"Darlington Nurses" vs County Durham and Darlington NHS Trust Tribunal Thread 4

[ThreeWordHarpy]

Thread 1, 7-Oct to 23-Oct; pre-hearing discussion, KD (day 1 of evidence) and BH (day 2).
Thread 2, 23-Oct to 28-Oct; BH (day 2), CH, JP, MG (day 3&4), TH, SS, ST, LL (day 4), JS, AT (day 5)
Thread 3, 28-Oct to 29-Oct, AT (day 5&6), TA (day 6)

Five nurses working at Darlington Memorial Hospital have filed a legal case suing their employer, an NHS trust, for sexual harassment and sex discrimination. The nurses object to sharing the women’s changing facilities with a male colleague, Rose, who identifies as female. The hearing started on October 20th, with evidence starting on October 22nd and is scheduled to last 3 weeks. To view the hearing online requests for access had to be made by October 17th. The hearing is being live tweeted by Tribunal Tweets who have background to this case on their substack. An alternative to X is to use Nitter: nitter.net/tribunaltweets or nitter.poast.org/tribunaltweets

The Judge made clear at the start of the public hearing on Day 1 that only TT or press have permission to tweet. If online observers see/hear something in the court that isn’t reported by TT, we don’t mention it until the next time there’s a break. This is a very cautious approach to avoid any accusations of “live reporting” on MN. Commentary on the content of TT tweets is fine as soon as they’re posted on X.

Key people:
C/Ns - Claimants, the Darlington nurses
R/T/Trust - Respondent, County Durham and Darlington NHS Foundation Trust
J/EJ – Judge/Employment Judge Seamus Sweeney
NF - Niazi Fetto KC, barrister for claimants
SC - Simon Cheetham, KC, barrister for respondents
RH - Rose Henderson, trans identifying nurse
CG – Clare Gregory, ward manager
SW - Sue Williams, NHS Trust HR
KD – Karen Danson, first claimant to give evidence.
BH – Bethany Hutchison, claimant
AH – Alistair Hutchison, husband of Bethany
CH – Carly Hoy, claimant
JP – Jane Peveller, claimant
MG – Mary Anne (aka Annice) Grundy, claimant
TH – Tracy Hooper, claimant
SS – Siobhan Sinclair, witness for the claimants, retired from Trust
ST – Sharron Trevarrow, witness for the claimants, retired from Trust, former housekeeper and wellbeing officer
LL – Lisa Lockey, claimant
JP – Professor Jo Phoenix, expert witness
JS – Jane Shields, witness for the claimants
AT - Andrew Thacker, witness for the respondents, NHS trust Head of HR
TA – Tracy Atkinson, witness for the respondents, NHS trust HR.

NF did you oversee any advice being given?
AM No
NF you say ‘I understand the matter had been resolved’. Do you have any understanding of what the resolution was?
AM No
NF then 2024 more issues arise . In a message sent to you, Ms Smedley says some exaggeration about Rose parading in underwear. Other email?
AM don’t recall

No.

Remember that Mitchell & Webb running sketch?

People like AM tried to explain what their job was to a pair of grannies - and if the grannies couldn't understand, it wasn't a real job!

TT

NF did you oversee any advice being given?
AM No
NF you say ‘I understand the matter had been resolved’. Do you have any understanding of what the resolution was?
AM No
NF then 2024 more issues arise . In a message sent to you, Ms Smedley says some exaggeration about Rose parading in underwear. Other email?
AM don’t recall

NF so this was the second time you became aware of problems. Did you look into it?
AM No
NF did you see what advice Ms Bailey gave at this point? Did you have any input , analyse or approve?
AM no

@AmaryllisNightAndDay YES! Thanks so much. The number of times I have tried and failed to find that. WooHoo!

Can anyone tell me what the expression is on the judges face at this point?

NF so this was the second time you became aware of problems. Did you look into it?
AM No
NF did you see what advice Ms Bailey gave at this point? Did you have any input , analyse or approve?
AM no

A series of resounding 'no's - I'd love to know his demeanour as he's saying no.

Camera only on witness

NF your title is Head of Workforce Experience what’s the difference to others?

AM a range including talent management and including EDI.

Talent management, FFS. It's a hospital, not a theatrical agents. (And clearly there's very little talent to manage.)

Also they all missed the day when the curiosity gene was handed out

The judge's face only appears very occasionally and isn't on display in this part.

That guidance was wrong though.

NF ms Bailey says here ‘long term solution should be different’.
AM that should go to workplace management. Through the chain.
NF then 6 weeks on, employees taking collective action. Had they not done that, would any action had been taken

Crucial question!

That’s what I’ve been shouting out loud here. What are the discernible outputs for his position? What wouldn’t happen if he didn’t bother turning up for work??

Maybe they misunderstood about people going to the theatre wearing revealing gowns...

Missed an hour or so. Just logged back in to the tribunal to see another red faced chap looking uncomfortable- Who he?

and his answer was in the negative.

If nothing else, these ETs are a great source of evidence as to why whole swathes of NHS management could be axed with no discernible different to patient care. My blood was already boiling because of the terrible treatment these 26 nurses have been subjected to, but just watching the sheer incompetence of these HR fools has got me fuming. What the * do they do all day?!

TT

NF ms Bailey says here ‘long term solution should be different’.
AM that should go to workplace management. Through the chain.
NF then 6 weeks on, employees taking collective action. Had they not done that, would any action had been taken.

NF you were copied in to email chain. 28 March Ms Atkinson writing about a letter, and then your next involvement later April about need to organise a meeting. Which you didn’t attend.
AM I didn’t in the end

NF you were copied in to email chain. 28 March Ms Atkinson writing about a letter, and then your next involvement later April about need to organise a meeting. Which you didn’t attend.
AM I didn’t in the end

NF doing a good job here of turning the screw. Or ratcheting up. Or something like that!

So AM also received the 'exaggeration about Rose parading in underwear' from Smedley. What a totally neutral way to phrase it to, it would seem, several people along the chain.

The mind boggles at the fact this is preceded by AM's understanding of the 'matter being resolved' in 2023. Wasn't the whole argument that there was no official matter* to resolve then, according to the Trust?

*grievance, complaint, process, whatever

It was the same in my old NHS place - 5 other staff networks¹ set up before the women's one.

¹ Including a 'climate and environment network', which is hardly a protected characteristic. They also tried initially to palm women off with a group only for women who wanted to progress into management, rather than all female employees.

I don’t know who he was referring to, but if ‘she’ was heavily involved in the Strategic Equality & Diversity Group, she’s probably a buffoon.

He's another Andrew - what is it with Andrews and women?? - I 'can't recall' his surname, he's Head of Workforce Experience.
edited out random asterisks

Moore!