Sandie Peggie vs NHS Fife Health Board and Dr Beth Upton, following Employment Tribunal judgment - thread #61

[nauticant]

Judgment was handed down on 8 December 2025:
https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/media/6936ce28a6fc97b81e57436a/S_Peggie_v_Fife_Health_Board__Dr_Upton.pdf

Sandie Peggie, a nurse at Victoria Hospital in Kirkcaldy (VH), brought claims in the employment tribunal against her employer; Fife Health Board (the Board) and another employee, Dr B Upton. Ms Peggie’s claims are of sexual harassment, harassment related to a protected belief, indirect discrimination and victimisation. Dr Upton claims to be a transwoman, that is observed as male at birth but asserting a female gender identity.

The Employment Tribunal hearing started on Monday 3 February 2025 and was expected to last 2 weeks. However, after 2 weeks it was not complete and it adjourned part-heard. It resumed on 16 July and the last day of evidence was 29 July 2025. It resumed again over 1 to 2 September for closing submissions.

Following handing down of the judgment on 8 December 2025, on 11 December 2025, it was announced by Sandie Peggie and her legal team that they would be pursuing an appeal.

The hearing was live tweeted by x.com/tribunaltweets and there's additional information here: tribunaltweets.substack.com/p/peggie-vs-fife-health-board-and-dr-005 and tribunaltweets.substack.com/p/peggie-vs-fife-health-board-and-dr-bd6.

Links to previous threads #1 to #60 can be found in this thread: mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5379717-sandie-peggie-list-of-threads-covering-employment-tribunal-and-afterwards

Thread 60: mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5461133-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-following-employment-tribunal-judgment-thread-60 16 December 2025 to 8 January 2026

Men who have sex with men (MSM) is a group that was first described back in the 90s before anyone invented “trans”. These are men who don’t think of themselves as gay but are happy to have another man give them a BJ etc Apparently it’s quite a large number.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Men_who_have_sex_with_men

Ever since I read about the Commissioner's decree that Fife hand over the documents, I swear I've heard the faint buzzing of a shredder working overtime, mingled with the clatter of "delete" keys being repeatedly pressed at warp speed.

I would lay good money on "administrative errors" meaning vital docs are no longer available when the deadline comes to pass.

If you think about Nick Wallis then you can see that he is very well placed to be covering this scandal.

He established himself as a journalist with authority as a result of his work in exposing the Post Office scandal.

What happened there was there there were miscarriages of justice on a vast scale and it became clear that the Post Office had one line of defence: the Horizon IT system is 100% reliable and has no bugs errors or defects. As things went on it was like some kind of cult formed around this assertion and eventually this became the leading article of faith that everyone who was "on-side" had to subscribe to.

This meant that when anything arose casting doubt on that, it needed to be suppressed as harshly as possible. If such a "threat" was embodied in a person, then the correct course of action was to destroy that person.

The result was that the Post Office was an unchallengeable monolith based on one false belief. The question was: What might it take to break through? The answer was a ground-breaking High Court decision followed by more damaging decisions that were soon representing an existential threat to the Post Office, whose total control of the situation had been lost.

I’m very glad he’s on board. I wish this was getting more traction though. I feel we have been winning hearts and minds for years now, yet still end up going backwards because those we are fighting have no morals whatsoever and are confident (with good reason) that they can break the law without consequences.

I hope Sandie’s new court dates come through without too much delay. I can’t imagine how it must feel to have your whole life on hold, or worse upended altogether. I expect she thought she was coasting towards retirement in a job she had done for years. Transactivism has ruined so many lives.

Re the Edinburgh school with the loos issue:

https://www.heraldscotland.com/news/26408903.scottish-ministers-ran-clock-school-toilet-law/

'Correspondence obtained by The Herald reveals that Scottish ministers delayed taking action on an emergency plea from a council embroiled in a court battle over single-sex toilets in a primary school until after Holyrood’s pre-election shutdown.
Campaigners branded the Scottish Government’s response “cowardly”, saying it left the council to fight the case alone under regulations widely acknowledged to be out of date.'

I was watching Sky News earlier, and they were covering an event in Leeds. I think it was martial arts and was attended by girls from all over the country.

The interviewer spoke to a primary school-aged girl and asked her why she took up the sport. And she said she was in the toilet at school and she told a boy who was leaving that he should wash his hands, and he spat at her 🙁 When she told her dad, he suggested self defence classes. My immediate thought was why was she having to use a mixed sex toilet at that age (she was about ten), as I thought they are single sex after reception age, but I bet there are schools like this all over the country that still have mixed sex designs.

It's most likely they would get a reprimand and a fine, which of course is payable by tax payers, not individuals. Prosecution is usually where an individual has profited - such as selling personal information.

Heads have to roll to achieve a clear out of these activists before any significant change. I can't see it happening yet in Scotland with SNP in control.

My immediate thought was why was she having to use a mixed sex toilet at that age (she was about ten), as I thought they are single sex after reception age, but I bet there are schools like this all over the country that still have mixed sex designs.

I went to primary school in the 1950s in a poor mining village. The toilets were outside and I don’t think there was anywhere to wash your hands. There were still separate toilets for girls and for boys, though. The need for that went without saying.
That shouldn’t have changed.

We had these. Tiny loos for the little ones, asbestos roofs. No washing facilities - it was the 1970s and a Victorian school.

I visited again a few years ago and they had enclosed a small outside square as part of the building and it was a unisex toilet with sinks etc for both sexes. But it was an infants school, so really young children. They go up to a junior school around 7/8.

But this was years before the trans indoctrination.

We had toilets like that at my infant school in the '60s, though separate for boys and girls. Basically, the loos were in a big wooden shed and I don't recall any hand washing facilities.

It's just not acceptable for junior school girls. Some girls in years 5 and 6 will already have started their periods.

It's a pity that the Dad didn't complain to the school as well - both about the lack of acceptable toilet provision and about the spitting.

Schools used to be very strict on segragating boys and girls. Lots of Victorian and later schools had separate entrances, with Boys and Girls incorporated into the brickwork above the entrances, and often the same in the outside toilet blocks. I wonder how come they had the common sense to know this was needed!!!

My primary school had that! Carved into the stone lintel above these old doorways, which weren't used any more.

That was certainly the case for me, and I remember having to smuggle the (extremely loud) sanitary towels into the school toilets and used to get some girls laughing and asking if I was 'eating sweets in there?' No sanitary bins so in my 8/9 yr old naivety, flushing them just hoping it would all go away. Similarly at secondary school, the only time I got detention was for leaving school grounds at lunchtime was to change my underwear after a leak.

In my role, I'm involved in some HR work, and I had to bite my tongue at a recent meeting where a male colleague proudly announced, "I don't know what the fuss is about gender neutral toilets, I've used them a lot and I've never felt unsafe". Yes, dear. We know. You're a man. Meanwhile for someone like myself, the thought of a male colleague hearing the same sanitary product opening, disposal, unwrapping the new one, etc, just feels such an extraordinary imposition into my personal space. It was bad enough with girls in my class, nevermind a male colleague within earshot.

Hahaha at that username.

@NaomiCunninghamHasHadHerWeetabixAgain , I sometimes read ‘Ask a Manager’ which recently has had people asking whether it’s appropriate to mention sanitary protection in front of men at work.

Although the person in charge says it is, it’s telling that women feel they need to ask. And yet we’re meant to be comfortable with male colleagues hearing the sounds of women using them.

NHS Scotland defied Supreme Court ruling to uphold trans policies

https://www.thetimes.com/article/5a56d5bc-506f-4019-96bb-1638808cecee?shareToken=8a7363aa7ec8545deea7e25232ab73f8

How much money are SNP wasting on this, FFS? And why?

The only thing I can come up with is the we want to be different to the rest of the UK.

I can't get why people still vote for them. The only reason they get into power is the opposition vote is split between Labour, tory, reform and lib-dem.

Well that's good-ish news for Dr Upton, I guess.

I wonder if that guidance influenced the testimonies of Fife witnesses who gave evidence after the SC judgment? I would love to see Lindsey Nicoll go rogue and do a tell-all story on how she was persuaded to completely humiliate herself in the service of the NHS Fife Board.

Is Lindsey Nicoll still there?! I mean, she reveals confidential information relating to a patient on a group WhatsApp and NHS Fife and NMC just seem fine with that. Jamie Doyle not suspending her without an investigation? Interesting what they think is important.

I've just seen this. Not sure whether anyone else has linked to it:

https://www.scottishdailyexpress.co.uk/news/politics/secretive-nhs-fife-hot-water-37481992#Echobox=1785163570

Poor Isla she could not have possibly predicted that she sounded like an absolute fucking twat, and that her lovely face would be plastered all over the press.

I doubt that Sandie would wish her any ill, unlike me.

She was extremely well paid. If you want a grown-up salary, you need to stop being a child.

£50-59k per year, if anyone is curious.

If you’re prepared to say aloud and under oath that you don’t know what sex you are, then unfortunately you have to expect derision. Her best plan will be to get married and name change…