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Original poster

Gun control

178 replies

Pixxie7 · 13/08/2021 22:26

Following the awful killing last night I am struggling to find why apart from a very few professions anyone in this country needs a gun license.

OP posts:
Knittingupastorm · 15/08/2021 08:48

Section 2 shotguns are granted on a SGC (Shotgun Certificate), pretty much any person in the country is allowed to get an SGC and shotguns and you do not need a specified reason for wanting them, at that point it's up to the police to prove a good reason why you shouldn't have them.

I’d have that the other way round. I think it should always be on the individual to show they have a good reason to have one for all types of guns, not the police to find a reason they shouldn’t.

AICM · 15/08/2021 08:48

@Roussette

Why should a 23yo (thought he was 22) have a gun license?

I've read that there's 1.3million active gun licenses in this country. That seems extreme. Yes to rural communities, but 1.3million? Shock

That just produces a silly cyclic argument.

Age has no relevance to the debate.

AICM · 15/08/2021 08:49

@Knittingupastorm

Section 2 shotguns are granted on a SGC (Shotgun Certificate), pretty much any person in the country is allowed to get an SGC and shotguns and you do not need a specified reason for wanting them, at that point it's up to the police to prove a good reason why you shouldn't have them.

I’d have that the other way round. I think it should always be on the individual to show they have a good reason to have one for all types of guns, not the police to find a reason they shouldn’t.

I would support that.
OnlyFoolsnMothers · 15/08/2021 08:55

@AICM

Only Fools

But if you agree that alcohol does more damage, which you do, then banning alcohol, makes far more sense that banning guns?

After all, nobody needs alcohol and thousands of battered and dead women would have been better off if it have never have been discovered. Would you agree?

Yes I would, alcohol killed my father, I rarely drink and think the nhs would be saved if we had an alcohol lockdown.
wombat1a · 15/08/2021 09:01

@LEMtheoriginal

Nobody should be shooting another living creature for pleasure. Environmental control, fine, preserving crops, fine. But i cannot abide anyone who does this for "sport" even under the guise of control.

People should not have guns other than farmers and other necessary peeps that im too tired to think of.

How many people are killed or injured in shooting accidents, using guns that don't need to be used?

Totally bonkers, "other than farmers? If a farmer has 5,000 acres that needs protecting from pests and they are the only one allowed to do it then the farms will go bust."

A 1,000 acre place I know of has around 15 people on call for crop protection and on some days when they can only get 6 in (weekdays) that is no where near enough.

AICM · 15/08/2021 09:03

onlyfools

Sorry to hear about your father.
I respect your opinion. A full ban on guns would almost certainly save lives.

OnlyFoolsnMothers · 15/08/2021 09:06

@AICM

onlyfools

Sorry to hear about your father.
I respect your opinion. A full ban on guns would almost certainly save lives.

Don’t worry I wasn’t getting emotional it’s just a fact, I recon over half of the weekends a&e admissions would vanish without alcohol. However the affects of alcohol don’t negate the risks of a gun (same way people try and say alcohol is legal so all other drugs should be)- this is a separate argument and one I will never get my head around.
Disneycharacter · 15/08/2021 09:12

Dh has 3 shotguns. He shoots pigeons and rabbits plus pheasants on a paid shoot at certain times. He is not a farmer, just a normal working professional man. He has always enjoyed this as a hobby and is in a working relationship with a lot of local farmers as he is a free bird scarer. He is safe and only has normal side by side guns.

I can't imagine a pump action shotgun being necessary in any pest control area. A friend of his though has a out of quite scary guns. No idea why he needs so many and I think it could do with looking at.

However I agree on tighter gun control and better investigation of applications

AICM · 15/08/2021 09:29

My point about alcohol is about society accepting unnecessary risks.

When thinking about gun control there is no point talking about knives as they are necessary and cannot be removed from society.

Guns, other than for farmers, can be removed, they are an unnecessary risk. However they are not the only unnecessary risk. There are things that are unnecessary that do far more harm but are just accepted without question.

If we want to remove all unnecessary risk then all guns have to go. But so does alcohol and fast powerful cars. Nobody needs any of these and they kill and damage the lives of people.

HermioneKipper · 15/08/2021 09:29

@Northernlurker

My dad has had a shotgun licence his whole life. He now owns guns inherited from my grandfather and late uncle as well as his own. Why shouldn't he be able to do so? He uses them for leisure. You do know there is a huge industry based on safe and responsible shotgun ownership?
What sort of leisure? Shooting deer etc? Makes me sick. Like all those numpties going on shooting weekends. Who wants to kill anything for pleasure? I can only assume people with serious issues
HermioneKipper · 15/08/2021 09:36

@Knittingupastorm this clip is just brilliant!

HermioneKipper · 15/08/2021 09:40

@Coogee

Banning motorbikes would save many more lives than completely banning firearms.

Around 300 lives lost every year.

I hate this sort of argument. People start to sound like gun crazed Americans talking about their civil liberties.

Motorbikes are not the same as guns. They have a purpose - to get to places.

Guns have only one purpose - to kill things. People do not need a gun except under a very limited set of circumstances.

Incidentally I hate motorbikes too (noisy, anti-social and dangerous) but they are in no way the same as a gun

AICM · 15/08/2021 10:01

Herminone
I would take issue with some of what you've said.

The Honda CBR Blackbird has a top speed of over 190mph and a 0-60 time of 2.8 seconds. That bike is not about getting to work. It is not the same as gun but is a bike like this necessary? Nobody needs a bike like that on the road, having them introduces an unnecessary risk. Do you want this bike banned?

My gun was built to lie on the ground a punch a hole in a piece of paper. It was not built to kill.

Please watch this video. It's about the UK Olympic shooting team. these guns were not built to kill.

HermioneKipper · 15/08/2021 10:11

AICM But why are you talking about motorbikes on a thread about gun control? They’re 2 separate issues and this one has come about because a terrorist could get his hands on a gun, despite a history of violent behaviour, mental health issues and horrifying social media history and kill innocent people.

Incidentally I agree re motorbikes, I dislike them hugely and would happily see them banned but it’s irrelevant to this conversation.

OnlyFoolsnMothers · 15/08/2021 10:14

it’s irrelevant to this conversation yep so many comparisons on here are, we don’t need comparisons, just look at guns, their purpose vs their risk!

OnlyFoolsnMothers · 15/08/2021 10:16

If we want to remove all unnecessary risk then all guns have to go. But so does alcohol and fast powerful cars so it’s an all or nothing with you, if alcohol is fine for adults give it to children, if foolish adults can drive why can sensible children?!

AICM · 15/08/2021 10:18

I think you've proved my point. You just want to ban the things you hate.

What is the purpose of an Olympic 50m rifle then. Do you believe it is to kill?

AICM · 15/08/2021 10:19

Where. where. where have I said we should give alcohol to children?

Coogee · 15/08/2021 10:21

I hate this sort of argument.

Whether you hate it or not is irrelevant. There are other perfectly good forms of transport that don’t have such a high fatality rate. A good proportion of motorbikes are ridden for fun and not from necessity. So, not that different to guns. Hundreds of lives could be saved every year by banning motorbikes.

How many people are killed by legally held firearms every year?

That said, I wouldn’t support a ban on either.

HermioneKipper · 15/08/2021 10:21

We’re also not talking about a bloody air rifle either are we. Although given loads of idiots use them to cause anti social behaviour and injure small animals etc then I think they should be confined to the practice range where they can be checked in and out and not taken away

OnlyFoolsnMothers · 15/08/2021 10:22

@AICM

I think you've proved my point. You just want to ban the things you hate.

What is the purpose of an Olympic 50m rifle then. Do you believe it is to kill?

I imagine it’s meant to puncture a target
HermioneKipper · 15/08/2021 10:23

AICM I’m not proposing a ban on motorbikes though? I don’t like them and would be hugely upset if my husband or children rode one but haven’t suggested a ban.

Guns however are abhorrent. They’re used to kill things and given one has just been used to murder innocent people I’m shocked people on here are suggesting Joe Bloggs on the street should be allowed to keep them.

Frankly beggars belief

OnlyFoolsnMothers · 15/08/2021 10:23

@AICM

Where. where. where have I said we should give alcohol to children?
You haven’t it’s an analogy
Etulosba · 15/08/2021 10:28

l don’t like them and would be hugely upset if my husband or children rode one but haven’t suggested a ban.

How would you feel if your husband or your children decided that they would like to take up target shooting as a hobby?

HermioneKipper · 15/08/2021 10:32

Well my husband wouldn’t because we have the same views on guns. And we wouldn’t allow our children to do it when they’re young.

If they choose to do it later in life then I guess that’s their choice but I wouldn’t like it. I hope that they would choose not to though. I would make my views clear about it but ultimately that would be up to them.

I also don’t like guns as toys and it’s something we don’t have in our house.