AIBU to feel touched out while my husband wants more affection?

[Coraturtle]

Sorry this is long but I don't want to make DH out to be the bad guy because I don't think he is. I just don't know whether I'm being unreasonable or whether this is just another phase of becoming parents.

DH and I are both in our mid/late 30s. We had our first child last year after 9 yrs together and our little boy turns one in August.

I absolutely adore our son but if I'm honest, I've found this first year far harder than I ever imagined. I thought I was prepared but nothing prepares you for how relentless it is. The sleep deprivation, the constant responsibility, worrying about every little thing, never really switching off. I struggled emotionally in the early months and although things are much better now, I still don't feel like "old me."

Throughout all of this DH has genuinely been brilliant. He does his share around the house, gets up with our son at weekends so I can have a lie in, cooks, cleans, changes nappies, does bedtime. He's a very involved dad and I honestly couldn't ask for more in that respect.

The problem seems to be... us.
Before having our son we were one of those couples who were always close. Sitting with our legs over each other on the sofa, holding hands, random hugs in the kitchen, kissing each other goodbye even if it was just popping to the shops. We'd often just sit cuddled up watching TV without even thinking about it. Physical affection has always been a huge part of our relationship.

Now by the end of the day I honestly feel completely "touched out." My son is on me constantly. He's at that age where he wants picking up, climbing over me, pulling himself up on me, wanting feeding, (I’m still breast feeding I want to do it for a bit longer as I feel guilty not doing that) wanting comforting. I spend most of the day with someone physically attached to me. I have gone back to work 3 times a week for now which has been very hard to adjust to.

By the evening I just want to sit down and have a cup of tea without another human touching me for five minutes.

It's not that I don't love DH or don't fancy him. We still have sex fairly regularly (probably once or twice a week on average, sometimes more, sometimes less depending on how shattered we both are). To me that seems fairly healthy considering we have a baby.

But DH says sex isn't really the issue.
He says he misses affection.
According to him I never initiate affection anymore, I move away if he tries to cuddle on the sofa because I say I'm too hot or uncomfortable, I don't randomly kiss him anymore, if he puts his arm round me I tend to carry on scrolling my phone rather than lean into him.

He said recently, "I feel like I have to ask permission just to get a cuddle."
That actually upset me because I hadn't realised he felt that way.
I explained exactly what I've written above, that by bedtime I've had someone touching me literally all day and my body just needs a bit of space. He said he completely understands the concept of being touched out but that he also feels like he's gone from being my partner to just someone who helps run the household.

His words were, "Our son gets every bit of your affection. I get whatever energy you've got left."I didn't really know what to say because in some ways I understand why he'd feel that way, but equally our son is a baby. He literally needs me.

It's not just before sex either. Even afterwards he'll want to lie there cuddling for ages, chatting or just holding each other. Which is lovely in theory, but sometimes all I want is a quick shower, clean pyjamas and to get into bed on my own side and go to sleep. By that point it's often late and I know our son will probably be awake at 6am, I want to have enough energy to go on the exercise bike in the morning because our son wakes up. I feel awful admitting it because I know he's only looking for closeness, but sometimes it genuinely feels like another demand on me when all I want is to switch off.

Another thing he's brought up is that he thinks I've become a much more anxious person since becoming a mum. A few weeks ago we left our son overnight with DH's parents for the first time. Well, technically we were collecting him the following morning because we'd planned dinner, drinks. It was the first proper date we'd had in months.

Dinner was lovely. We laughed, had a few drinks, talked about things other than nappies and for a while it actually felt like us again.
But I'll admit I kept bringing our son up.
I kept saying things like, "Do you think he's had enough milk?", "Should we ring and check he's okay?", "What if he won't settle?" “Why haven’t they sent any pictures of him”, "I can always pump some more when we get back if he needs it."After about the fourth or fifth time DH said, "Can you just relax? He's absolutely fine." I said I was trying.

He then said, "I just want one evening where I feel like I've got my wife to myself without your mind being somewhere else."
Again, I felt guilty because I know exactly what he meant, but I couldn't just switch my brain off. It wasn't that I didn't want to be there with him, I was having a lovely time, but my brain is constantly thinking about our son.

There's probably one other thing that's been bothering me too. Since becoming parents DH seems to be drinking more than he used to. I'm not talking about getting drunk every night, but it's become almost routine for him to have one or two beers after work. On its own I probably wouldn't think much of it, but it's becoming such a habit that I've started noticing it.

Last weekend we were at his parents' house for a family BBQ.His mum had bought me a few summery outfits to cheer me up because she thought they'd suit me, so she asked me to try them on. I came downstairs wearing one of the dresses and everyone was saying how nice it looked.

My SIL smiled and said along the lines of ‘You've snapped back so quickly after having a baby.’
I laughed because I don't really think I have, I've just lost most of the pregnancy weight naturally from running around after an almost one year old.

By this point DH had had far too much to drink. He wasn't just tipsy, he was very drunk.
He smiled and said, "Yeah... shame I barely get to touch her."Everyone laughed but it was one of those really awkward laughs where nobody quite knew what to say.That wasn't even the end of it.Throughout the evening he kept making little comments about how I never cuddle him anymore and how our son gets all my attention. At one point he laughed and said, "I'm jealous of my own son."Again, awkward silence.Then, to my absolute horror, he started talking about our sex life.
He said before we had our son I used to be much more adventurous, that I used to enjoy giving him oral sex, and now "it's just missionary”I wanted the ground to swallow me up.His parents were sitting there. His sister was sitting there.Nobody knew where to look.
My MIL suddenly started clearing stuff, FIL stared at the barbecue, SIL immediately tried changing the subject, BIL and his wife just changed the subject. I don't think anyone found it funny. I think they were embarrassed for me.On the taxi home I asked him why on earth he'd thought that was an appropriate conversation to have in front of his family.
He genuinely seemed surprised that I'd been so upset.

He said he'd only been joking but admitted there was "truth behind every joke."
The next morning he apologised repeatedly. He admitted he'd had far too much to drink, said he couldn't even remember saying some of it and was mortified when I told him exactly what he'd come out with.
He said he'd never intended to humiliate me.
The thing is, I don't actually think he's trying to pressure me. If anything, I think he's genuinely lonely. He says he misses me.

But equally I can't help feeling he's become quite needy. Sometimes it feels like if we're sitting on the sofa he wants to be touching me. If we're in bed he wants to cuddle. If we're walking somewhere he wants to hold hands. It's almost as though he's desperately trying to recreate how we were before the baby, whereas I'm still trying to work out who I even am now.

I also can't ignore the fact that he's drinking more than he used to, and all of these feelings seem to come pouring out once he's had too much.

I feel guilty because I honestly don't know how to give any more than I already am. By the time our son is asleep I've usually been "on duty" for 13 hours and I just want to sit quietly for half an hour.

I don't want every evening to involve sitting on the same sofa under the same blanket holding hands. Sometimes I just want to exist in my own space for a bit.

At the same time I don't want him feeling unloved either because he really has been an amazing husband and father throughout all of this.

In a way I’m still adjusting to motherhood but I also want to keep our relationship. I know these things probably just take time. I’m still in love with him. I’ve just got a whole human that needs me a lot and I don’t know to adjust and be chill.

None of your posts up to this one say you’ve spoken to your GP about how you are feeling. Based on your response I’m still not sure you’ve spoken to them about your mood in any meaningful level of detail.

You also imply you and your husband are having counselling. Is this together or separately.

I think there may be an expectation that because I haven't shared every conversation I've had with my GP those conversations haven't happened.
I don't feel I need to disclose every detail of my health or every discussion I've had with my doctor on an internet forum. Some things are just private.

Feeling sad about returning to work because I miss my son isn't on its own, something I personally felt warranted a detailed discussion with my GP. I think many parents experience those emotions when they first go back to work. My own mum didn't return to work until all four of us were at school because she wanted to spend that time with us.

That said, my GP is aware that I'm struggling with anxiety and I'm taking steps to address it. I've also arranged private counselling. I'm not ignoring how I feel or pretending everything is fine I just haven't felt the need to share every aspect of my healthcare on Mumsnet. I did not read the rules of MN if my post has broken the rules for not sharing every detail, you are free to report it. I just needed an outlet, I have a lot going on at the minute that is all my post was about not the ins and outs of every single aspect of my health.

He started counselling on his own not too long ago as I said to him it might be best if he tries it to help him. He has only had a few sessions but is finding it very helpful so far. We have enquired about counselling together and I will be starting my own individual counselling.

It’s not breaking Talk Guidelines but it was a bit relevant that you’ve spoken to your GP about anxiety.

I think your husband is not nearly so kind as you think he is - it really is all about him isn’t it.

My priority at the moment is learning healthier ways to manage my anxiety and understanding why I'm feeling the way I do.

You've got hormonal shifts, breastfeeding, an immature husband, going back to work stress, and interrupted sleep at play here. It's really obvious you're white knuckling it here. PPD/PPA can affect your baby, everything from your milk supply to bonding. Your mental and physical state affect your child's development.

It sounds like your husband's drinking and being jealous of your son and acting out is a part of feeling like you do. Are you worried he's drinking while taking care of your child? He needs healthier ways of coping with the changes having a child bring to your marriage too.

You said earlier you can't control your texting when someone else, even your husband, is taking care of your son. If that's true and you're actually not able to control that, this is where DBT might fit in as a step prior to medication. Ask your therapist. There's lots of stress reduction techniques out there and I'm surprised your therapist is not working with you on this.

If you need to step up to meds, there are meds compatible with breastfeeding.

Thank you.

My milk supply has actually been very good which is one of the reasons I would like to continue breastfeeding until around two years if it continues to work for both myself and my son. Of course things can change but at the moment it is something that is important to us and I like it, my son likes it so we will go with it and see.

Regarding my husband he is not drinking while caring for our son and I would never leave our child in a situation where I felt he was unsafe. I do agree that he needs to develop healthier ways of coping with the changes that parenthood has brought but he has only had two counselling sessions so far. I think it is unrealistic to expect someone to have learnt all new strategies after two sessions.

The things I mentioned in my original post were not things that happened yesterday. We have had time to discuss them, understand each other's perspectives and talk about how we want to move forward. Like me he is adjusting to a completely new stage of life, and we are both trying to navigate it.

Regarding my anxiety I agree that I need to work on managing it better. I don't know at this stage exactly what support or strategies will be most helpful, which is why I am liaising with professionals who know my health and have access to the important information to make an informed decision. I will work with professionals to understand what approach is right for me as well I believe I have autonomy over my own body and the decisions I make.

I appreciate the concern and suggestions I think we all want the same thing, which is for me, my husband and our son to be happy and healthy and have happy, healthy parents.

I know the person he has been for the last 9 years,10 soon, that is a milestone for us and I don't think this moment defines our entire relationship. Of course we both have things we can work on and that's why he is having individual counselling and we have also enquired about couples counselling.

It is still very early days after only two sessions for his individual counselling so it's too soon to know exactly what impact it will have but we are both open to trying and seeing where it takes us.

Maybe my marriage will fail, maybe not I am not able to see the future all we can do is work on the now and see how that goes.

That is a really good strategy and I completely agree with you about being completely open minded about how things progress.

I think I and maybe this other poster are feeling the way you are very quick to move from acknowledging some very serious issues to moving towards your well worn strategy of over empathising with your very under functioning DH.

It is a very well worn pattern in many relationships an over functioner and an underfunctioner.

Indeed

The DH seems to be being prioritised despite some frankly appalling behaviour.

I don't feel the need to post every thought or every conversation we've had on here. I came here to vent not to necessarily document every single discussion since the BBQ.

I have been upset and he knows that. We've talked about it at length. Personally, I don't think repeatedly bringing it up or holding it over him is helpful in the long run it just risks building resentment on both sides. That doesn't mean I'm pretending it didn't happen or sweeping it under the carpet.

He's chosen to start individual counselling and has had two sessions so far. We've also decided to try couples counselling. I will be attending individual counselling myself, our son had a very severe allergic reaction a couple months back which did amplify my anxiety, we had to call an ambulance etc we thought we were going to lose our child.

I am open to seeing what the therapist suggests, If they think it would benefit me to keep on and on at my husband and not forgive and have anger building instead of giving other options then fair that’s advice from a professional. I am not an angry person neither is my husband, I’ve never been an angry or resentful person neither has DH maybe he was pre us meeting in 2016 but ever since then I have not known him to be like this so I am willing to give him a chance. This is somewhat the first time in my life where I am struggling and I think it’s mainly due to having a child and the changes that come with that. We did our research before having a child but maybe we didn’t do enough. I also doubt that a professional with registered accreditation would recommend that I build up resentment over him but I do not know. We will have to see my guess is no but I’m open to being wrong.

Do you genuinely think there's a better way to approach this? I'm asking because I'm open to different perspectives and maybe there is something I'm missing.

I truly think you sound like an amazing mother. And very caring considerate wife. Ignore the online "pharmacists.." 🙄 just speak to him. Xx

I'd like to think I know him reasonably well I may be wrong. I think the situation is more nuanced than simply saying I'm prioritising him. Reading some of the replies I wonder if people have got the wrong impression of me. I didn't come here to trash my marriage, I came to vent after a difficult situation.

I do appreciate people taking the time to respond but I also think we'll get value from talking things through with a qualified therapist who can get to know us both face to face each session and understand the full context rather than snippets from a post. Hear both sides from an outside perspective.

No I don’t think there is a better approach and I definitely wouldn’t throw away a good relationship based on one instance.

Individual support for your difficulties with anxiety and after you are giving your own experience in this situation the degree of compassion it deserves (because currently that is where I see you bypassing as you clearly are an empathetic person and giving your husband a lot of grace) then getting couples therapy would be very helpful.

Anxiety is awful and I sympathise with that, but I think that ultimately you have a dh problem.
He's at the root of all this.

This should be a great time for you, relaxing into motherhood, and perhaps you could have if your dh wasn't a manchild himself.

I could not bear a man who was so needy.
'Wa-ah my mummy has another child to look after' vibes.
He obviously has no sense of stoicism and is not his own man.
It's not healthy for a man to be so emotionally dependent on a woman.
He can love her without this dependency.

No sense of getting the f* on with it.
He has to be strong for a few years, that's all and he can't do it.
To be frank there's other ways he could meet his sexual needs temporarily (without being graphic about it.)

I think that when you're hopefully starting to feel more yourself you will be furious at this manbaby's outburst about your sex life.
You will be standing there and the anger will hit you like a ton of bricks.

God how are you suffering sex with this pathetic manchild twice a week. He sounds utterly pathetic. You have a baby he is not number 1 in your life now. He is jealous of his own child rather than stepping up to be a parent.

After his behaviour at the BBQ I would be livid.
I would have zero respect for this tantrumming man child and would happily send him back to Mummy and Daddy for good.

The things I am struggling with, that cause me sadness are just laughable,

This jumped out for me. There is nothing laughable about these things at all. I am sure that if a patient were to talk with you about similar struggles you would not think them laughable.

In the kindest way possible I would say to you that your being a doctor might not help you when finding ways through all this. My late OH was a doctor and he suffered from anxiety too.... his way of dealing with it was not productive at all. It needed me looking at it as a non clinician with a focus on relationships and family life that helped him to start recognising what was happening and what needed to be done.

He tended to underplay his anxiety thinking that as a doctor he should be able to rationalise his way out of it. He couldn't.

I do understand why you'd see it that way from what I've written, and I appreciate you taking the time to reply.

The thing is, there is a lot more nuance than can fit into one thread. I genuinely enjoy our sex life. The practical difficulty has been that I also need to be up early to exercise as that's something that's really important for my mental wellbeing. I exercise every weekday morning and it helps me enormously.

DH is actually a wonderful dad in many ways. He does all the mornings with our 11 month old and really wants that time with him. The difficult part has been that our son is very attached to me for comfort despite DH's best efforts. That has been hard on both of us. I know this stage won't last forever, my nephew was exactly the same and by the time he was three he adored spending time with his dad. No two children are the same but I have discussed this with a professional at his appointments and they’ve repeated the same things, our son is still very young, I am breastfeeding him, therefore I am his main source of comfort at this age etc.

As for the anger you think I'll feel one day, maybe you could be right but that's never really been how I've dealt with difficult things. I've been incredibly fortunate in life and have generally been a happy person and had a very happy life looking back on it. My instinct has always been to work through problems rather than let resentment build. That's not to say I'm ignoring what happened or that it didn't hurt me it did.

We've been together for almost ten years and this is the first time we've faced something like this. I don't believe one painful chapter automatically outweighs years of a happy, loving marriage. We are not 20+ years in so maybe I am naive but willing to give my marriage a try with my weak emotional husband ahaha. DH recognised there was a problem and chose to start individual counselling I'm starting counselling too, and we've found a couples counsellor because we both want to understand how to go about things and how adjust with a child. We’ve both found it difficult in our different ways. I am not going to judge him, I have struggled and acted in ways I should not have either I am not perfect either, certainly haven’t had a drunk outburst but have had my own outbursts in my own ways.

Maybe I'll discover things in counselling that change my perspective. Maybe I won't. I honestly don't know but for now I am willing to work on our marriage and seek professional advice. But I'd rather make decisions after doing that work than react from the rawness of one very difficult period. That's what feels right for me. I have never been one to react with emotions, that is one thing my mum a retired psychiatrist did drill into my siblings and I in our teens especially having emotional intelligence and ability to resolve conflict and adapt instead of reacting hastily/black and white thinking.

That said maybe I do have a DH problem regardless it’s been an amazing 9 years and if he doesn’t change and really access his behaviour and feelings after receiving support then at least he tried and I can make my decision about our marriage from that. I don’t believe it’s fair to access him over 2 counselling sessions or scrutinise him forever what is the point in that if he’s actively wanting to work on his issues since being a father. I do know he very much loves our son and loves me but has made a mistake that has hurt me two things can be true at the same time. I’ve made plenty of mistakes in my time but no one in my life has spent the whole time scrutinising me for mistakes I’ve made when I’ve been willing to make the effort to do better.

@Coraturtle
Do you not see how much you are rationalizing?

As a doctor, you should know the difference between truth-seeking that starts with facts(reasoning on a matter)and constructing a logical justification that starts with pre-existing conclusions or emotional desires(rationalizing)

I’m sure you will have a two-paragraph comeback for this even if you don’t post it.

A big change in circumstances often spotlight what someone is truly like. Their true character, strengths and weaknesses. You’ve been married for nearly ten years but there were never any huge changes in dynamics. Well, a child does change the dynamics of a relationship. You are giving off the vibes of high-functioning anxious person who is over performing in her relationship and your husband, well, he’s clearly underperforming but not because he’s not a hands on parent. Rather for the many reasons you are choosing to rationalize away.

@Coraturtle you are reacting with emotion, though. Is anxiety not an emotional state and you're reacting to it?
Anxiety is very awful. It overrides all good sense, doesn't it?
No matter how daft something is on an intellectual level, or how intelligent a person is, the fear overrides it all.

The trouble is this man is just adding to the anxiety.
You simply cannot relax. Now even a simple bbq with people you seem to like is spoiled because he can't contain his emotions.

You come across as a very lovely person.
It's good that you're giving him a chance, but I echo that it's easy to be all touchy feely when all is well.

I had an ex who was Mr Touchy Feely and he hurt and disappointed me very much.
Now I like men who are a bit more stoic and contained. Who don't need me at all.
Who if we split, would be sad but back on their feet in a month or two.

Thank you, that's a thoughtful reply and I think where I'm struggling with your response is is that I'm not entirely sure what you're suggesting I should do differently. For what it's worth he served in the Marines for many years so I've never known him as someone who struggles with resilience or coping generally or being mr touchy feely as you’re suggesting but you’re right it’s easier when things are well. We will have to see how things go after professional support for both of us individually and together. All we want is to be great parents to our son who we longed for, for quite sometime after miscarriages and to be great partners to each other long term so it’s better to work on that now while he’s still very little so he can have great parents growing up.

Some will say maybe we shouldn’t have had a child, we are both very proactive people and did our research as best as we could and went to antenatal classes but having a baby is very different to all the classes & research and being parents is an experience you learn on the job at least from my experience so far. I hope we can be good parents in the long run it’s only 11 months in I believe there’s still a chance for us both to change and work together and individually on things.

I’m not really sure the advice you’re giving but I do think “two paragraph comeback” comment feels a little like assuming I’m defensive before I’ve even responded or trying to make me feel bad I’m not sure why. Regardless, my intention was never to come here and be dismissing I think you’ve got the wrong impression of me but I do understand text is quite hard to decipher the manner and tone in which someone is trying to convey their point across as. I came here just to use it as an outlet at the minute whilst I figure out counselling as I’ve been having a difficult time recently that’s all.

@Coraturtle the 2 page defense the other poster was saying somewhat tongue in cheek is really pointing to how you use intellectualising as a defence to avoid feeling your feelings but the anxiety where you are waiting for something to go wrong is pointing to those unresolved emotions creating a whole mental state in you.

Your pattern that you are showing over and again here is that you feel something uncomfortable for you (you detailed the root causes of these emotions yourself on this thread) and your pattern is to rush to intellectualisation/rationalisation but those feelings were giving you a message and you’re ignoring that message is contributing to you to have a very anxious mental state along with all of the other reasons new mums can become more anxious, but your system is overwhelmed by anxiety.

I do think open and honest communication with your partner could really help with this, where he makes the necessary changes and takes the required action but I do think your emotional avoidance contributes to your anxiety so you learning about your emotions and learning how to communicate them while feeling them will really help your side of this issue.

Some will say maybe we shouldn’t have had a child, we are both very proactive people and did our research as best as we could and went to antenatal classes but having a baby is very different to all the classes & research and being parents is an experience you learn on the job at least from my experience so far. I hope we can be good parents in the long run it’s only 11 months in I believe there’s still a chance for us both to change and work together and individually on things.

Who on earth would say you shouldn’t have had a child. You are overthinking and intellectualising things to your detriment. I think you need to stop giving yourself such a hard time.