Ukraine Invasion: Part 33

[MagicFox]

Starting this at 980 on the other thread because it's late and I might miss the tipping point. We're moving fast at the moment, thanks all for the analysis, insight and company

Agree this is horrible. The generational trauma from this (and frankly any) conflict is likely to be horrendous.

Oooooops

running or even of they are accepting submissions but they came to mind re the archived threads. Some fabulous books on the second world war and the ration years were written based on diary submissions to this institute.

You're welcome, was fun to try out advanced search for the first time since the site changed.
Oulu is a lovely, if windy, city, two of my uncles live there.

reports by one or two reliable people that 4 (4!) helicopters have been shot down on the front lines by a Ukr MANPAD ambush

heldinadream· Today 10:14
@MagicFox and @Fladdermus and anyone else, I've checked back and all the threads are still there. Up until thread 9 they didn't have Ukraine in the title, but the word 'invasion' (always, I think). But every single thread has a link to the thread before - except thread two which appears to mistakenly have a link to itself! So I haven't found thread one yet.
We definitely must not let them disappear - @mnhq this is really important, could you please archive the whole series somewhere safe? It's not just the threads themselves but the wealth of important links contained within.

*Here's thread two.

www.mumsnet.com/talk/_chat/4491025-The-Invasion-Continues*

I agree, heldinadream.

They still exist. They no longer ask people to keep diaries but rather you can apply to be on their panel (or whatever they call it) and then you get sent regular survey style documents to give your thoughts - I think you can send back some supplementary information (they basically don't have enough space to keep lots of large diaries). They try to be broadly representative of society so sometimes they are looking for participants from particular demographics.

They also have an annual day (in May iirc) where anyone can keep a diary for the day and send it into them. You can write about anything but general guidance is you write about what you did (and whether it is typical), conversations you had etc. They also collate Twitter posts of people's day that day, if they use the right tag. I have done this in past years though I forgot this year!

Thank you for the new thread @MagicFox and for all the contributions everyone 🌻

@terrywynne ah good to know!

Prof Sarah Pederson of Robert Gordon University is a MNer whose work "focuses on women's engagement with the media for political purposes, using both historical and contemporary source material."

rgu-repository.worktribe.com/person/72611/sarah-pedersen

Don't know if these are the sort of threads she might pick up. I'm pretty sure she dipped into the long-running Trump / US-democracy threads.

Yes to generational trauma heartbreaking.

I didn't realise that Chat threads don't disappear now (am a very (!) old-time MNer under a variety of names). Good news that the threads are still there.

I had a weird fantasy the other night that one day this might be over and we'd all meet in some random anonymous church hall with username stickers on. And have a massive drunken weeping party

I actually think that would be lovely 😂

I do worry about how long this is going to go one with regards to my mental health. Sounds so selfish to say out loud but it’s been really bothering me lately.

Ah that would be brilliant.

🍷 Russian retail chains have almost exhausted their stocks of elite alcohol, – Igor Karavaev, Chairman of the Presidium of the Association of Retail Trade Companies of the Russian Federation

This will be what forces regime change in Russia! Deprive the elite of their special booze and they will arise up in their monolithic might and demand a new leader.

Let's do it, good to add some beacons of hope for the future to light us on our way 🍷

Hi all, you won't remember me but I'm a long-time lurker, have been along for the ride feeling very grateful for you all. Yes to the get-together! I have a question, if I may...
Following MMB's post about her 'stopthewarer' I can see a potential discussion to have with someone close to me, who may well have bought into the 'nato/west is the agressor/Ukrainians are nazis' story, much the same as Roger Waters has. I can struggle to retain arguments and information when I'm feeling pressured, and wanted to be forearmed with some really good stuff to hit them with; bear in mind they're probably also wary of 'MSM' and 'what we're told'... How do I prepare for this? They may be prepared to read a little, but it needs to be short, trustworthy and to the point. Thank you!

Maybe asking them if they remember who invaded whose country on 24th February might be a start? And who invaded and annexed part of whose country in February 2014?

It seems fairly clear just from those two facts who was the aggressor, really.

Ask them to investigate the activities of the Russian Far Right, the fact that Putin's personal army - the Wagner group - are far right and that the Russian regime meets all the criteria for a fascist state.

The Russians accuse other people of everything they are doing themselves. A classic abuser's strategy.

Show them this picture and ask them to identify the ones who are nazis who deserved to be bombed and driven out of their homeland by Putin.

Russian forces are trying to get information about the plant staff from Martyniuk "to force (the plant's) personnel to work for (Russia's nuclear corporation) Rosatom as soon as possible," Energoatom stated

Why?

Russia has sufficient energy internally presumably so is this to weaken Ukraine by depriving it of energy over the winter?

The Russian army are not prepared at all for winter. They're the ones who are going to freeze. The Ukranian army are well prepared and civilians will receive humanitarian aid and assistance.

The Russians will starve, develop frostbite, develop infections, be in pain and have no morale. Their keepers will abandon them. Winter will help defeat them.

@lifesabitchandthenyoudie initially my DC was repeating Russia’s clever misinformation that NATO’s aggressiveness was the ‘reason’ for the war.

Unfortunately they had picked that argument up from a number of <ahem> well meaning Green posts that were pumping out that little line of argument. I heard that repeated in person by a Stop the War campaigner alongside a climate change protest.

Truly, I pointed out the same argument @AskingQuestionsAllTheTime suggests to my DC as well as pointing out that countries had to ask to join.

But for further info the R4 programme on what really happened in the 90’s was interesting and actually quite a lucid and presumably accurate expose of the not one inch more myth.

Bottom line though, if Putin’s Russia wasn’t so aggressive (re Georgia, Chechnya), Baltic countries wouldn’t be so nervous and asked to join.

Another update on Russian tactical communications. Mobniks are being issued 1980's era soviet radios that are not secure and weigh 15kgs.

twitter.com/ralee85/status/1579993010150203392

The field telephone pictured on the bottom right is their safest option. The radios will be listened to by the Ukrainians and triangulated on for artillery strikes.

Putin has been trying to control Europe's energy supply for many years. So now he's trying to steal other energy sources. Like any other mobster, he wants to crush any competition He may also be trying to restart it but DH suspects the workers have 'sabotaged' it. IE they've safely powered it down and have taken steps to ensure nobody else can get it up and running again except them. That's what he'd do in that situation. So they resort to torture as they've no idea what's been fiddled with and why it won't start. If the workers have done this then they are incredibly brave.

Count me in.