The Invasion Has Stalled

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So here we go. Four days in and the third consecutive thread on the conflict in Ukraine. The last two threads are a credit to the members of mumsnet. Who knows where thread four may find our world?

Thank you all.

Thread two : www.mumsnet.com/Talk/_chat/4491025-The-Invasion-Continues

And a brilliant book that explains where Putin has come from and the role of the KGB in everything right up to the present day is Catherine Belton’s Putin’s People. It’s long and detailed but I don’t think there’s a better book about him

[quote vera99]@MarshaBradyo but's it not anti-UK - your spin. Facts matter 'Those who do not learn history are doomed to repeat it.' And it's a thread on Mumsnet, not a brain's trust on whose weight proclamations the future of Ukraine depends. For the absence of doubt, I stand wholeheartedly with Ukraine but how we got here and who helped to get us there matter. After Litvinenko and Skripal you would have thought we had got the message he is a murderous tyrannical dictator who will stop at nothing. But apparently not forgive me if I don't wave a Union Jack and cheerlead for Londonograd and the millions showered on the Tories by kleptocrats who swam in the blood of their master's body filled sewer.[/quote]
Well you do you.

Depressing but I’ll just look for facts and measured posts without all this stuff.

@huntersmum I genuinely don’t know what that tells us? Can you elaborate?

“Interestingly, this morning my teenager suggested that the social media updates from President Zelensky reminded her of the Katniss propaganda in The Hunger Games. It seems to be a very modern war and watching it all happen in real time is such a bizarre feeling.”

It’s very bizarre... I’m basically watching it unfold on tiktok - I only joined it out of boredom one day and usually I’m usually watching comedy dog videos, historians talking about Anne Boleyn and Jane Austen discussions, suddenly it’s better at news than actual news companies.

@Pernot165

Some expert on the news said he hasn’t crossed into war crime territory yet. If the Russians can be shown to be targeting civilians (the odd accidental strike doesn’t count) or,executing prisoners then that would be war crimes.

I've seen footage of a Russian tank deliberately running over and crushing a civilian car with an elderly man inside it (he survived, nothing short of a miracle, but the intent to kill him was there)

Could that be deemed a war crime?

The ICC can prosecute individuals for war crimes but these must usually rise to the most grievous level, genocide or crimes against humanity.

The ICC actually does have a mandate now to prosecute individuals for the crime of aggression (which the Russian invasion certainly is) but only for ICC members (which Russia is not).

I've seen footage of a Russian tank deliberately running over and crushing a civilian car with an elderly man inside it (he survived, nothing short of a miracle, but the intent to kill him was there)

There has been a lot of analysis on that footage and it looks like it could be the guy driving it was in hot combat and overcooked the turn, there is other footage out there from the same time on the same street of Ukrainian forces taking out Russian saboteurs so it's not really as black and white situation, like everything coming out in the fog of war.

Now Putin has sent in the Chechen's though the war crimes could rack up

@huntersmum

Just had a look at Flightradar24 and now there are only two planes heading east into Russia. One from Frankfurt and one from Geneva and both executive type planes. What does that tell you. P

This is reassuring, thank you for sharing.

This might sound mental, but my internet searches are 1/2 days behind what’s actually happening. I’m struggling to get current news. I know Reddit and Twitter etc are being tampered with… but anyone else finding this?

Yes I'm finding the same

[quote vera99]When Nobel Prize-winning Noam Chomksy speaks I listen - his conclusion gives me cause for concern.

"Whatever one’s views on international affairs, it’s clear that we’ve left the domain of rational discourse far behind, and are moving into territory with an unattractive history, to put it mildly."

truthout.org/articles/us-approach-to-ukraine-and-russia-has-left-the-domain-of-rational-discourse/[/quote]
Chomsky has never won a Nobel Prize and that piece was written before Russia invaded Ukraine, so it's not especially relevant now.

@LetsGoDoDoDo What is reassuring? I'm struggling to understand @huntersmum 's post!

And yes, also finding my news on internet search not fully up to date.

Thanks @Sideorderofchips I feel like I’m going mad.

Something is happening.

Really? I just googled Ukraine news and got up to date stuff

@Scraggythang

This might sound mental, but my internet searches are 1/2 days behind what’s actually happening. I’m struggling to get current news. I know Reddit and Twitter etc are being tampered with… but anyone else finding this?

No.

My twitter feed is fine. I have it set to latest tweets which are within seconds of posting.

Are you sure you've not got it set to top tweets?

@katem98 I assumed this implies that government officials, representing EU member states are heading over to Russia for talks? This is a positive step... but then I am desperately clinging onto hope that this will be resolved positively and quickly .

I thought that to invade another sovereign state was in itself a war crime. The Americans do it all the time, but I suppose they never get prosecuted because they're a super power. I'm certainly no legal expert, so perhaps someone else can clarify.

Do to the policy of handing out guns to Ukrainian civilians and telling them to fight as though they were soldiers, it's likely that there will be many civilian deaths in due course.

@Scraggythang

Thanks *@Sideorderofchips* I feel like I’m going mad.

Something is happening.

Well that sounds a bit odd - can you give any more detail/or possibly an example @Scraggythang and @Sideorderofchips

I was hoping this was the case @LetsGoDoDoDo but didn't want to sound naive! Here's to hoping.

V.interesting analysis:
threadreaderapp.com/thread/1497993363076915204.html

Just checked and my Twitter feed seems ok.

@Greattimestroubledtimes

Can you links to the fight radar please

I’m following guardian, bbc and this reddit aggregator news feed
www.reddit.com/live/18hnzysb1elcs

Any other recommendations for live news?

I do wonder how our armed forces are looking at this and thinking about what defences we need? Is it more infantry, drones, tanks - this is supposed to be modern warfare but it still needs 'boots on the ground'

I know we have done armed forces reviews - will they be adapting them in light of what they see happening?

The drone strikes on the convoys seem particularly effective. I also wonder how the cyber warfare is going?

It’s very strange. I’m sat watching the news with a gin (Fuck it). but no news about internet blackouts (?) on any platform about this. But it’s getting weirder and weirder and I’ve been watching this for a long time. My fears are spiders, Putin, and bananas. I watch all those fuckers like a hawk.

I'm actually finding the television news channels really frustrating at the moment. You would think that 24 rolling news would give scope for more live reporting and more breaking news but the BBC and Sky seem wedded to set formats, repeat segments and zoom calls with people who write opinion pieces for online magazines. Twitter has more up-to-date information but also a shitload of dodgy and misleading stuff to wade through. I miss the days of Kate Adie.