feel like the main reason we have a problem with immigration and the huge numbers we have today (and this was also before Brexit), is because it’s become a money making scheme for human rights lawyers. So if it’s a choice of having hundreds of thousands of illegal migrants entering the Uk (and then being allowed to stay), and I’m talking about the ones who aren’t coming from war torn countries), then yes, I do think we should leave the ECHR, because this level of immigration just isn’t sustainable.

BoredZelda · 17/07/2026 09:56

Daafdjdnd · 17/07/2026 09:47

Completely relevant as they have or will soon have thriving careers. Again we never took a penny of welfare.

No child benefit? Kids at school? Go to the doctors, dentist? You wouldn’t call the police or fire service or ambulance? Never use any kind of public transport, or the road system? You never have your bins emptied, or go to the park or leisure centre?

If you think the money your husband pays in tax covers all that, I have a bridge to sell you.

BoredZelda · 17/07/2026 09:58

DrCoconut · 17/07/2026 09:55

This. Do people seriously think the likes of reform would protect their maternity pay, sick pay, right to expect freedom from discrimination etc? If elected there would be nothing to stop them reintroducing Victorian style employment laws where the few get very rich while the majority slave for 16 hours a day for pennies. They could imprison and even kill you if your face doesn't fit. Take your property. Stop your healthcare and education. It sounds dramatic but that's why protection that goes beyond whoever forms the current government is so important. Sadly many of "the people" can't see it and will just vote in the latest populist single issue party that tells them what they want to hear.

Most likely they will just flip the ECHR into the BHR. Like they did with every single EU rule.

Daafdjdnd · 17/07/2026 09:58

Lavender14 · 17/07/2026 09:43

This woman was also allowed by the home office.

And we've established that you do indeed utilise the benefits of taxpayers money in certain capacities as a sahm who is not contributing to taxes. Not that I think there's anything wrong with that - I just think it's crazy you want to pull the bridge up behind you for more vulnerable people.

The 18 extra shouldn't have been allowed

EasternStandard · 17/07/2026 09:58

Lavender14 · 17/07/2026 09:52

Can you not see the difficulty it creates when you've groups of people using different legal routes into a country to make a life for themselves (as we are all entitled to do). And then creating a list of who's the most deserving?

It creates a capitalist system where we essentially monetise immigrants depending on what we get from them. And it means the most vulnerable people and particularly BAME individuals are at the bottom of the food chain. It creates a sense of 'validation' that people have the right to judge who has 'earnt' their right to be here but as we know from all the recent violence this is very susceptible to being tangled up in blatant racism. Because while some people may feel that only people who pay their way should be here, there are other people who feel there are too many working migrants as well. It's no coincidence that the recent violence where I live saw working migrants who had paid their way to be here legally burnt out of their homes. And yet polish migrants, Ukrainian refugees were fine... why do you think that was? They have the ability to walk down the street and not be immediately distinguished by their skin colour. We have people of colour who have been born here feeling more wary going out and about now for the same reason.

You cannot create a hierarchy of 'deserving' immigrants without upholding racist social structures. And therein lies the rub.

Yes there are conversations to be had about resources, but those conversations are happening because of political leaders screwing over the average working person consistently for many years. Asylum seeking individuals are being used as scapegoats to stop the public properly scrutinising government public spending. Its a very intentional and coordinated drive through media.

I think rounding on one poster is not helping the discussion.

Go broader than one poster who used a different system. There’s an asylum system which is causing political problems in many countries. What should happen with that system?

The op states the home office and Mahmood were overturned by the tribunal. Labour, who initially said refugees welcome, are now trying to keep people out. Should they?

There’s much more to tackle and discuss in all this.

BoredZelda · 17/07/2026 09:59

RodneyKitten · 17/07/2026 09:55

This is what they will be entitled here as council housing.

Or did you want all of them to squeeze in a three bed semi? Naughty!

You even know enough about their situation to know where they would be on the council housing list? Wow, the inside information Mumsnetters have access to is incredible.

inkognitha · 17/07/2026 10:04

NotBreezy · 17/07/2026 09:31

Who said you couldn’t express an opinion. ‘Legal right’ 😂

I am the daughter of brown hard-working immigrants. My mum and dad both worked from the 1960s till they retired. I am proud of them both, esp my mum. I love the UK, as do they. I was born here and don’t want to live anywhere else.

But hypocritical immigrants who benefitted from the UK and now want to pull the ladder up, make me cringe a lot. I see them IRL too.

You may think the UK can welcome more migrants, it's your right.
I may think differently.

But telling a migrant they need to stfu or judging them because you don't like their opinions is a massive contradiction on your side.

Daafdjdnd · 17/07/2026 10:05

BoredZelda · 17/07/2026 09:56

No child benefit? Kids at school? Go to the doctors, dentist? You wouldn’t call the police or fire service or ambulance? Never use any kind of public transport, or the road system? You never have your bins emptied, or go to the park or leisure centre?

If you think the money your husband pays in tax covers all that, I have a bridge to sell you.

No child benefit. And we're with Bupa.

DuncinToffee · 17/07/2026 10:05

https://www.justice.org.uk/news/from-hillsborough-to-rochdale-how-the-echr-has-delivered-justice-for-victims-across-britain

From Hillsborough to Rochdale: how the ECHR has delivered justice for victims

BoredZelda · 17/07/2026 10:06

Lavender14 · 17/07/2026 09:52

Can you not see the difficulty it creates when you've groups of people using different legal routes into a country to make a life for themselves (as we are all entitled to do). And then creating a list of who's the most deserving?

It creates a capitalist system where we essentially monetise immigrants depending on what we get from them. And it means the most vulnerable people and particularly BAME individuals are at the bottom of the food chain. It creates a sense of 'validation' that people have the right to judge who has 'earnt' their right to be here but as we know from all the recent violence this is very susceptible to being tangled up in blatant racism. Because while some people may feel that only people who pay their way should be here, there are other people who feel there are too many working migrants as well. It's no coincidence that the recent violence where I live saw working migrants who had paid their way to be here legally burnt out of their homes. And yet polish migrants, Ukrainian refugees were fine... why do you think that was? They have the ability to walk down the street and not be immediately distinguished by their skin colour. We have people of colour who have been born here feeling more wary going out and about now for the same reason.

You cannot create a hierarchy of 'deserving' immigrants without upholding racist social structures. And therein lies the rub.

Yes there are conversations to be had about resources, but those conversations are happening because of political leaders screwing over the average working person consistently for many years. Asylum seeking individuals are being used as scapegoats to stop the public properly scrutinising government public spending. Its a very intentional and coordinated drive through media.

This. It also makes it far easier for the very same people to monetise UK citizens and for that to be accepted. The current discourse about removing benefits from disabled people, those living in poverty, those who are unable to work is far easier to sell if we have already dehumanised others living within our borders.

BoredZelda · 17/07/2026 10:10

Daafdjdnd · 17/07/2026 10:05

No child benefit. And we're with Bupa.

You pay privately for you and your children to see a GP? Sure you do. You’ll be telling me next you have your bins collected privately, have an ambulance and fire engine parked on your drive, and have never used a public park in your life.

RodneyKitten · 17/07/2026 10:12

BoredZelda · 17/07/2026 09:59

You even know enough about their situation to know where they would be on the council housing list? Wow, the inside information Mumsnetters have access to is incredible.

Where do you think they will live?

Claridge’s?

Of course they will be entitled to council housing. There are at least a dozen of children in the family and they are housed with priority.

randomchap · 17/07/2026 10:12

Daafdjdnd · 17/07/2026 10:05

No child benefit. And we're with Bupa.

What's the a&e coverage like with Bupa? Do they have emergency ambulances?

BoredZelda · 17/07/2026 10:16

RodneyKitten · 17/07/2026 10:12

Where do you think they will live?

Claridge’s?

Of course they will be entitled to council housing. There are at least a dozen of children in the family and they are housed with priority.

I don’t know where they live, there are no details about the family. We don’t know any of their circumstances.

They will have no more priority than any other family with their circumstances.

BoredZelda · 17/07/2026 10:18

inkognitha · 17/07/2026 10:04

You may think the UK can welcome more migrants, it's your right.
I may think differently.

But telling a migrant they need to stfu or judging them because you don't like their opinions is a massive contradiction on your side.

Haven’t seen anyone saying STFU, just pointing out hypocrisy.

RodneyKitten · 17/07/2026 10:21

BoredZelda · 17/07/2026 10:16

I don’t know where they live, there are no details about the family. We don’t know any of their circumstances.

They will have no more priority than any other family with their circumstances.

We know enough to know that there many children who in the UK are housed with priority.

So yes, they will be housed.

But you are perfectly entitled to your opinion, wrong thought it might be.

EasternStandard · 17/07/2026 10:21

randomchap · 17/07/2026 10:12

What's the a&e coverage like with Bupa? Do they have emergency ambulances?

Such micro focus v big issues impacting so many countries.

EilonwyWithRedGoldHair · 17/07/2026 10:21

AutumnHazel · 16/07/2026 21:43

OK, so at least you’re being crysral clear that you don’t believe in democracy, and that British people are fundamentally too evil and stupid to be entrusted with the right to choose a Government that can set the law of the land.

Am I wrong?

No, I believe in democracy. I think we should move to some form of PR which would be more democratic. Doesn't mean I have to agree with whoever gets voted in or support their policies, or indeed support every policy of the party I vote for.

Surely you recognise though that we live with an incredibly biased media that distorts the facts to suit it's own ends. People aren't necessarily making educated decisions, in that few people dig deeper than the headlines - there's a reason that in tabloids that first paragraph is bolded and sometimes contradicts the rest of the story, many people never read past it, online we have clickbait titles that often completely misrepresent what happened. We are surrounded by misinformation, people aren't stupider, most just don't have the time or inclination to research and that is being used against us.

SuffolkSun · 17/07/2026 10:23

AutumnHazel · 17/07/2026 07:10

Excellent point.

If we did open our doors to all Gazans, then logically we’d have to do the same to every other person facing war or strife, we would be deluged with millions of people, society would break down, and we’d quickly become the war zone that people would be fleeing from!

I’m not a fan of Reform, but the naivety and suicidal empathy of the “Left” in wanting open borders is far more scary. That really would destroy the country.

the naivety and suicidal empathy of the “Left” in wanting open borders

You've invented something again, to argue against it.

Difficult to believe that you're not..."intellectually less endowed". But, we'll take you at your word when you say you're not.

EasternStandard · 17/07/2026 10:26

SuffolkSun · 17/07/2026 10:23

the naivety and suicidal empathy of the “Left” in wanting open borders

You've invented something again, to argue against it.

Difficult to believe that you're not..."intellectually less endowed". But, we'll take you at your word when you say you're not.

What should happen?

All the insults aside, can you say what looks like a good system and how many Gazans we should take?

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