Ukraine Invasion: Part 40

[MagicFox]

40 threads, still here 🇺🇦

Plus one way tickets to The Hague for every Russian involved in war crimes. Starting at the top.

Yep, Liebig is a one trick pony.

And clearly unable to read a room…..💙💛

The Majority of Crimeans Are Still Glad for Their Annexation

These survey results should not be interpreted as a refutation of the image of Crimea that Ukrainian activists and advocacy groups present in the West. Recent testimony before Congress painted a grim picture of “life under occupation” in Crimea. There is no doubt that human rights abuses occur in the peninsula. Life is difficult in the territory for activists and those still opposed to the annexation. Corruption remains endemic.

But when Ukrainian activists and Western politicians claim that the residents of Crimea are “living under occupation,” they mistake the experience of some for the experience of all. The majority of Crimeans do not experience Russian rule as oppressive, alien, or unwelcome. Instead, based on the evidence of our surveys, they are reasonably happy to be living in Putin’s Russia.

Factoring in the above, it does not look like a good idea for Ukraine to go and retake Crimea, especially as militarily it has no chance right now anyway.

@Liebig everyone is entitled to their view and for these to be challenged. However, your responses have been quite abrupt, indeed some observers may view them as bordering on bullying. Perhaps English is not your first language?

Gonna melt some minds here. I know nuance is hard on Mumsnet, so I'll give you guys some time to maybe think about what this means.

I'm German and fluent in both. Perhaps I have problems with people relishing the killing and ostracising of a whole people because Ukraine are the "good guys" here and we were told to endorse this view.

By all means, let me not get in the way of the war porn. I love war, and I hope we murder every last orc. Is that how we're supposed to do it?

And for the terminally slow, no, I do not get off on Ukrainians being killed. Perhaps look at what I was posting in 2022 before I had to take a break from reading about how horrific the war is.

Gonna melt some minds here.

This is the most honest thing you have said on here. Excellent description of a troll.

Concession accepted.

Dear souls, dnftt.

Russia and Russians are the enemy, you may missed Putin threatening nuclear attack on the West, not too mention their attack and waging war on Ukraine and civilians?
They also, by their actions, helped throw millions of people around the world into poverty and starvation and cost our own countries economy and yours 100s of billions that could have been spent more productively.

Most Russians, whatever their reasons, still back Putin.

So as long as Russian military remain in Ukraine against the Ukrainians will, then yes, dead Russian soldiers are a positive, thats how wars are won, is is relished? of course not but they have a choice to be there and have chosen to invade a sovereign country.

No Russian or Belarussian athlete should be allowed to compete in any sport, regardless of their public support or not of Russia.

It's great that you don't even pretend to engage with what I posted. You just ignore anything counter to the narrative you have.

A piece in Foreign Affairs saying Crimea is mostly okay with being Russian? Nah.

The next wunderwaffen isn't actually turning the tide of the war? Nah.

Liebig must be a Russian troll. The Ukrainian flag he's had in the lounge window since March 2022 is just the biggest troll energy move because he really cares about it that much, owning people in the web.

I imagine a lot of people here parroting the troll thing also hated Isabelle Kurshudyan of the Washington Post when she posted a story showing a Ukrainian commander criticising the gov't for throwing poorly trained boys into the meat grinder with little support (100 KIA, 400 WIA out of ~500 in the unit).

Being a former sports reporter who was fluent in Russian, this was her first real gig in reporting from the warzone for the paper. And instead of manipulating it for Western consumption, naïvely showed what was happening and the commander wanting to not remain anonymous, got shitcanned out of it too.

But please, do go on about how this is Russian shilling.

Putin is a dumb Cold War relic, but he was never going to use nukes. If you actually believed that, you haven't been paying attention.

The US is actually fully against the No First Use doctrine, by the way, something most other nations adopted because flinging nukes willy nilly is bad.

I'm guessing when we were in Afghanistan and Iraq all those people were the enemy too, yes? I'd hate for you to be inconsistent.

For those who don't follow the podcast, today's Ukraine: The Latest from the Telegraph is a wide ranging interview with General Ben Hodges. He talks about the history of the conflict, the Russian center of gravity militarily, and why he won't use nuclear weapons, among other topics. It's well worth a listen.

As a German, the mental whiplash I got from the shift over the narrative on this 180º was something else.

No, Ukraine isn't all Nazi. But there ARE Nazis in that place. Well known Moscow shill organisation TIME showed this.

And the wee nafo, Afghanistan, Iraq references sneaked in

I can picture the spittle flying with the fingers.

...and? so what? there are Nazi's all over Europe, inc the UK... does that justify what Russia is doing to Ukraine? its threats of nuclear war, cyber attack, food supplies? blockading international waters?

You seem to be bending over backwards to support the Russian attack on Ukraine etc.

Ignoring your highly ironic use of the word "civilised". I'm quite sure Luka's pet tennis player will cope

Man, everyone's brain melted today. Imagine being so poisoned that you think criticism of Ukraine = pro-Russia.

Also, still not actually addressing any points, lol. Always the mark of a good argument when you start "actually, there are Nazis everywhere and it's okay".

Civilised warfare.

YouTube being lame and not actually alerting me to the latest video. Came out yesterday.

Now is not the time to criticise Ukraine, it just provides support to Russia and its PR machine, there should be just one objective atm.

You haven't made any points to be addressed

No Nazi's are not ok but they are a tiny minority in any country.

Triggered. I guess we're all okay with not reporting on war crimes and fascists now.

Enjoy your war. I'll be over here, wanting peace that the MIC clearly doesn't want because profit.